BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Teribus
Date: 20 Apr 04 - 06:34 AM

Thanks for the link Re: the North Korean Intell, that you find so believable Amos.

Does that include the following from that article?

Statement 1:
Pyongyang insists it will freeze its nuclear weapons drive only in return for rewards from the United States.

Statement 2:
North Korea "has no idea of dealing with the US any longer if the latter insists on the disgusting CVID (complete, verifiable, and irreversible dismantling)," he said.

Both indicate the extent of the "midget's turd" (KIJ's own description of himself by the way) threat posture to the world. Statement 1 summed up in one word - BLACKMAIL.

Everybody quite happy and content about that - I certainly wouldn't be - Statement 2 summed up in an old saying, "Pay the Danegeld, you never get rid of the Dane". What CVID, of our nuclear programme - don't be ridiculous! we might want to Blackmail you some more at some time in the future.

Subject: North Korean Intelligence Gets it Right for Once..
From: Amos
Date: 19 Apr 04 - 11:20 PM

It seems the North Korean Intell is a little quicker than our own this time.

A

Subject: George and the Amazing Technicolor Dream-Tie
From: Amos
Date: 19 Apr 04 - 12:41 AM

A refreshing and sharp-witted article concerning George's press conference


A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 19 Apr 04 - 12:38 AM

A compelling description of the effect of Bushthink on the quality of life in Iraq can be found in this article from the New Statesman. Enjoy.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 07:58 PM

From Salon:

“We should have had orange or red-type of alert in June or July of 2001”

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 07:25 PM

The NEw York TImes is feeling the tug back from the brink of Neocon mania: see this article which is actually critical of the adminsitration's low regard ofr truth.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: GUEST,guest from NW
Date: 28 Mar 04 - 01:24 AM

dougR, i answered your query on the condi rice thread within hours. i cited a documented bush lie on march 22 after your statement on 22 Mar 04 - 05:57 PM and asked for your comment. does this staement count as a lie from your perspective? if not, why not?

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: GUEST,guest from NW
Date: 26 Mar 04 - 07:47 PM

hey, dougR, i cited an actual bush lie a few days ago. it's in print and on videotape. i stuck with just one lie to keep things simple. any comment on that?

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 26 Mar 04 - 11:23 AM

A short excerpt:

The commission is encouraging the country to consider questions the administration has never wanted asked. Why did these attacks happen on its watch? Could the government have done more to prevent them? Were intelligence warnings given short shrift? What was the administration thinking about on Sept. 10, 2001, and in the months before? And, yes, might the president not usefully express some remorse over any of these failures?

What's important is that the country is being pushed away from an empty debate over who is "tough" and who is "soft" to a substantive discussion of what our government might practically have done -- and can now do -- to stop terrorism.



A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 26 Mar 04 - 08:52 AM

On the embarassment of the Bushies by Clarke's apology, see "Democracy's Revenge".

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Mar 04 - 02:50 PM

Doug - Is it your assertion that GWB has been entirely truthful throughout his campaign for, and occupation of, the Presidency?

____yes

____no

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: el ted
Date: 25 Mar 04 - 11:52 AM

Brilliant! This is second 100th post today. Carry on with whatever it was you were talking about.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 25 Mar 04 - 09:20 AM

I got this humorous bit from an avid Bush supporter:

You know, they've released John Hinckley from prison for unsupervised visits to his parents’ home on weekends. This is such a nice letter from the President:

THE WHITE HOUSE WASHINGTON D.C.

Mr. John Hinckley
St. Elizabeth's Hospital
Washington, DC

Dear John:

Laura and I hope that you are continuing your excellent progress in recovery from your mental problems. We were pleased to hear that you are now able to have unsupervised visits with your parents. The staff at the hospital reports that you are doing fine.

I have decided to seek a second term in office as your president and I would appreciate your support and the support of your fine parents.

I would hope that if there is anything that you need at the hospital, you would let us know.

By the way, are you aware that John Kerry is screwing Jody Foster?!

