BS: Energy Saving - or Junk Mail?

Subject: RE: BS: Energy Saving - or Junk Mail?
From: Mr Red
Date: 19 Aug 08 - 07:13 AM

I hear that your Big Sister in NZ is safe. But had to come down the mountain on a Skidoo.

Her poor guide had to come down in a 'copter.

My big sister died in NZ 12 years ago. Still miss her. Bro-in-law keeps in touch.

Subject: RE: BS: Energy Saving - or Junk Mail?
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 18 Aug 08 - 11:14 PM

Changes in billing make it difficult to pull out details. During some periods Gas and Electric were on a combined billing and were difficult to separate, while at other times they were separate companies. We have gas heat and electric air conditioning, with fairly constant monthly totals within any given year.

Suffice to show:

July 1998 Gas + Electric $766.81
July 2008 Gas + Electric $295.46

July 1998 Water (includes Sewer Chg) $131.55
July 2008 Water (includes Sewer Chg) $46.73

Gas and Electric rates have increased by something between 15 and 18%, so far as I can figure them out, during this time period. At current rates, the July 1998 bill would be somewhat more than $900 for the month, so I've cut off about 2/3 of the bill.

The reductions are deliberate and planned, and have required significant "adjustments." While the reduction in Electric charges aren't entirely from the gradual elimination of incandescent light bulbs as the old ones burned out, I'd estimate that at least a third of it is just due to the difference in lighting, and we have better lighting now, in most parts of the house, than were in place originally. I still have incandescent bulbs in ONE FIXTURE that's on a dimmer. The existing fixture has "mini-base" bulbs for which fluorescent conversion bulbs aren't available, dimmable or otherwise.

The remaining improvements are largely from adjustments in air circulation/distribution for the existing forced air systems, and slight increases in summer temp settings with addition of three or four supplemental portable fans. (We're both getting too old to tolerate big changes in temps, which might save somewhat more.)

The reduction in water costs is largely due to disabling the automatic lawn sprinkler system. I didn't actually disable it. It did it to itself, and I couldn't rationalize the extortionate repair/reinstallation charges for an unneeded and wasteful conspicuous consumption of resources.

The worst "utility" here is the trash service, which has nearly tripled in our 10 years in this house - with NO MUNICIPAL RECYCLING available and no indication that changes are to be expected.

There are few things that one can do (without investing in new equipment) that individually will make really big differences in utility costs. It's the cumulative effect of lots of smaller changes that can make a difference large enough to help the cash flow.

Switching to more efficient lighting can make a noticeable difference, but by itself it's sort of "pocket change" for most people. The cumulative effect of a whole community saving just a few bucks each probably can be worthwhile; but it takes time to make a switchover and the savings can get overlooked by those who don't pay attention.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Energy Saving - or Junk Mail?
From: John Hardly
Date: 18 Aug 08 - 08:14 PM

Oh....

...and the reason I became aware of this is because I use natural gas equally year 'round. I fire a kiln.

Subject: RE: BS: Energy Saving - or Junk Mail?
From: John Hardly
Date: 18 Aug 08 - 08:12 PM

Jeri, the problem is the way it's done with natural gas. Natural gas always goes up some time in the summer. As soon as NG reaches a peak or near-peak price, they THEN advertise (with the help of local TV and radio press releases predicting the doom of rising prices) and send around mailers and phone calls (I've received one of each this past week) offering to lock you in. What they don't tell you is that there is at least a decade of records (I've only followed it back that far) proving that nobody EVER saves by locking in -- you ONLY lose.

If you know how to buy NG futures and you are up on the quarterly pricing, you can sometimes beat the prices. But that's not what this scam is.

Subject: RE: BS: Energy Saving - or Junk Mail?
From: Joybell
Date: 18 Aug 08 - 08:12 PM

Working fine for us too. Just one small problem is the constant soft hum they make. Maybe we need more traffic or cows or something.
Cheers, Joy

Subject: RE: BS: Energy Saving - or Junk Mail?
From: Jeri
Date: 18 Aug 08 - 07:51 PM

John, that 'locked in price' thing for oil has helped quite a few people where I live. I've never done it myself because I'd have to use an amount of oil I'd never use. Others have been quite happy with it. No scam here, but it would be a problem if prices were to go down after you're locked in.

