BS: Bleeping Cyclist

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 06 Sep 23 - 05:54 AM

Most bikes aren’t fitted with speedometers, so cyclists can’t be charged with speeding offences. They could, however, be charged with ‘wanton or furious cycling’ if they are considered to be going too fast for the conditions.

DC

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 04 Sep 23 - 05:24 AM

There might have been some penguins on skateboards but I was too busy avoiding the middle-aged men to notice.

DC

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 04 Sep 23 - 04:40 AM

I was in Lodon at the weekend and visited the West End theatre land. The cyclists are well provided for with their own cycle lanes and pretty much behaved themselves, from what I could see, apart from one young lady who let the side down by hurtling downhill on Haymarket and went straight through the red light at great speed when pedestrian were actually using the crossing.

Most of the pedestrians seemed to recognise their vulnerability and waited for the green signal to cross, although there were a few who crossed to islands against the red man if there were no cars bearing down on them.

What did give problems were the roller skaters on Victoria Embankment. They were old enough to know better but hopped on and off the curb, from the footpath to the cycle lane, at will, zig-zagging in front of pedestrians and cyclists alike.

DC

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Donuel
Date: 14 Sep 23 - 01:09 PM

If Raggytash had hit and killed the cyclists the court would probably consider Manslaughter as opposed to vehicular homicide UNTIL THIS THREAD CAME INTO EVIDENCE. ;^/

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Raggytash
Date: 14 Sep 23 - 08:52 AM

Last night I was driving down a narrow country road just as night had fallen.

I came across two cyclists, dressed in dark colours neither of whom had a light on their bicycles .............. there are those who would suggest that I would have been at fault I had hit them.


Really!!

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Raggytash
Date: 13 Sep 23 - 09:34 AM

It seems to me that the motorist has been given the ALL responsibilty for the safety of cyclists and pedestrians, that little if any responsibilty lies with them.

You may well agree with that.

However ............ the pedestrian or the cyclist is made flesh (very squishy) and bone (very brittle) I on the other hand am sitting in a steel box that weight 2.4 tons.

Your call.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Raggytash
Date: 12 Sep 23 - 12:40 PM

I witness the incidence of poor standards of cycling almost every day.

Ignoring the rules of the road, putting themselves and others in jeopody.

There is a cycle hire company in the town I live in, it is on a one way street.

The number of people who cycle the wrong way down the street despite having just been told by the owners it is a one way system is astonishing. I find myself hoping they get a nudge from a car ..... or bus!

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Raggytash
Date: 05 Sep 23 - 02:33 PM

This morning waiting at a T junction with traffic lights waiting to turn left a cyclist going my way came passed me on the opposite carriage way (double white lines) went the wrong way round a traffic island just before the lights, got to the front of the queue cut across the car there and then turned left through a red light.

Had I done that in my car I would have broken at least 3 traffic rules and ended up with at least 9 points on my licence.

It is little wonder that car drivers get p****d off with them

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Mr Red
Date: 04 Sep 23 - 03:16 AM

Well, Nigel, I don't watch my speedo enough I suppose but I don't exactly hare manically around the place.

Fit a dash cam and you may well find you do notice speed limits. In the event, if Mr Plod sees the camera, he would commandeer the SD card. And knowing that is a sobering thought. IME

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 Sep 23 - 05:21 PM

True. Sadly :-(

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 16 Sep 23 - 08:20 AM

I blame Bolivian unicyclists

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 16 Sep 23 - 03:49 AM

Escooters certainly need some legislation. Maybe they should be treated the same as either ebikes or mobility scooters? I dunno as I have never used one

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 13 Sep 23 - 03:34 AM

Of course there are instances of poor cycling standards everyday just as there are instances of poor standards in everything (and possibly getting worse unless that is just perception) But the majority of cyclists, drivers, bikers, pedestrians and even roller skating nuns are perfectly good, law abiding people. The fact that bad ones are noticeable only underlines that statement. All the facts and figures indicate that only a tiny fraction of accidents are caused by poor cycling - Google it and you will find lots of statistics about cycle accidents. None of them that I have found indicate anything to justify the demonisation of cyclists that I am seeing here.

Mind you, I suppose blaming cyclists for all our ills makes a change from blaming Muslims or immigrants. Just don't give Cruella more ideas...

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Sep 23 - 09:33 AM

They are not, SPB. The vast majority of cyclists, like me, ride sensibly and with all due care and consideration for others. Playing the passive/agressive victim and tarring all cyclists with the same brush will not win you any arguments.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Sep 23 - 02:47 AM

Electric bikes in the UK are limited to 17mph by motor power. You cannot limit the speed of pedal or free wheel power.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 09 Sep 23 - 04:49 PM

Many laws don't work well at first. Change is not welcome by many but will eventually happen

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 09 Sep 23 - 03:19 PM

The latest road rules put pedestrians at the top of the tree. Buses and lorries are at the bottom.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Sep 23 - 05:47 PM

And 99...

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Sep 23 - 05:47 PM

I think it's covid!

