Origins: There Is a Tavern in the Town

Subject: RE: Tavern in the Town
From: Amos
Date: 13 Oct 03 - 04:19 PM

Sounds like an exaggerated portrayal of blackface mispronunciation of the original (Adieu, dear friends...).

And toadfrog -- there was no "we" behind that core concept stuff. That drivel was my own, sir! :>)


A

Subject: Lyr Add: RADOO
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 13 Oct 03 - 03:26 PM

There is an interesting 19th c. version in the Bodleian Ballads.
^^
Lyr. Add: RADOO (or ADIEU)

Radoo, radoo, kind friends, radoo, radoo, radoo,
And if I never more see you, you, you,
I'll hang my harp on a weeping willow tree,
And may this world go well with you, you, you.

Shall I be bound, shall I be free, free, free,
And many is de girl dat don't love me, me, me,
Or shall I act a foolish part,
And die for the girl that broke my heart, heart, heart.

Give me a chair and I'll sit down, down, down,
Give me a pen and I'll write it down, down, down,
And every word that I shall write
A tear will trickle from my eye, eye, eye.

Between 1877-1884, R. March and Co., London (copied from Francis Brothers and Day, London). Bodleian Ballads, Firth b28(7a/b), image 3. Search for Radoo in: Bodleian

Use of de and dat in verse two suggests a blackface minstrel origin.

Subject: RE: Tavern in the Town
From: toadfrog
Date: 24 Jan 02 - 09:07 PM

Isn't it just a bit suspect to say that these songs "share certain core concepts as though reflecting cross-germination of ideas"? The songs are all about women who are abandoned by lovers, or preganant and abandoned by lovers. It would seem to me that is less a "core concept" which would spread and "cross germinate" than a part of the human condition which has always been there, creates an emotional response, and sois always likely to give rise to songs.

Aren't we over-intellectualizing all this by calling it a "concept" -- let alone a "core concept" (which might "cross-germinate" unless closely watched)?

Subject: RE: Tavern in the Town
From: Kaleea
Date: 22 Jan 02 - 02:57 AM

Another classic example (in the form of a Polka no less)of the guy who done her wrong by going out to the the tavern with said "dark haired" girl. Therefore, the poor girl who was wronged will be forced to commit suicide (hang my head on a weepin' willow tree) and is requesting a carved (of wood) dove (representing her purity of heart) be placed upon her breast when she lies in the casket. Also see:

Bury Me Beneath the Willow Madame Butterfly etc.

Subject: RE: Tavern in the Town
From: nutty
Date: 21 Jan 02 - 05:00 AM

and here's a link to the previous thread

PREVIOUS THREAD

Subject: RE: Tavern in the Town
From: nutty
Date: 21 Jan 02 - 04:55 AM

I seem to remember posting this to another thread some time ago

Its on this broadside (circa1880) in the Bodlean Library

TAVERN IN THE TOWN
Just click on the magnifying glass for a clearer view
It gives the author as W.H.HILLS

Subject: RE: Tavern in the Town
From: Amos
Date: 20 Jan 02 - 11:48 PM

The Butcher Boy cluster, as I understand it, is a gfroup of songs with different titles all of which share certain core concepts as though reflecting cross-germination of ideas.

The Butcher Boy song which was transferred in locale to Tarrytown, known as Wild Goose Grasses, is a member. One common element is the notion of the troubled-in-love young person asking for a grave to be dug for them, with turtle doves to show the world they died of love, etc.

But I always thought that version was from the early settlement era (1590-1650) when the Hudson River valley was being built up (Tarrytown is up in "Sleepy Hollow" country in the Dutch country of the Hudson River valley, I believe).

Correct?

A

A

Subject: RE: Tavern in the Town
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 20 Jan 02 - 11:39 PM

The hit recording in the US was by Rudy Vallee. The verses are largely "floaters" which appear in many older songs.

Subject: RE: Tavern in the Town
From: toadfrog
Date: 20 Jan 02 - 10:26 PM

Joe, just curious. What does it mean to say the song is "related to" Butcher's Boy? The "cf." in the ballad index only seems to mean they have similar themes. Lots of songs have themes similar to that. Like maybe "Careless Love," for one. And what does "earliest date" mean in this context? Does it mean Ballad Index knows that it was sung before it was published?

From what I have seen of Traditional Ballad Index, it seems that they are just a bit careless about facts.