Subject: RE: BS: Energy Saving - or Junk Mail?
From: Ebbie
Date: 18 Aug 08 - 07:34 PM

That's been my experience too, Bee. In an apartment house I manage I used to replace the various entry bulbs every few weeks. I switched to the curlies and they have lasted months. I think it is especially true of them when they remain on 24/7.

I also replaced my own bulbs with the same result- although in reading areas I use the equivalent of 100 watt rather than 60s.

Subject: RE: BS: Energy Saving - or Junk Mail?
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 18 Aug 08 - 07:33 PM

here in Oz light bulbs are also on their way out - tho our energy suppliers don't post out energy saving globes, they have in the past set up shop (counter/boxes) in malls & shopping centres & railway stations & given 'em away.

Crowds gathered & filled in a form (gotta prove that folks are taking 'em!!) & left with boxes of 4 wonderful energy saving globes! One of my colleagues gave lots of false names & addresses as her newly renovated house was full of nasty old-fashioned light globes.

It was only in later years that folks started questioning the perfection of these new marvels, but we are still losing our light bulbs sometime soon.

sandra

Subject: RE: BS: Energy Saving - or Junk Mail?
From: Bee
Date: 18 Aug 08 - 07:27 PM

I know those CF bulbs are supposed to harbour poisons. But the rest of it doesn't compute with my experience.

Take my kitchen (please, take it!): I have two double-bulb fixtures on the ceiling there. Four years ago I paid twelve dollars for a six-pack of curly bulbs and put four of 'em in the kitchen. Those lights are on all day every day because the kitchen is under the roof slope and has no windows (please take it?).

When I used incandescents, I replaced all four bulbs about once every two months - that adds up. Since I replaced 'em, I've changed two bulbs - in four years. I replaced a lot of other incandescents over the following year, as they burned out. Bought the CFs on sale. I've had to replace one of those - in the bathroom we use most which also has no window, (same reason as above, please take it too). Without even considering the power bill, those things have saved me a fair amount.

Subject: RE: BS: Energy Saving - or Junk Mail?
From: John Hardly
Date: 18 Aug 08 - 07:14 PM

Speaking of energy savings and junk mail...

Please be smart enough to know this:

If your utility company OR ANY OTHER UTILITY COMPANY offers to "lock in" the price of natural gas so that, should gas prices soar this winter (with the strong hint that they might double, or some other such hyperbole) you will be able to save by being "locked in"...

IT IS A SCAM!!!! UNEQUIVOCALLY A SCAM!!!

Do not do it.

Subject: RE: BS: Energy Saving - or Junk Mail?
From: Peace
Date: 18 Aug 08 - 07:05 PM

Soon as ya start saving, the gas company will increase its charges to make up for lost revenue.

Subject: RE: BS: Energy Saving - or Junk Mail?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 18 Aug 08 - 07:02 PM

We have installed them coiling things that are supposed to save energy.
They cost one hell of a lot more. Had a couple burn out already.
They require more materials in their manufacture.
I hear that they add poisonous materials to land fill.

I think the best way to save is not to turn on lighting unless necessary.

Subject: RE: BS: Energy Saving - or Junk Mail?
From: Gurney
Date: 18 Aug 08 - 06:47 PM

Mr Red, here in NZ the current government has stated that it will ban the sale of incandescent bulbs in its next term of office.
Big sister is watching us.

Subject: BS: Energy Saving - or Junk Mail?
From: Mr Red
Date: 18 Aug 08 - 06:41 PM

I got a package - or a note from the Postie telling me it was too big for my aperture! Would I like to collect from the sorting office?

First attempt the place was closed (OK I read 14:00 as 4 pm)
Post office could redirect but the branch I asked couldn't do it, I could ring the sorting office and they were not there now! And anyway even on-line it would not get anywhere next day and re-direction is within the same town and not the 16 miles away where I work.

So another journey.

My Gas Utility have decided I need 4 energy saving light bulbs, howe nice! Now where do I turn on the gas and how should I light them?

Did they save me energy? Do I remonstrate with them for sending me junk mail after they had been told most firmly not to?

No! and Yes!