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User Name Thread Name Subject Posted
GUEST,Big Mick Jane Fonda's exploits, please read (95* d) RE: Jane Fonda's exploits, please read 08 Dec 00

"When will they ever learn?......when will they ever learn......"

Those of you kicking Banjer need to do some research.......he is one of our finest Mudcatters, who happens to hold strong views.....based on experience.........with regard to this conflict. He and I don't necessarily agree on this issue, but he is a fine man and a great Mudcatter.

To those from other countries that choose to use every opportunity you can to tell us poor colonials what is wrong with us......and further to tell us we don't really understand about "the troubles", or our motives, or whatever........I suggest that you follow your own advice. There are no easy answers with regard to this conflict, or this period in World History. We are in denial? Maybe. Any more so than the English Government is about the north of Ireland? I don't think so. And Dresden has already been mentioned. How about Japan and the Korean "comfort women"? Aussies and the Aboriginals? Shall we go on? The point is ..............give it a break, willya? Jane Fonda was, during that time, the same as many of us. She was faced with a situation that was beyond her frame of reference. There we were, raised by WWII vets, on a steady diet of 50's era patriotism and jingoism, with the implicit understanding that we had to save the world if called upon. Our parents taught us that our job was to preserve and export "the American Way of life" to the great unwashed. We were to help "those people" so that, God Bless 'Em, they could be like us. Then comes the conflict and it is nothing like what we had been raised for. No clear cut issue, no Normandy Beachhead, no Gold Star Mom's, no parades coming home, no exit strategy..........and folks calling us baby killers, etc. Some folks sucked it up and went off, even if they had reservations. Some folks resisted. Some left the country. The point is everyone made decisions. Do I like what Fonda did? No, in fact I hate the actions she took, even if I agreed that we needed to get out. But Jane Fonda, to me, was a tool. She was being used. One of the things that old age, and a lifetime spent in several "movements" has taught me is that whether you are on the right, or on the left, there is always some messiah like figure who has an agenda. They have become easy for me to spot, usually by there rhetoric. They are the ones who use "for the good of the cause" to justify any type of action that needs to be done in their opinion. I have learned that, as followers, we have the greatest obligation of all. Because we are the ones to listen to this and make a judgement if the action is indeed "for the good of the cause" or if it is for the good of the messiah like person. We choose who to follow. In the first half of the twentieth century there were two leaders. Both had charisma. Both could cause masses of people to do their bidding by simply suggesting that it be done for the common good. Both suffered for their positions. One was named Hitler, and the other was named Ghandi.

I guess the point of this ramble is to say to Banjer........Brother, it is time to let it go. So much pain.......let it go. She was a kid herself, and being manipulated. And I think she knows it. And I guess I would say to those that would villify Banjer and the U.S. in general.......Brothers and Sisters, let it go. Too much pain..........let it go. Our nation, in the relative age of the world, is just a kid. We have done much good.....and much bad........but our heart is right, we are your cousins......and this place(the Internet and the Mudcat) makes us close. Let's cut the finger pointing bullshit, and just examine the history of the world we live in, for the lessons it has to teach. And continue to strive for, even if unattainable, peace, and understanding. The children of this place deserve that we act so.

Big Mick

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