Subject: Origins: Tavern in the Town
From: Joe Offer
Date: 19 Jan 00 - 02:14 PM

I was amazed to follow the DT number and see that this song is related to BUTCHER'S BOY. I would have sworn that "Tavern" was an original creation of Tin Pan Alley. I guess there's nothing new under the sun.
-Joe Offer-

Here's the entry on this song from the Traditional Ballad Index:

Tavern in the Town

DESCRIPTION: Singer laments her lover, who courted her ardently but now goes to a tavern and courts others while leaving her pining. She hopefully anticipates dying and being buried.
AUTHOR: unknown
EARLIEST DATE: 1883 (sheet music published by Shapiro, Bernstein & Co. of New York)
KEYWORDS: loneliness courting infidelity rejection abandonment
FOUND IN: Britain(England(All),Scotland(Aber)) US(MA) Canada(Newf) Ireland
REFERENCES (29 citations):
Sharp-100E 94, "A Brisk Young Sailor" (1 text, 1 tune)
Leather, pp. 205-206, "A Brisk Young Sailor" (1 text, 1 tune)
Wiltshire-WSRO Wt 497, "There Is a Tavern in the Town"; Wiltshire-WSRO Wt 424, "When I Wore My Apron Low" (2 texts)
Kidson-Tunes, pp. 44-46, "My True Love Once He Courted Me" (4 texts, 4 tunes)
Palmer-ECS, #82, "The Brisk Young Sailor" (1 text, 1 tune)
VaughanWilliams/Palmer, #42, "A Briskk Young Sailor" (1 text, 1 tune)
Belden, pp. 478-480, "The Blue-Eyed Boy" (4 texts, though "D" is a fragment, probably of "Tavern in the Town" or "The Butcher Boy" or some such)
BrownIII 259, "I'll Hang My Harp on a Willow Tree" (2 fragments, named for that key line from "Tavern in the Town" which occurs in both fragments, but the "A" text is mostly "Pretty Little Foot")
BrownSchinhanV 259, "I'll Hang My Harp on a Willow Tree" (2 tunes plus text excerpts)
GreigDuncan6 1169, "Died for Love" (11 texts, 8 tunes); 1171, "There Is a Tavern in the Town" (1 fragment, 1 tune)
SHenry H683, p. 393, "The Apron of Flowers" (1 text, 1 tune -- apparently a collection of floating verses including one that goes here)
OCroinin-Cronin 81, "Last Night Being Windy" (3 texts, 1 tune)
Reeves-Sharp 20, "A Brisk Young Lover" (5 texts)
Korson-PennLegends, pp. 48-49, "I Wish In Vain" (1 text, 1 tune)
RJackson-19CPop, pp. 210-213, "There Is a Tavern in the Town" (1 text, 1 tune)
Spaeth-ReadWeep, pp. 84-85, "There Is a Tavern in the Town" (1 text, 1 tune)
Silber-FSWB, p. 180, "There Is A Tavern In The Town" (1 text)
Fuld-WFM, pp. 572-573, "There Is a Tavern in the Town"
LPound-ABS, 23, p. 62, "There Is a Tavern in the Town" (1 text; the "A" text is "The Butcher Boy")
Peacock, pp. 705-706, "She Died in Love" (1 text, 1 tune)
Shay-Barroom, pp. 62-63, "There Is a Tavern in the Town" (1 text, 1 tune)
Messerli, pp. 203-204, "There Is a Tavern in the Town" (1 text)
Darling-NAS, pp. 140-141, "The Tavern in the Town" (1 text, filed under "The Butcher Boy")
DT, TAVTOWN*
ADDITIONAL: Henry Randall Waite, _College Songs: A Collection of New and Popular Songs of the American Colleges_, new and enlarged edition, Oliver Ditson & Co., 1887, pp. 4-5, "There Is a Tavern in the Town" (1 text, 1 tune)
SEE ALSO:
Lomax-FSNA 229, "Hard, Ain't It Hard" (1 text, 1 tune)
Silber-FSWB, p. 185, "Hard, Ain't It Hard" (1 text)
DT, TAVTOWN AINTHARD*
ST ShH94 (Full)
Roud #60
RECORDINGS:
Amy Birch, "Over Yonder's Hill" (on Voice11)
"Pops" Johnny Connors, "There is an Alehouse" (on IRTravellers01)
Rudy Vallee, "Tavern in the Town" (Victor 24739, 1934)
Mrs. Thomas Walters, "She Died in Love" (on PeacockCDROM) [one verse only]
SEE ALSO:
Almanac Singers, "Hard, Ain't It Hard" (General 5019A, 1941; on Almanac01, Almanac03, AlmanacCD1)
