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BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia,
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 04 Nov 09 - 12:31 PM erbert, We cross threaded. You are right, at least in the coherent part of your post, but I was merely responding to Don's post, and clarifying to Ebbie's. But I agree, as stated before, let's stay on topic, though my response to Don was. The clarification was just that, a clarification...GfS In the course of my clarification, it underlined, even better than I originally stated, about mixing the hypocrisy found in religious world, into the hypocrisy of the political world, and actually agreeing with Don(can it be??). That being said, and a little off topic, so I won't dwell on it much more in this thread, let's not confuse 'religion' with the spiritual, nor let's not confuse politics with truth!!!..GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 04 Nov 09 - 12:18 PM Ebbie:Leaven of Herod or Herodians > Mar 8:15 And he charged them, saying, Take heed, beware of the leaven of the Pharisees, and of the leaven of Herod. Mar 12:13 And they send unto him certain of the Pharisees and of the Herodians, to catch him in his words. Matthew 22:15-16 Then went the Pharisees, and took counsel how they might entangle him in his talk. 16. And they sent out unto him their disciples with the Herodians, saying, Master, we know that thou art true, and teachest the way of God in truth, neither carest thou for any man: for thou regardest not the person of men. Mat 22:18 But Jesus perceived their wickedness, and said, Why tempt ye me, ye hypocrites? Herod was descended from a family of Edomites - his mother was a Samaritan. Appointed by Rome, he was not a Jew but became ruler or king over the Jews, and made religion part of the state. It is reported that many Jews did not accept Herod as the legitimate king, because he was not from the lineage of David, and was appointed by Rome. You are correct, the line was not Caesar, but Herod, appointed by Caesar, from Rome. It still represents the political hypocrisy, of which I was referring. But, Thank you for pointing that out! I mistakenly quoted the study notes, on the subject...but not the meaning. P.S. I was about to blast away, but I think you can see that I held fire before I checked it out...but as I said before, it does not change the meaning. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: GUEST,erbert Date: 04 Nov 09 - 11:51 AM ok, now we've reached the point in the 'debate' when folk are searching for relevant quotes in the Bible... I might as well refer to an equally useful and much more contemporary source of contemplations on socio-cultural mores and received wisdom.. "sickipedia" "My neighbours just found out that I'm on the sex offenders list and have demanded that I move out of the area as they fear that I am a danger to their son. Their son? I'm a paedophile, I'm not gay." |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: Ebbie Date: 04 Nov 09 - 11:28 AM Just for the record, GtS, your own biases taint your reportage. Jesus is not quoted as saying: Beware the leaven of the Pharisees and of Caesar. It is your own agenda that made you bring in politics. Don't you think your credibility would improve if you stuck to truth? |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: Don(Wyziwyg)T Date: 04 Nov 09 - 10:57 AM ""Fair enough Bill, I accept what you say up to a point, but I didn't say anyone here is not opposed to the abuse of children. I simply said that most were more concerned with defending homosexuals than in expressing sympathy for the abused."" NOPE! The following is what you said:- ""Isn't it strange that we have had no comment on this from our resident promoters of homosexuality!"" I see no reference to the children, no reference to sympathy, in fact, no reference to abuse except indirectly. The single reference is to fictional "resident promoters of homosexuality." You throw out argumentative comment with the firm intention of provoking exactly the response you get. You would have NO hesitation in naming another who did that as a troll, so what else would YOU call yourself? I can't be bothered any more with dealing with single issue nutcases who ignore evidence, deny fact, and scream about everybody else's life instead of getting a life themselves. Good luck with it, matey, beat your brains out. It's your funeral. Don T. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: John P Date: 04 Nov 09 - 10:25 AM McGrath: It is inevitable that when a leading member of a community is convicted of sexually abusing children, including in this case a baby, that will be seen as reflecting on the whole community. That applies just as much when the community involved is the gay community as it does when it is a religious community. (And vice versa, of course.) And it is inevitable that it will get used as ammunition by people who for other reasons are hostile. There is a big difference between these two examples. The Catholic Church, as an organization, conspired to keep known pedophiles from being prosecuted. LOTS of bishops and cardinals were knowingly complicit in protecting the perverts. That's why many of us think this reflects badly on the whole organization. The mainstream gay organizations, on the other hand, find child rape as abhorrent as the rest of us. I'm amazed that any child raper would be so stupid as to belong to an organization that promotes child rape. I'm shocked that he wasn't caught a long time ago. Maybe the police up there in Scotland are as stupid as the perverts. