BS: Ornithological question

Subject: RE: BS: Ornithological question
From: Bee
Date: 18 Aug 08 - 07:31 PM

That was definitely the show I saw, Gurney. Good memory, you got.

Subject: RE: BS: Ornithological question
From: Gurney
Date: 18 Aug 08 - 06:42 PM

BBCW, I should have said: The post of mine up above wasn't from folklore, it was from a nature documentary on the TV.

Old Mr.Chaucer knew a thing or two, didn't he. Thanks to him I know how to get a flea out of a person's ear. In a pub, anyway.
More than 50 years since I read CT, and then it was a library archive copy with the old-style s's. Heavy going.

Subject: RE: BS: Ornithological question
From: Black belt caterpillar wrestler
Date: 18 Aug 08 - 08:05 AM

Just to point out that in folklore some birds have been considered to be habitually unfaithful.
In Chauser's Caterbury Tales one person is refered to as being " as letcherous as a sparrow".

Subject: RE: BS: Ornithological question
From: GUEST,Ian cookieless
Date: 18 Aug 08 - 04:48 AM

Thanks, Jack, for the tip-off about geese (as I have it in the back of my mind that the writer of the song cannot surely have just made it up - it must be based on *something*). As a result, I found this, part of which reads as follows:

"Nobel Prize laureate Dr. Konrad Lorenz, Father of the Greylag geese, devoted his lifetime to the study of geese. In [his book] 'The Year of the Greylag Goose' ... According to Dr. Lorenz, geese possess a veritably human capacity for grief. In his conversations with laymen, he would frequently say, "Animals are much less intelligent than you are inclined to think, but in their feelings and emotions they are far less different from us than you assume." Quite literally, a man, a dog, and a goose hang their heads, lose their appetites, and become indifferent to all stimuli emanating from the environment. For grief-striken human beings, as well as for geese, one effect is that they become outstandingly vulnerable to accidents; they tend to fly into high-tension cables or fall prey to predators because of their reduced alertness.

After the death of his beloved mate, Ado attached himself to Dr. Lorenz. According to Dr. Lorenz, "...Ado would shyly creep up after me, his body hunched in sadness, and he would remain motionless about 25 or 30 feet away." Ado spent the remainder of the year sad and isolated.

There have been reports of pair bonds that are so strong that if one goose is shot down by a hunter, the partner will circle back. Drawn by its need to stay with its lifelong companion, the single goose will often ignore the sound of shooting and return to die with its mate."

Interesting. It seems I have my answer. Unless any of you think "There have been reports ..." is undocumented and romantic heresay?

Thanks, all.

Ian

Subject: RE: BS: Ornithological question
From: Gurney
Date: 18 Aug 08 - 12:36 AM

Bee, it was the House Sparrow, I seem to remember. And the husband pecked at his unfaithful mate's bottom until she ejected the sperm, encapsulated. Graphic scene on the TV.

The stupid things that stick in your memory.

Subject: RE: BS: Ornithological question
From: GUEST,Jack The Sailor
Date: 17 Aug 08 - 08:12 PM

Ian,

I've heard that about some geese. I doubt that it is true.

Subject: RE: BS: Ornithological question
From: Bee
Date: 17 Aug 08 - 07:29 PM

Emma, thanks for finding that: I read it years ago but couldn't remember anything that might bring it up by Googling.

One thing not mentioned in the article was in regard to some little English bird (tits, maybe) where the female is actually able to eject her mate's sperm before copulating with the handsome rogue.

Subject: RE: BS: Ornithological question
From: Emma B
Date: 17 Aug 08 - 07:15 PM

A slightly less 'romantic' view from New Scientist too

Subject: RE: BS: Ornithological question
From: katlaughing
Date: 17 Aug 08 - 07:03 PM

More interesting stuff about it HERE.

Subject: RE: BS: Ornithological question
From: Peace
Date: 17 Aug 08 - 06:05 PM

When Lassie died, Laddie, despite being near dogs in estrus, never went near another bitch for the purpose of mating. They were collies, full size. But one example don't prove a rule.

Subject: RE: BS: Ornithological question
From: GUEST,Ian cookieless
Date: 17 Aug 08 - 05:40 PM

That's as I suspected. Thanks, folks. Unless anyone has just one example from one species ...?

Subject: RE: BS: Ornithological question
From: Emma B
Date: 17 Aug 08 - 05:33 PM

and it gets worse
:)

Subject: RE: BS: Ornithological question
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 17 Aug 08 - 05:31 PM

Some birds will 'mourn' their mate for a while... swans have been known to remain near the body of their mates for some time, as have pigeons. But as Phil says, the breeding instinct is too strong and they'll try to find new mates.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Ornithological question
From: maeve
Date: 17 Aug 08 - 05:31 PM

I don't know of any scientific information supporting the notion, Ian. However I can tell you that our little Bantam hen clearly grieved for a year after her mate died, and in fact never accepted another rooster.

Subject: RE: BS: Ornithological question
From: Newport Boy
Date: 17 Aug 08 - 05:28 PM

The website at wild-bird-watching.com has an article on birds mating for life, which concludes with:

I suppose the question of whether a bird mates for life comes from wondering what will happen should one bird die. Many believe that birds mourn the loss of their mate, never to mate again.

This just isn't true. Wild birds will always attempt to find new mates.

Phil

Subject: BS: Ornithological question
From: GUEST,Ian cookieless
Date: 17 Aug 08 - 05:12 PM

I am learning a song that has the line, "Some birds die when their mate has flown". I suspect this is poetic license, and I can find no evidence of any birds that do this, even those that mate for life. But I would really welcome any knowledge that would back up or refute this line.

Thank
Ian