Sincerely,

George W. Bush, President

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 24 Mar 04 - 05:59 PM

The article was " Bush's difficult relationship with reality" by William Saletan, Doug; and the magazine was of course Slate. As to the earlier post, I can't speak for the writer's background, but as he is expressing a popular view of Bush's credibility I thought it appropriate to include it here.   What is your problem with it exactly?

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Peace
Date: 24 Mar 04 - 05:53 PM

Doug,

Your support of Bush is admirable. I wouldn't call him a liar; he simply has no commerce with truth as most people understand it.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: DougR
Date: 24 Mar 04 - 05:42 PM

Amos: you offer David Corn and "The Nation" as proof that Bush is a liar? You're kidding, right?

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 24 Mar 04 - 10:16 AM

Here an interesting analysis of why Bush's statements seem so out of touch with the facts over and over, by Wm Saletan writing for Salte magazine online.

From this perspective it is only a lie if you don't believe it!

It still adds up to "unqualified" in my opinion.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: GUEST,Clint Keller
Date: 23 Mar 04 - 04:02 AM

"A lie is only a lie when it is PROVEN to be one."

Wrong. A lie is a lie when you knowingly say something false.

If it's not proven, it just means you got away with the lie.

When it's proven to be a lie is when you got caught.

The latest Republican morality, is it? - it's only a lie if you get caught?

clint

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 22 Mar 04 - 07:50 PM

DougR:

I am sorry but I think a large number of lies have been proven. The first and foremost was the lies of the Florida election machine, and it declines from there.

Here is just one writeup out of many. Here's an excerpt:

"George W. Bush is a liar. He has lied large and small, directly and by omission. His Iraq lies have loomed largest. In the run-up to the invasion, Bush based his case for war on a variety of unfounded claims that extended far beyond his controversial uranium-from-Niger assertion. He maintained that Saddam Hussein possessed "a massive stockpile" of unconventional weapons and was directly "dealing" with Al Qaeda--two suppositions unsupported then (or now) by the available evidence. He said the International Atomic Energy Agency had produced a report in 1998 noting that Iraq was six months from developing a nuclear weapon; no such report existed (and the IAEA had actually reported then that there was no indication Iraq had the ability to produce weapons-grade material). Bush asserted that Iraq was "harboring a terrorist network, headed by a senior Al Qaeda terrorist planner"; US intelligence officials told reporters this terrorist was operating ouside of Al Qaeda control. And two days before launching the war, Bush said, "Intelligence gathered by this and other governments leaves no doubt that the Iraq regime continues to possess and conceal some of the most lethal weapons ever devised." Yet former deputy CIA director Richard Kerr, who is conducting a review of the prewar intelligence, has said that intelligence was full of qualifiers and caveats, and based on circumstantial and inferential evidence. That is, it was not no-doubt stuff. And after the major fighting was done, Bush declared, "We found the weapons of mass destruction." But he could only point to two tractor-trailers that the CIA and the Defense Intelligence Agency had concluded were mobile bioweapons labs. Other experts--including the DIA's own engineering experts--disagreed with this finding. "

Thos os just a small scraping from his foul deposits. His history is a carpet of large and small lies woven together in a comfortable web of convenient deception.

He has the moral fiber of a ringworm.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: GUEST,guest from NW
Date: 22 Mar 04 - 06:42 PM

"We found the weapons of mass destruction. We found biological laboratories. You remember when Colin Powell stood up in front of the world, and he said, Iraq has got laboratories, mobile labs to build biological weapons. They're illegal. They're against the United Nations resolutions, and we've so far discovered two. And we'll find more weapons as time goes on. But for those who say we haven't found the banned manufacturing devices or banned weapons, they're wrong, we found them."
Source: Interview of the President by TVP, Poland, White House (5/29/2003).

dougR, would you consider this annotated quote from GWB a lie? let me highlight the parts to especially consider...