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Sep 23 - 09:06 AM

My second eldest and his pal decided to hire electric scooters on their way home from the pub once night. They were returned to the hire point in 2 minutes and he still has the bruises!

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Sep 23 - 08:30 AM

Another idiot Doug! Maybe the guitar case could have nudged him :-D

Cyclists can also be charged with dangerous cycling. From "The Independant"

They can however be charged with dangerous cycling under the 1988 Road and Traffic Act Section 28, which sets out that an offence has been committed if “the way they ride falls far below what could be expected of a competent and careful cyclist”.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Sep 23 - 04:45 AM

I have just read that speed limits do not apply to cyclists. That is crazy!

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Sep 23 - 04:41 AM

He was an idiot but he is more likely to kill himself than kill someone else.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 04 Sep 23 - 05:19 AM

Were there any nuns on roller skates?

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 30 Aug 23 - 03:35 PM

BTW, before you ask, I did send the footage to the police. This was their response.

Thank you for your submission to Op Snap, sent on:
2023-05-29

This submission has now been reviewed and the following decision has been made :
No further action to be taken

As no further action will be taken, our justification is below along with any other comments:
Reference DV66EYA, MF15WWV & CN22BWA. Unfortunately this submission has gone time expired due to resource issues and a rapid increase in submissions so we have been unable to process this within the time limit. Please note it has still been logged for reference purposes.

Kind regards,

OpSnap

So basically, the police get so many reports of shit driving that they cannot action them all. :-(

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 30 Aug 23 - 03:31 PM

Just remebered a little incident I had only a couple of months back locally when 3 drivers decided to try and kill me!

Nutters

It is little wonder that cyclists feel safer off the road when drivers cannot give way to cyclists even when the cyclist has the right of way.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: gillymor
Date: 13 Sep 23 - 12:20 PM

To me it's not about drivers vs. cyclists vs pedestrians, it's gets down to the notion that some people are good and some people are no damn good regardless of the mode of transport.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Charmion
Date: 06 Sep 23 - 09:21 AM

When I lived in Germany, back in the Cold War, my favourite menace to navigation was a middle-aged woman on a moped, heading home from work with her basket brimming with briefcase, office shoes and supper ingredients, steering with one hand and using the other to secure the load. Typically, this person would find her place in the heavy Hauptstrasse traffic right spung in my blind spot, from which she would erupt without warning (Signal? Never!) to rocket through the tiniest imaginable gap between Landkreuzwagons and disappear in the general direction of suburbia.

I wondered where they trained -- the Wall of Death?

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Charmion
Date: 06 Sep 23 - 08:59 AM

Another problematic electric scooter!

Proof positive that, in the wrong hands, the most beneficial gadget can be a source of chaos.

Whenever I see one, I think how handy it could be for doing my messages ... But no. I'd end up dead on Ontario Street, half-way home from the supermarket.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 Sep 23 - 05:21 PM

True. Sadly :-(

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Tunesmith
Date: 23 Sep 23 - 07:19 AM

The Highway Code in the UK is joke. It seems to have great concerns about pedestrian safety but the Code doesn't reflect that. There are too many "should" rules which have no teeth; indeed as motorists ignore the "must" rules what chance have "should" rules.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 16 Sep 23 - 08:20 AM

I blame Bolivian unicyclists

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 16 Sep 23 - 06:57 AM

Legislation is pointless unless it is rigidly and robustly enforced, and sufficient enforcement officers are employed to make this happen on every street 24 hours/day. The only way that would happen would be for the Home Secretary/Treasury to at least double the staffing budget for every police force - which would in reality have to increase taxes, cut services, or but the burden on local authorities/metropolitan mayors. I wouldn't put it past the government, however to churn out anti-cyclist hate propaganda blaming cyclists for the lac of effective policing, or even direct blame to people coming to this country some way or other.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 16 Sep 23 - 03:49 AM

Escooters certainly need some legislation. Maybe they should be treated the same as either ebikes or mobility scooters? I dunno as I have never used one

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 15 Sep 23 - 06:09 PM

MtF simple answer rewrite the Highway Code to encompass every possible 'what if' scenario which includes guidance for all road/pavement/ crossing users in the event of every possible infringement. No problem if it runs to tens of thousands of pages.

BTW in the 20 minutes it took me to get home tonight:
(2

(1) E scooter rider mounted and continued to ride on the pavement.

(2) E bike ride without lights, swerving onto the wrong side of the road to cut off a bend and had to swerve back to avoid a head on collision. If that had been a fatal collision, what is the bet that the police would have victimised bus users by closing off the road?

(3) Another cyclist without lights.

Police need to get off their backsides and ensure that they are working 24 hours a day (collectively)on every street to enforce road regulations. if it takes a million + extra pace, it is worth 90% pay cuts to protect people's lives.

Alternatively cyclist could start behaving responsibly.

