Subject: RE: Bobby Sands >From: InOBU >Date: 30-Dec-99 - 04:30 PM > >Hi Dave: Can you give cites for the facts you allege? >The plane fact is I can give cite to my facts.

Oh? where?

On to some facts of my own:

Fay, Morrisey and Smith give the total number of people killed in the troubles as 3601. Oh, and Big Mick, Republican paramilitaires were responsible for 2001 of these deaths. The IRA were responsbile for 85% (1684) of these. Loyalist Paramilitaries were responsible for 983 deaths. The rest were miscellaneous or are attributed to the various security forces. The amount of civilians killed by the IRA was 713, or nearly half of their total, and almost as many as the loyalists. Some freedom fighters eh? Not to mention the case of Patrick Gillespie, a catholic civilian, who in 1990 was strapped into a bomb laden vehicle and forced to drive to an army checkpoint, where the Provos detonated it via remote control, with Mr Gillespie still strapped into the car, blowing him and five soldiers to bits.

The facts of the matter are that the IRA, other republican paramilitaries, and the loyalist paramilitaries are scum, and no amount of glorification of it by their apologists can change this. It is they who have plagued and oppressed the people of Ireland and Britain over the last thirty years.

>Please be so good as to get to a law library and >look up the first decision in the extradition case of IRA Volunteer Joseph Doherty. You will >find that the facts you allege were raised by the British government who held that he could be >extradicted to Britain in violation of the Political Offense Exemption to Extradition, on the >grounds that he was a member of a terrorist organisation. Judge Sprizzo, a concervative >American judge, after a lenthy factual inquest, found that the British aligation that the IRA >is a terrorist organization could not be up held in light of the facts, presented by two >American lawyers, (neither of them Irish by the way). That decision was appealed and apealed >again and was upheld in every court. In fact he never was extradicted. Rudolph Juliani, the >present mayor of NY, then a prosicutor, used a cold war act giving special power to the >executive branch of governemnt (president) to deport in the national interst. As with many >cold war acts, he could do so without defining that interest, so Dohertys deportation was >accomplished in spite of a prima facie showing for political asylum had been accepted and >stood up to apeals. No reason was ever given why it was in Americas interest. In short, in >every weighing of fact, IN COURT, the IRA was seen by an independant judicery to be NOT A >TERRORIST organisation.

Oh come on. If the IRA are not a terrorist organisation then please tell me why they are illegal in both the ROI and the UK? Or tell us about the terrorists that *have* been deported from the US.

> I dont falt the British people for not knowing this in light of >extrodinary powers to censor the press. But, if you have an interst in the truth, to almost >quote Hamlet, Get thee to a law library.

Oh right. So that's it. So your good self who lives thousands of miles away knows the truth, whereas our poor selves who actually live in the British Isles are the ones who are

I think you are the one who is delusional. After all, it is people like you who are indirectly and directly responsible for years of violence in *my* country.

The facts of the matter is that republicanism has pratically NO mandate from the people of ireland, north and south, something like 95% of the people of Ireland, North and South, have rejected terrorism, and that they have also decided that it is up to the people of NI alone to decide their future.

>All the best, Dave, Happy and PEACEFUL! New Year, >your friend in controversy >Larry

How do you square wishing me a peaceful new year with your support of illegal terrorist organisations? Ones who committed atrocities like Enniskillen, The Shankill, Warrenpoint, and many others?

Anyway, I do hope you have a happy festive season (or what's left of it), and in the coming year you devote your energies into purely *peaceful* areas which do good for all the people of NI, GB and the ROI.

Regards, Dave