..."We found the weapons of mass destruction"..."But for those who say we haven't found the banned manufacturing devices or banned weapons, they're wrong, we found them."

waddaya think?

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: DougR
Date: 22 Mar 04 - 05:57 PM

Nope, Amos, I wouldn't accuse you of being "old fashioned." Liberal, yes, but not necessarily old fashioned.

A lie is only a lie when it is PROVEN to be one. To date, the lies Bush is accused of are only lies because the accuser believes them to be.

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 22 Mar 04 - 12:42 AM

A presentation concerning the influence of Katherine Harris and the STate of FLorida shenanigans.

It would be highly entertaining except that it actually happened.

Maybe I am oldfashioned, but I believe sending one American to his death, or disenfranchising one human being unnecessarily, is anathema, hateful, to be avoided at all costs.. Mebbe that's just me.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 16 Mar 04 - 05:32 PM

And another thread on another dimension of what can only be termed political fraud.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 16 Mar 04 - 03:40 PM

Here's a link to Holy Willie's Prayer, and also to its sequel Holy Willie's Epitaph.

I can't see that there's anything out-of-line in pointing a contradiction between sounding off too loudly about the overriding importance of the institution of marriage, and yet being somewhat flexible about it in private life.

It's the kind of thing that was just up Holy Willie's street. The point being, when we expect other people to accept our own failings, we should be willing to accept theirs as well.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 16 Mar 04 - 03:19 PM

Further on the Bush Machine's Lies About Medicare front:

Washington Times story

New York Times Story with the following awesome introductory lines:

"An Orwellian taint is emerging in the Bush administration's big victory last year in wringing the Medicare prescription drug subsidy from a balky Congress. The plan is being sold to the public through propagandistic ads disguised as TV news reports, and it turns out the government's top Medicare actuary was muzzled by superiors during the debate about the program's price tag."

Lies may be easy to find, but they are a royal pain to combat.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Deda
Date: 16 Mar 04 - 02:58 PM

Go, bro! Here are some reinforcements.
About truth and lies in the Pentagon. (Rather long but worth printing and reading.)
Lies about Medicare cost.

Actually, finding press report about Bush administration lies is like shooting fish in a barrel. There are so many, it's no sport at all.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 16 Mar 04 - 01:02 PM

In keeping with local policy I try to constrain myself to posting links and excerpts, Doug. Sure, I choose things that align with my POV -- why the hell would I do otherwise? But let me tell you what that point of view is. I think a lot of lies and manipulation have occurred under the direct or indirect control of the Bush machine; and I think by and large that those lies and manipulations have done more harm than good to the nation and the world. I think they have used perfectly sound ideals in false and hollow ways and done everything in their power to do what they want, rather than seek truth and right action. I am embarassed to be associated through citizenship with Rove, Bush, Cheny, Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz.

So forgive me if I try to offset this little wave of evildoing in the world. We do what we can.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: DougR
Date: 16 Mar 04 - 12:55 PM

Amos: whatever would we do without your constantly posting articles from publications you discover on the Internet that support your POV? One would think we did not have access to the Internet, newspapers and none of us owned TV sets. I'm sure you don't believe such postings, particularly in publications that present views contrary to our own, will change minds do you?
:>)
DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 16 Mar 04 - 12:19 PM

In other news, an editorial lambasting the Bush administrations coverup, misrepresentation and plain deceit on Medicare issues can be found on this page.

Enjoy.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 16 Mar 04 - 12:17 PM

Well, maybe you're right that listing all those divorces was inappropriate -- and in all humility, T., I don't know the details. It is perhaps arrogant and wrong-headed to take it on myself to meddle in the private affairs of people who probably were dealing with difficult situations as well as anyone else could; I should trust our own citizens to manage their own lives without my interference and niggling about it. I apologize for the cheap shots by listing their failures in public. I was meddling in their private lives. And that is wrong.

It is possible the same policies apply to any citizens regardless of their sexual grain, I would add.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Teribus
Date: 16 Mar 04 - 11:51 AM

OK Amos,

Do you know the personal circumstances involved in the break-up of the marriages you thought fit to have a cheap shot with?