Alternatively, if the minority of cylists/scooter riders insist on not giving a toss about anyone but themselves, seize and scrap every scooter in the UK and make Deliveroo rider who seem to be the worst offenders either walk or catch a bus to make their deliveries.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 15 Sep 23 - 12:09 PM

Minor problem: the Highway Code was written on the assumption that people behave rationally at all times. That doesn't hold in this post-politeness era, any more than the premise which underlies most economic theories that everybody behaves as a Rational Actor.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 15 Sep 23 - 09:32 AM

Yep, got disoriented trying to envisage what direction traffic is coming from sitting at a desk (and I'm left handed). I suppose left right left would apply to most of the world except for a few countries where there do not seem to be any rules judging by the way most people drive.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 15 Sep 23 - 07:40 AM

”Also, as pedestrians, from our childhood, we are taught road drill which advises looking left and right and left again (ie a final look in the direction traffic should be coming from)”

Errrrmm…Right, Left, and Right again, surely? ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 15 Sep 23 - 07:29 AM

A cyclist riding in dark clothes without lights on the wrong side of the road does have a chance of being seen in oncoming cars headlamps.

However where I live, there are cyclist who find it fun swerving from one side of the road to the other - without notice - or mounting the pavement - without notice.

DoT and Local authorities will not spend money putting up proper signage so pedestrians now where cyclists are going to behave stupidly.

Also, as pedestrians, from our childhood, we are taught road drill which advises looking left and right and left again (ie a final look in the direction traffic should be coming from). We are also taught that it is safer to cross the road at zebra and pelican crossings, but not taught to keep stopping and starting while crossing the road in case a cyclist or driver has no intention of stopping at a red light. Further to that if a car or more particularly a bus, van, people carrier or any other higher sided vehicle stops at a traffic light, it is not always possible to see if a cyclist is about to under/overtake it while stopped, so the highway code should say when crossing the road, stop after crossing the path of each vehicle and check if their are any approaching cyclists or other vehicles, and wait for them to stop or jump the crossing before proceding any further.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 15 Sep 23 - 05:50 AM

OK, folks, you provoked me into it:

Herself's cousin was in the Belgian police force. He was brought in on a case where a coloured cyclist, wearing black at night, and cycling without lights along (I *think*) the English side of the road, was hit by a vehicle and put in hospital. As the cyclist could speak neither Flemish nor French, Herself's cousin was brought in as interpreter. He reported to us that the cyclist kept saying: "But I put out my hand to turn right ...."

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 14 Sep 23 - 03:13 PM

If you were to hit unlit cyclists wearing dark clothes in the dark, I'd say it was very unlikely that you'd be charged with anything. Unless you have an example of this having happened.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 14 Sep 23 - 01:25 PM

There is no such offence as ‘Vehicular Homicide’ in the U.K. The nearest we have is ‘Causing Death by Dangerous Driving’.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Donuel
Date: 14 Sep 23 - 01:09 PM

If Raggytash had hit and killed the cyclists the court would probably consider Manslaughter as opposed to vehicular homicide UNTIL THIS THREAD CAME INTO EVIDENCE. ;^/

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 14 Sep 23 - 11:33 AM

Sounds to me, Raggytash, like the offenders were going for a Darwin Award. At least they weren't riding on the left along a Belgian road [full story available on request].

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Raggytash
Date: 14 Sep 23 - 08:52 AM

Last night I was driving down a narrow country road just as night had fallen.

I came across two cyclists, dressed in dark colours neither of whom had a light on their bicycles .............. there are those who would suggest that I would have been at fault I had hit them.


Really!!

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 14 Sep 23 - 08:06 AM

> it's amazing how many cyclists choose to ride on the pavement along
> the quietest roads imaginable.

The roads with the rim-chewing potholes? I used to have decently wide rims and well-inflated fat tyres in self-defence; even so, when I had to replace one wheel, then happened to cycle on a bit of flat pavement, I was surprised how un-lumpy the ride was, thence how bad my rims had got without me noticing.

The youngsters these days have racing rims with next to no metal in them, then wonder why half a hiccup in the road surface totals the wheels.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Tunesmith
Date: 14 Sep 23 - 06:40 AM

My observations have more cyclists on pavements than the road; of course, this will probably vary from place to place. ALSO, it's amazing how many cyclists choose to ride on the pavement along the quietest roads imaginable. BTW, I bet most cyclist under say 30, in the UK, don't know that the law forbids bikes on the pavement. Now, how has this situation arisen? Well, ask one of those local police officers. You know, the ones with one blind eye!

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: G-Force
Date: 14 Sep 23 - 03:54 AM

No, Thompson, not entitlement, just a reasonable expectation that a car can drive at the speed of a car unless there's an unavoidable obstruction ahead. Slow cyclists two abreast are not that, they can get out of the way.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Thompson
Date: 14 Sep 23 - 02:17 AM

Surely it's the driver who has the sense of entitlement? Two cyclists are the same width as one car. Drive a little slowly for a short while and you'll find a safe place to pass.
Best driver I ever met was a TV cameraman who had been given a defensive driving course as part of his professional training. I was his passenger, and was giving about about a bad driver ahead, and he remarked calmly that he'd been taught not to attach emotion to other road users.

Subject: RE: BS: Bleeping Cyclist
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Sep 23 - 07:35 PM

"Most cyclists"? Don't be daft!