Woody Guthrie, "Hard Ain't It Hard" (Folk Tunes 150, n.d., probably mid-1940s)
BROADSIDES:
Bodleian, Firth b.28(6a/b) View 7 of 8, "There Is A Tavern In The Town," R. March and Co. (London), 1877-1884
CROSS-REFERENCES:
cf. "The Butcher Boy" [Laws P24] (plot)
cf. "The Sailor Boy (I)" [Laws K12] (lyrics)
cf. "Love Has Brought Me to Despair" [Laws P25]
cf. "I Know My Love" (floating lyrics)
cf. "Oh, Johnny, Johnny" (floating lyrics)
cf. "The Rashy Muir" (tune, per GreigDuncan6)
ALTERNATE TITLES:
There Is an Alehouse in Yonder Town
There's a Tavern in the Town
Up The Green Meadow
Adieu, Adieu, Adieu!
NOTES [480 words]: The overlap between this song and the "Butcher Boy" cluster is obvious; whether they're the same song is a Talmudic question. -PJS
The 1891 sheet music credits this piece to F. J. Adams. The earliest known printing of "Tavern" (as opposed to the presumably related Cornish miners' song "There is an Alehouse in Yonder Town"), however, does not give the author's name. The printing in the 1887 edition of College Songs lists it as copyright by Wm. H. Hills but lists no author.
Alan Lomax calls "Hard Ain't It Hard" a reworking of this piece, and I'm going along on the principle that it certainly isn't a traditional song (given that it's by Woody Guthrie). I don't think it's that simple, though; the "Hard ain't it hard" chorus clearly derives from "Ever After On." - RBW
Yes, Rudy Vallee recorded it too. And blew the lyrics, I might add [My understanding is that the people around him were trying, with great success, to crack him up - RBW]. But clearly the song remained current in pop culture as well as folk culture. It was also reputed to have been popular among collegiates. - PJS
"Hang my harp on a willow tree" may be taken from Psalms 137.2 [King James] via Thomas Haynes Bayly. Cf. "I'll Hang My Harp on a Willow Tree."
Broadside Bodleian Firth b.28(6a/b) View 7 of 8 ascribes "There Is A Tavern In The Town" to W.H. Hills. - BS
Somewhere in my youth, someone (probably school authorities) forced upon us a game, "Head, Shoulders, Knees and Toes." Thirty-odd years later, I recalled it for some reason, and realize that the tune is an up-tempo version of this. If the song was inflicted upon other classes than mine, it may be that the song has had some sort of horrid second life. - RBW
Amy Birch's version on Voice11 has a first line "Over yonder's hill there is an old house" but continues to be enough like "Tavern in the Town" that I put it here rather than Laws P25 or any of the other songs in this cluster.
GreigDuncan6 [on #1169]: "Noted by George F. Duncan from mother's singing in 1875."
The Reeves-Sharp "complete" text is a composite of eight English texts: "The composite text I have printed contains seventeen stanzas, and omits none of the elements in Sharp's twelve English versions. Full as this composite text is, however, it does not contain all the elements noted by other collectors, nor would it be possible to make a satisfactory synthesis which includes *every* element." The result is a collection of floating verses that includes the usual "Tavern in the Town" verses.
The count of texts for Reeves-Sharp includes four fragments from other collections.
If "Tavern In the Town" is limited to the college song then I have misclassified OCroinin-Cronin, GreigDuncan6 and others. Steve Roud has revised his distribution of the family among Roud numbers #60, #409, #860, #18828, #18829, #18830, #18831, #18832 and #18834 (the "college song"). - BS
Last updated in version 4.3
File: ShH94