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: kendall Date: 04 Nov 09 - 07:16 AM Old Jewish saying, "Everyone needs a dog to kick." |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: Gervase Date: 04 Nov 09 - 07:07 AM Ah. Having just found what may be a snap of young Ake carelessly left online, this may go some way to explaining why he worries about unwanted attention. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: M.Ted Date: 04 Nov 09 - 06:50 AM Here's an article that discussesFacts about Homosexuality and Child Molestation This is point is established in the article: " many child molesters don't really have an adult sexual orientation. They have never developed the capacity for mature sexual relationships with other adults, either men or women. Instead, their sexual attractions focus on children – boys, girls, or children of both sexes." Another interesting fact is that only a relatively small minority of the population believe a Akenaton does. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: Gervase Date: 04 Nov 09 - 05:29 AM As a large section of the population share my views That doesn't make them right. A large section of the population believes that Saddam Hussein was responsible for September 11th. A large section of the population believes that there is no human factor in climate change. A large section... I could go on. *yawn* Akenaton; you clearly have unresolved issues involving sexuality. You really should seek some sort of help. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: kendall Date: 04 Nov 09 - 04:53 AM All Indians walk single file. How do I know? Because I saw an Indian once and he was walking single file.So, I must believe my own eyes. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: Lox Date: 04 Nov 09 - 04:43 AM "From: GUEST Date: 04 Nov 09 - 04:17 AM I find it strange that Ake didn't comment sooner.. " ROFL |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: manitas_at_work Date: 04 Nov 09 - 04:11 AM The Times is local to the UK, but why should you think that it's strange that no one commented before you? Did it make the Egyptian papers, btw? |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: akenaton Date: 04 Nov 09 - 03:42 AM Sorry Jim....I had a response typed, but it seems to have got lost en route. I'm just off to work so I've no time to re-print. You make an interesting point so I'll get back later...apologies Ake |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: akenaton Date: 04 Nov 09 - 03:37 AM |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: Jim Carroll Date: 04 Nov 09 - 03:23 AM "My views on the fostering of young children by male homosexuals...." What are those views? There has been an ongoing investigation here in Ireland and elsewhere into the paedophelia practiced by members of the church on children placed in their care (on a massive scale and stretching back many decades) and the covering up of the rape and sexual and physical abuse that has been proven to have taken place, by leading members of the church. Do you believe that all church officers (or all Catholics, or maybe all Christians, for that matter) are (potential or practicing) paedophiles and should be prohibited from fostering young children - if not, why not? Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: akenaton Date: 04 Nov 09 - 03:14 AM Manitas.....Don't know where you live (Spain?) but I can assure you that "The Times" is not a local newspaper. This article was carried on two main news pages. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: manitas_at_work Date: 04 Nov 09 - 03:02 AM What I don't understand is why Akenaton is complaining that no one else has commented on the story here before him. Are we supposed to spend all our time scanning every local newspaper before coming to Mudcat? |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: akenaton Date: 04 Nov 09 - 02:53 AM Oh Lillyfester!......I think that may be the same "reasonable" young lady who stated in a previous thread on a related subject, that I had "probably abused my own children". My views on the fostering of young children by male homosexuals prompted this outburst. As a large section of the population share my views, it is more than obvious that Michelle's opinions are far from reasonable. Sanity, don't waste your time! |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 04 Nov 09 - 02:17 AM Don, Your assumption that I am trying to stomp the civil rights of others, is indeed, incorrect. Personally, I disagree with Christian political activism, nor am I in much 'agreement' with any religious denominations. Jesus himself said, for all those even interested, to "Beware of the leaven of the Pharisees, and of Caesar". I'm sure your Lutheran Bible has that quote. It means, to be wary of religious, and political worlds. That being said, the thread is about a homosexual activist, who was found guilty of some rather extreme paedophilia crimes against, not only children, but even of infants! I think even you can agree that, in this case, and even in others, that there is no call to recognize it as anything other, that a perverted crime against humanity, and not to make allowances, for a bias, toward this homosexual, just for the cause of homosexuality. Jesus also said, "Whomever offends one of these(referring to children), it would be better to place a millstone around his neck, and..." I should assume you know the rest. I mention this because of your reference to being a Lutheran, and a Christian, I take it. Now that that has been said, not all who see homosexuality as 'wrong', immoral, or a destructive element, are necessarily, basing it on a 'religious' belief....