Rhetorical question because I don't for one second believe that you do.

The reasons and circumstances probably are many and varied, in most the decision to divorce was probably arrived at by mutual arrangement for the best as viewed by both partners. But you don't seem to be that prepared to give people the benefit of the doubt, particularly if you can manage to get in a snide dig at the same time - grow up you're old enough!!

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 16 Mar 04 - 11:08 AM

Teribus:

I think you're babbling.

What are you trying to say underneath all that sarcasm?

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Teribus
Date: 16 Mar 04 - 11:01 AM

Amos - 02 Mar 04 - 10:30 PM

Oh St. Amos - would that we could all be as perfect as you.

Give you a tip - introduction to Scotland's national poet Robert Burns - first poem to read - Holly Wullies Prayer.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 16 Mar 04 - 10:09 AM

I am pleased to see that the New York TImes, bastion of conservative thought, has begun to giove voice to critical thoughts about Bush and Co.

Today they offer a critique from Hans Blix on the duplicity behind the arms inspections.

It can be found here. Enjoy!

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 02 Mar 04 - 10:30 PM

Marriage history of public figures who feel that gays will destroy the
institution of Marriage

Food for thought:

*Ronald Reagan - divorced the mother of two of his children to marry Nancy
Reagan who bore him a daughter only 7 months after the marriage.

*Bob Dole - divorced the mother of his child, who had nursed him through the
long recovery from his war wounds.

*Newt Gingrich - divorced his wife who was dying of cancer.

*Dick Armey - House Majority Leader - divorced

*Sen. Phil Gramm of Texas - divorced

*Gov. John Engler of Michigan - divorced

*Gov. Pete Wilson of California - divorced

*George Will - divorced

*Sen. Lauch Faircloth - divorced

*Rush Limbaugh - Rush and his current wife Marta have six marriages and
four divorces between them.

*Rep. Bob Barr of Georgia - Barr, not yet 50 years old, has been married
three times. Barr had the audacity to author and push the "Defense of
Marriage Act." The current joke making the rounds on Capitol Hill is "Bob
Barr...WHICH marriage are you defending?!?

*Sen. Alfonse D'Amato of New York - divorced

*Sen. John Warner of Virginia - divorced (once married to Liz Taylor.)

*Gov. George Allen of Virginia - divorced

*Henry Kissinger - divorced

*Rep. Helen Chenoweth of Idaho - divorced

*Sen. John McCain of Arizonia - divorced

*Rep. John Kasich of Ohio - divorced

*Rep. Susan Molinari of New York - Republican National Convention Keynote
Speaker - divorced

Don't let homosexuals destroy the institution of marriage?!?! The
"Christian" "Do-as-I-say, not-as-I-do" Republicans are doing a fine job
without anyone's help!!

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Bobert
Date: 02 Mar 04 - 06:52 PM

Well, Doug, we're doing it for you, pal... We hate to do it but we know how much it means to ya'....

Hey, put Cindy on the board to give us a progress (pun iintended) report...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Mar 04 - 05:22 PM

Nice of you to include the "unbiased" comments of Bush's former college professor Amos.

Just tuned into this thread again to see if you folks were still having fun. Obviouvly you are! Does my old heart good.

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 02 Mar 04 - 08:11 AM

He has ruined more lives singlehanded than anyone since that AUstrian paperhanger fellow....Schickelgruber, I think it was. Anyway, it is high time someone stopped this fellow from messing things up even more.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Walking Eagle
Date: 02 Mar 04 - 02:50 AM

I just know that Bush has started to piss off the hunting and fishing folks. That includes me. Everyone from the Izak Walton League to Trout and Ducks unlimited is starting to sqawk. Reason? Bushes hell bent for leather attempts to drill, mine, and log some of the nation's most productive breeding and spawning areas. In other words, places where the hunters and fishing folks go. Backwoods wilderness areas where hunting and fishing is allowed mostly because hunters and fishing folks have to backpack in for about two days before reaching these prime spots.