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THERE IS A TAVERN IN THE TOWN (Digital Tradition lyrics)

There is a tavern in the town, in the town
And there my true love sits him down, sits him down,
And drinks his wine as merry as can be,
And never, never thinks of me.

cho: Fare thee well, for I must leave thee,
Do not let this parting grieve thee,
And remember that the best of friends
Must part, must part.

Adieu, adieu kind friends, yes, adieu
I can no longer stay with you, stay with you,
I'll hang my harp on the weeping willow tree,
And may the world go well with thee.

He left me for a damsel dark, damsel dark,
Each Friday night they used to spark,
Used to spark,
And now my love who once was true to me
Takes this dark damsel on his knee.

And now I see him nevermore, nevermore;
He never knocks upon my door, on my door;
Oh, woe is me; he pinned a little note,
And these were all the words he wrote:

Oh, dig my grave both wide and deep, wide and deep;
Put tombstones at my head and feet, head and feet
And on my breast you may carve a turtle dove,
To signify I died of love.

DT #320
Laws P24
@courtship @death @infidelity
filename[ TAVTOWN
TUNE FILE: TAVTOWN
CLICK TO PLAY
SOF

Subject: RE: Tavern in the Town
From: Dale Rose
Date: 19 Jan 00 - 10:09 AM

Just couldn't resist this one. THERE IS A TAVERN IN THE TOWN at The Lester S. Levy Collection of Sheet Music. Words and music by F. J. Adams, 1891. I didn't take the time to check lyric differences, but this should be the original version. I can't hear this song without thinking of Wally Cox.

Subject: RE: Tavern in the Town
From: Allan C.
Date: 19 Jan 00 - 08:18 AM

Yes, Ferrara, I do. It, (the part in parenthesis) was in the version I first heard which was on the "Brothers Four Songbook" album. So, I would also wonder at its authenticity. But, like you, I like the way it sounds.

Subject: RE: Tavern in the Town
From: Ferrara
Date: 19 Jan 00 - 08:02 AM

ps Allan, I never heard your "until another meeting" bit before. I like it, sounds authentic, except for the "friendly greeting" which doesn't strike the right tone for a broken hearted and rejected lover, in my opinion. Any idea where you heard it?

Subject: RE: Tavern in the Town
From: Ferrara
Date: 19 Jan 00 - 08:00 AM

Maybe there's supposed to be an effigy (sp?) of the brokenhearted dead girl on the tomb? Morbid to the max but people used to love that stuff. Now it's transformed: more in your face, less sentimental.... I'm partial to the sentimental stuff myself.

Subject: RE: Tavern in the Town
From: Allan C.
Date: 19 Jan 00 - 07:20 AM

refresh

Subject: RE: Tavern in the Town
From: emily rain
Date: 28 Aug 99 - 04:14 PM

i can't sing that song without thinking of raffi:

head and shoulders knees and feet (knees and feet!)
head and shoulders knees and feet (knees and feet0
i got a nose, two eyes, two ears, and a mouth,
head and shoulders knees and feet (knees and feet!)

: )

Subject: RE: Tavern in the Town
From: paddymac
Date: 27 Aug 99 - 05:13 PM

Great song. As to the carving issue, I read it figuratively, as applying to grave markers, whether leaden tags on pine boxes or more elaborate stone markers.

Subject: Lyr Add: THERE IS A TAVERN IN THE TOWN
From: Allan C.
Date: 27 Aug 99 - 08:34 AM

Nearly everyone has heard this song at one time or another. I was recently transcribing it from the DT for a friend and decided to genderize the verses to fit my particular persuasion. I submit it here with the changes I would sing in brackets. In addition, I have included a second part of the chorus which is not in the DT but I have heard used from time to time. This, I have put in parenthesis. Also, I have corrected the word, pinned, as it appears in the DT, which I am certain should have been spelled with an "e".

So, some questions: Is the request indicated in the note of the song the way you know it? I just have a hard time visualizing someone carving a dead person's breast(bone, I presume). Or, could the use of the word refer to the inscribed, metal plates put on coffin lids? There are some other songs out there which make similar references. Any opinions?

THERE IS A TAVERN IN THE TOWN

There is a tavern in the town, in the town
And there my true love sits him [her] down, sits him [her] down,
And drinks his [her] wine as merry as can be,
And never, never thinks of me.

cho: Fare thee well, for I must leave thee,
Do not let this parting grieve thee,
And remember that the best of friends must part, must part.

(So until another meeting
When you hear my friendly greeting
I will always keep your memory in my heart)

Adieu, adieu, kind friends, adieu
I can no longer stay with you, stay with you,
I'll hang my harp on the weeping willow tree,
And may the world go well with thee.

He left me for a damsel dark, damsel dark,
[She left me for a man both tall and dark, tall and dark.]
Each Friday night they used to spark, used to spark,
And now my love who once was true to me
Takes this dark damsel on his knee.
[Sits upon that other fellow's knee.]

And now I see him [her] nevermore, nevermore;
He [She] never knocks upon my door, on my door;
Oh, woe is me; he [she] penned a little note,
And these were all the words he[she] wrote:

Oh, dig my grave both wide and deep, wide and deep;
Put tombstones at my head and feet, head and feet
And on my breast you may carve a turtle dove,
To signify I died of love.