(such as Ake). But, because of the other thread, that turned into a circus of mindless political activism over truth, one could easily assume, that there was some 'unfinished business', that perhaps hasn't been resolved. Nonetheless, lets agree, that in this thread, to stay on topic...okay?..Regards, GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: Don Firth Date: 04 Nov 09 - 01:05 AM And as far as being bigoted toward Christians, GfS, I am a member of Central Lutheran Church here in my neighborhood. No, I'm not the bigot here. Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: Don Firth Date: 04 Nov 09 - 12:57 AM GfS, there are Christians, and then there are "Christians." If you will just pay attention, you will note that when I mentioned the "Christian" carpetbaggers who are trying to diddle with the laws in this state (the same outfit that screwed around with California's same-sex marriage law), I was not referring to Ake. But the intent of both Ake, this group, and apparently you, is the same: stomp on the civil rights of others. My side of the street is nice and clean, but thank you for your concern. Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 04 Nov 09 - 12:28 AM Don, Ake is a self declared atheist. Are you being a little..umm let's see...uhh...bigoted towards Christians??? If so, just make the 'politically correct' adjustment. I think Ake would assure you, his views are not religious based. Try cleaning up just 'your side of the street'...Just a suggestion, and meant in good spirit...GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: Don Firth Date: 04 Nov 09 - 12:16 AM A few precincts reporting in. So far, the initiative upholding domestic partnership rights is ahead by a nice margin! A tentative yippee hooray!! Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: Don Firth Date: 03 Nov 09 - 11:54 PM And Guest from "Sanity(?)," you are in the same bag as Ake when it comes to respect for facts. Today was an off-year election day here in Washington state, and one of the issues on the ballot was an attempt by out of state religious groups to rescind a law recently passed by the state legislature giving the same legal rights to domestic partners as married couples. It's another of these hyper-religious outfits who are dedicated to opposing same-sex marriage. Carpetbaggers with neon halos. For the last several weeks we've had to listen to their crap in political adds on radio and television and I'm bloody sick and tired of their hate-mongering. "Christians" indeed!!! And then Ake comes in with his wheelbarrow full of hate. . . . The returns haven't come in yet, so the matter in this state is still up in the air. Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 03 Nov 09 - 11:54 PM Frogprince:'Of course the man-boy love thing is an attempt to legitimize their actions; but have you ever heard of a living soul, outside of their own membership, who is buying that attempt in the name of "liberalism" or the acceptance of "diversity". Yes, once in a while, one of their 'constituents', does an interview on one of the 'news' shows...That's how I even heard of them. They pound the same message about 'equality' and 'legitimacy'. By the way, their 'motto' is "Sex before eight, before it's to late". As for me, I think they should be arrested for either, child endangerment, contributing to the delinquency of a minor, or statutory rape, or conspiracy to commit rape of a minor, and or soliciting a minor, or conspiracy to solicit...just for starters!!!! Hope that doesn't bum you out!..GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: frogprince Date: 03 Nov 09 - 11:43 PM Of course the man-boy love thing is an attempt to legitimize their actions; but have you ever heard of a living soul, outside of their own membership, who is buying that attempt in the name of "liberalism" or the acceptance of "diversity". |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 03 Nov 09 - 11:28 PM Golly gee, are you intimating, that if you wiped that grin off your face, you'd use toilet paper???..Just teasing,..but I could barely resist that one..none the less let's rise above any real hostility, but a good quip is still a good quip..even Ebs found them entertaining, up there in the cold country...GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: LilyFestre Date: 03 Nov 09 - 11:08 PM Ok, how about let's just say that Ake has an ongoing agenda full of hate and unreasonableness? Even if he is an ass. *GRIN* |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 03 Nov 09 - 10:46 PM Oh ohh, here comes the name calling again... Please, all you 'open minded wonderful folkies', let's be above that..at least this time. Let's keep the discussion on topic. Last time, when this subject was broached, the 'arguments' just got to stupid to even respond to...and FACTS were ignored, or mixed with politics...which of course, has very little to do with facts, truth, or science!! |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: LilyFestre Date: 03 Nov 09 - 10:08 PM One look at the title of this thread and I knew who was responsible and what irrational line of thinking would follow. I haven't bothered to read an Ake thread or comment in a LONG time. Nothing has changed. He's still an ass. Michelle |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: Don Firth Date: 03 Nov 09 - 09:41 PM Let's face it, Ake is the Rush Limbaugh of Mudcat. Same hate-mongering, same spittle-spraying, same respect for the facts. . . . Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: katlaughing Date: 03 Nov 09 - 09:40 PM This thread proves, once again, that you can lead a Mudcatter to muddy troll waters, but you can't keep him from drinking, so to speak. *sigh* Double, double troll and trouble...(with apologies to Shakespeare.) |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: CarolC Date: 03 Nov 09 - 09:36 PM NAMBLA is not a gay rights group. It is a pederast rights group. It has one issue: lowing the age of consent for young males. There is a big difference between gay rights and what NAMBLA is all about. Most other gay rights groups disagree with and want nothing to do with NAMBLA. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: GUEST,Lox Date: 03 Nov 09 - 09:24 PM Art Said: "The OP made no expression of sympathy for the children either, while he did make a reference to "our resident promoters of homosexuality". It would certainly appear that homosexuality rather than child abuse was the issue that the OP wanted discussed." Exactly! Touche. Ake posted to prove his old tired laboured point and never gave any indication that he gave a flying fig about the victims. Continued condemnation of "liberals" (from the guy who detests meaningless labels ...) is just a continuation of the same old axe grinding and would be laughable if it wasn't so sad. Watch this space - in a month we'll see proof that polish immigrants are responsible for the credit crunch. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: Joe Offer Date: 03 Nov 09 - 09:11 PM As stated in the article Ake linked to:
He was a traitor to his, cause, Ake. Certainly, other causes have traitors, don't they? -Joe- |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: michaelr Date: 03 Nov 09 - 08:55 PM Actually, these events make a case in favor of same-sex marriage: If the homosexual pedophiles could get married, they wouldn't have to bugger other peoples' children. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: frogprince Date: 03 Nov 09 - 08:45 PM sing4ppeace has brought another healthy dose of realistic perspective, based on actual experience, to the matter. Akenaton, do you realize that you give the impression that you believe that a homosexual man who is not a pedophile is an exception? You may not come anywhere near actually believing that, but you really do tend to give the impression that you believe it. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 03 Nov 09 - 08:41 PM McGrath: 'The truth is, there are gay paedophiles, and there are bisexual paedophiles, just there are straight paedophiles.' That is true..there is no corner on what group will go over the limit...but then, there is NAMBLA...which is comprised basically of homosexual 'paedophile likes'. I do not recall a hetero group, of either sex belonging to any comparable group..or do I know of any that exist! Methinks its just another 'attempt' to try to legitimize ..ummm...'diversity'? ...oh well..'equal rights'(?), eh? |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 03 Nov 09 - 08:24 PM It is inevitable that when a leading member of a community is convicted of sexually abusing children, including in this case a baby, that will be seen as reflecting on the whole community. That applies just as much when the community involved is the gay community as it does when it is a religious community. (And vice versa, of course.) And it is inevitable that it will get used as ammunition by people who for other reasons are hostile. At the same time it is reasonable to wish for some examination of whether there is anything in the culture of the community which may have contributed to what happened, or disarmed suspicion of the individuals involved. It is perfectly right to contest the absurd notion that being homosexual and being a paedophile are the same thing, That makes no more sense than suggesting that being heterosexual and being a paedophile are the same thing. But while no one would dream of suggesting that it is possible to assume that heterosexuals cannot be paedophiles, there are people who come perilously close to asserting the equivalent position for homosexuals. The truth is, there are gay paedophiles, and there are bisexual paedophiles, just there are straight paedophiles. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: Bill D Date: 03 Nov 09 - 08:11 PM "...most were more concerned with defending homosexuals..." It seems to me that most are just expressing the idea that *homosexuality* is one natural mode of being. There are abusers who are heterosexual as well. ALL abusers of children should be opposed and prosecuted. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: sing4peace Date: 03 Nov 09 - 07:44 PM We Mudcatters often don't agree on things but I am certain that all who have posted here share a deep sorrow for the victims of these crimes. We disagree on several points of blame and logic here though. From working six years as a legal secretary for the public defender's office, I observed that most pedophiles (as it's spelled here in the U.S.) were heterosexual men. That does not mean that homosexuals and women aren't also capable of abusing children. If there is any one unifying factor it is that the perpetrators were adults. ome of them just barely. Abuse transcends the lines of gender, sexual orientation, class, ability, religion, country and professional,public or private accomplishment. Abuse ripples and renders for generations. There are people from all walks of life abusing children right now as we are having this conversation. Many of those perpetrators were abused as children themselves and repeat the crime again and again in much the same way other traumatized people are drawn to repeat the patterns of the trauma. Not excusing anything here - only explaining causal relationship. Often abuse is known about by other people but never spoken of for fear of getting involved or of embarrassing the victim. Through silence and inaction, entire communities of people can be collusive in the abuse of a child. Homophobia (or xenophobia for that matter) is an easy energy to manipulate when people want to scape goat and focus attention on just one sector of humanity in an attempt to deflect attention away from the sins of their "own kind". Humans of all stripes are capable of such violence - but they are also capable of great compassion and courage. It doesn't help us to protect children from predators or help us to advance past the violent culture we live in to perpetuate inaccurate conclusions based on hatred and fear. Joyce |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: akenaton Date: 03 Nov 09 - 07:20 PM Fair enough Bill, I accept what you say up to a point, but I didn't say anyone here is not opposed to the abuse of children. I simply said that most were more concerned with defending homosexuals than in expressing sympathy for the abused. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: Bill D Date: 03 Nov 09 - 07:12 PM ake...if you read properly, instead of just interpreting posts YOUR way, you'd realize that no one is saying "There in NO connection..", but merely that it is not a regular, causal connection. And why would NOT typing specific expressions of sympathy imply that one is not opposed to abuse of children? You have a serious case of "If you are not totally with me, you are against me." |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: bobad Date: 03 Nov 09 - 07:08 PM "there is no connection between homosexuality and paedophilia" If by that you mean that some paedophiles are homosexual then it can also be said that there is a connection between heterosexuality and paedophilia as some heterosexuals are paedophiles. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: artbrooks Date: 03 Nov 09 - 07:07 PM The OP made no expression of sympathy for the children either, while he did make a reference to "our resident promoters of homosexuality". It would certainly appear that homosexuality rather than child abuse was the issue that the OP wanted discussed. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: akenaton Date: 03 Nov 09 - 06:58 PM Perhaps I better explain what I meant Frogprince. I wouldn't expect anyone here to defend paedophilia, but many of the posts contain no expression of sympathy for the abused children or their families, while forcefully making the point that "there is no connection between homosexuality and paedophilia" |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: frogprince Date: 03 Nov 09 - 06:43 PM "with a few exceptions, contributers to this thread are more concerned with saving the face of homosexual paedophiles than with the abused children or their families" Akeneton, how dare you; go back and quote any statement in this thread which constitutes a defence of any pedophile. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 03 Nov 09 - 06:36 PM Ebbie: "ou can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him play a banjo!.:GtS Actually, that's a great line. Could wish you spent a little more time on that side of your personality. See what reading can do for ya' Ebs..glad to provide you with great literature! Might work wonders on your personality as well! Just look what we can do for each other!!!! |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Gay' activists jailed for paedophilia, From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 03 Nov 09 - 06:32 PM Oh dear me!!....The remark about 95% 0f all forest fires is caused by trees, is satire..and actually used by Pat Paulsen, on the 'Smothers Brothers Comedy Hour'!, in the mid 60's..Just Goes to show ya'!..Jeez, some people just want to argue at the drop of a hat! Just for those who DON'T get it..its used to denote a response to ridiculous arguments...(*sigh*)..So, I guess I stand corrected(?)...Good thing you aren't a fundamentalist Christian!..you'd be spending more time legalistic arguing with other fundamental Christians, than you would be practicing the 'Golden Rule'!!! |