The heck with the second ammendment. Who is going to need hunting rifles if there is nothing to hunt.

Yeah, I'm a rifle totin' radically liberal Cherokee mama!

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Bobert
Date: 01 Mar 04 - 08:40 PM

Well, gol danged, Amos! I thought I had a low opinion of the Bush administration. Geeze, compared to Bush's former Harvard professor, I'm closer to DougR.... Danged....

Jus' funnin...

But, boy oh boy...

McKinley/Rove? Well, ahhh, yeah. I was listening to this guy on NPR today who called in to talkabout his experiences in Haiti and what he described is what I fear will become of the US... It may be too late to turn it around now that Boss Hog is laying waste to the labor movement much like Sherman burned the South to the ground...

Just today the grocery workers out in your area settled on a "two tiered" program that will be a tamplate for other unions. In essence the "two tiered" program provides fir the current workers to be able to maintain their pay and health benefits (no increases) while allowing for new hires to work for less with less benefits... Think Social Security here. "We're not going to cut any current retirees or those getting ready to retire but................"

Now Boss Hog is going to drag out his anti-human, anti-God, anti-anti "Personal Responsibility" CRAP! Translated, "Personal Respnsibility" means "I'm rich and you ain't! Get over it!"...

Yeah, welcome to America. The world's next Third World nation with 1% controlling 99% of the wealth. Just like Haiti.

I wish some other country would just come and take Mr. Bush off to Africa so he could live out his days with the rest of the bad guys...

And take the rest of the ruling class wid him, thank you...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 01 Mar 04 - 08:12 PM

A very interesting discussion on Bush's worldview by one of his college professors can be found on this page.

Regards,

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: dianavan
Date: 23 Feb 04 - 12:08 AM

Gareth - Its also going door to door in you neighborhood to see if anyone needs a ride to the polling station, especially the elderly or offering to babysit for the single mom so she can run out and vote.

Put those SUV's to work!

d

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 11:27 PM

Correction to the link -- the original article can be found on this page.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 11:25 PM

From the New York Times:

Uses and Abuses of Science




Published: February 23, 2004


lthough the Bush administration is hardly the first to politicize science, no administration in recent memory has so shamelessly distorted scientific findings for policy reasons or suppressed them when they conflict with political goals. This is the nub of an indictment delivered last week by more than 60 prominent scientists, including 20 Nobel laureates. Their statement was accompanied by a report published by the Union of Concerned Scientists, listing cases where the administration has manipulated science on environmental and other issues.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 28 Jan 04 - 07:39 PM

An urgent appeal to those who are in a position to do anything with it, from Daniel Ellsburg, who demonstrated his own kind of courage, can be found in this article in the Guardian entitled "Leak Against This War".

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Walking Eagle
Date: 26 Jan 04 - 07:36 PM

Reading all of this puts me in mind of what my mom said during the 2000 elections. She said that she thought that Bush was likeable, someone you would like to go to a football game with. But in her mind, that was it. Not someone to be our president.

Keep in mind that Pres. Bush was not elected the first time, he was appointed.

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 26 Jan 04 - 07:19 PM

But don't forget, they'll have a lot of electronic voting systems this time, which should make it easier getting the desired result, when it comes to counting anyway..

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Bobert
Date: 26 Jan 04 - 05:01 PM

Well, Dougie, you know how I distrust polls but since you've gone and thrown yers out, what do you think of Kerry 49 Bush 46 with 5 undecided? And that was on Fox news at noon today...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: Amos
Date: 26 Jan 04 - 04:29 PM

The word popular in this sense means views held among the population at large; it includes conservative, liberal, illiberal and reactionary.

Most of the Bush camp holds views in the latter two catego9ries.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Popular Views of the Bush Administration
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 26 Jan 04 - 04:14 PM

Most people don't see it that way, Doug, even if maybe most people in the USA do.