Origins: Lizzy Borden / Fall River Hoedown

Subject: RE: Origin: Fall River Hoedown
From: GerryM
Date: 16 Nov 21 - 12:20 AM

Michael Brown wrote it for a musical revue, New Faces of 1952. It's included in the movie, New Faces, that was made out of the revue in 1954. Brown recorded it on his album, Alarums and Excursions, 1962 (I think). And many people know it from the Chad Mitchell Trio recording. On the Brown album and the Trio album, it was called Lizzie Borden. [I'm writing all this from memory, a little fact-checking would not be out of order.]

All of the above are available on Youtube.

Subject: RE: Origin: Fall River Hoedown
From: Joe Offer
Date: 15 Nov 21 - 06:32 PM

Wikipedia says, "Lizzie Andrew Borden (July 19, 1860 – June 1, 1927) was an American woman tried and acquitted of the August 4, 1892, axe murders of her father and stepmother in Fall River, Massachusetts."

Back in the primitive days before digital cameras, I made a Halloween season evening visit to the home of Miss Lizzie Borden in Fall River, Massachusetts. I remember it being in a very nice neighborhood on a hillside. Many of the neighboring houses were the homes of sea captains.

FALL RIVER HOEDOWN (Lizzie Borden)[Digital Tradition Lyrics, uncorrected]
(Michael Brown)
(From Chad Mitchell Trio Recording)

[Spoken]
One very exciting area of folk idiom and folk music to us has
always been the hatchet murders in Massachusetts. I think that
this quaint bit of suburban living can best be explained through
the use of our poet laureate, Joe Frazier:

[Spoken(Joe)]
Elizabeth Borden took an ax
And gave her mother forty whacks
And when the job was nicely done
She gave her father forty one!

[Now the song]
Yesterday in old Fall River, Mr. Andrew Borden died
And he got his daughter Lizzie on a charge of homicide.
Some folks say she didn't do it, and others say she did
But they all agree Miss Lizzie B. was a problem sort of kid

'Cause you can't chop your poppa up in Massachusetts
Not even if it's planned as a surprise
No you can't chop your poppa up in Massachusetts
You know how neighbors love to criticize.

She got him on the sofa where he'd gone to take a snooze
And I hope he went to heaven' cause he wasn't wearing shoes
Lizzie kind of rearranged him with a hatchet, so they say
And then she got her mother in that same old-fashioned way,

But you can't can't chop your momma up in Massachusetts
Not even if you're tired of her cuisine
No, you can't chop your momma up in Massachusetts
You know it's almost sure to cause a scene.

Well, they really kept her hoppin' on that busy afternoon
With both down and upstairs chopping while she hummed a ragtime tune:
They really made her hustle and when all was said and done
She'd removed her mother's bustle when she wasn't wearing one.

Oh you can't chop your Momma up in Massachusetts
And then blame all the damage on the mice,
No you can't chop your Momma up in Massachusetts
That kind of thing just isn't very nice.

Now, It wasn't done for pleasure and it wasn't done for spite
And it wasn't done because the lady wasn't very bright,
She'd always done the slightest thing that mom and dad had bid
They said, "Lizzie cut it out! " so that's exactly what she did.

But you can't chop your poppa up in Massachusetts
And then get dressed and go out for a walk,
No, you can't chop your poppa up in Massachusetts
Massachusetts is a far cry from New York.

You can't chop your poppa up in Massachusetts---

[Shouted] Shut the door and lock and latch it
Here comes Lizzie with a brand new hatchet!

You can't chop your poppa up in Massachusetts---

[shouted] Such a snob I heard it said,
She met her pa and cut him dead!

You can't chop your poppa up in Massachusetts---

[shouted] Jump like a fish, jump like a porpoise
All join in in a habeas corpus.

No, you can't chop your poppa up in Massachusetts---
Massachusetts is a far cry from New York!

Note: Originally a production number in New Faces of 1952
(This rendition from Chad Mitchell Trio Recording, Mighty Day on Campus)
Copyright Michael Brown
@murder @family
filename[ FALLRIVR
RG


Lizzie Borden Hoedown - New Faces of 1952 (lyrics and music by Michael Brown):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54VQKEgCZHE

New Faces (entire movie):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkzH2WlQ8lE

---

Misbehavin' Maidens - "Fall River Hoedown"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upC_tBwFx-Q

---

Chad Mitchell Trio recording:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SuDBO1rIrb4

Chad Mitchell Trio sing at the Lizzie Borden House, 2010:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7LwgzUseegc

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chad Mitchell Trio: Lizzy Borden
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 30 Jun 03 - 10:54 PM

Rich r, thanks for the quotes from Burt. I would imagine that rhymes such as the 1923 version surfaced soon after the crime, but I would guess the 40 whacks doggerel is not the earliest.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chad Mitchell Trio: Lizzy Borden
From: raredance
Date: 30 Jun 03 - 10:20 PM

The Mitchell Trio version of the song is on three different CDs

The Chad Mitchell TRio - MIghty Day on Campus (Folk Era -reissue of original LP )

The Chad Mitchell Trio Reunion - Mighty Day (Folk Era)

The Very Best of the Chad Mitchell Trio - (Vanguard)

rich r

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chad Mitchell Trio: Lizzy Borden
From: raredance
Date: 30 Jun 03 - 10:11 PM

The little rhymes or jingles at least predate Lizzie Borden's death. Doggeral doesn't lend itself easily to a defamation lawsuit. Olive Burt (American Murder Ballads and Their Stories - 1958) lists some variants of the common refrain. She suggested the problem of how LB could do the deed and not be covered with blood could be explained by this one.

Lizzie Borden took an axe
And gave her mother forty whacks
Then she stood behind the door
And gave her father forty more.

Another one was:

Andrew Borden, he is dead;
Lizzie hit him on the head.
Lizzie killed her mother, too
What a horrid thing for Liz to do!

Ms. Burt says she heard children chanting this one in 1923 (i.e. before the death of LB)

Lizzie Borden, bend your head;
Don't you wish that you were dead?
Lizzie Borden bend your knee;
One, two, three - out goes she!

Then there is the joke:
A neighbor met Lizzie on the morning of August 4th, 1892, and asked her what time it was.
"I don't know," Lizzie replied, " I'll go axe father"

Burt was surprised that the events did not inspire any ballads at the time. She reports a poem that was purportedly in circulation at the time written by A L Bixby who may have been a reporter who covered the trials.

There's no evidence of guilt,
Lizzie Borden,
That should make your spirit wilt,
Lizzie Borden.
Many do not think that you
Chopped your father's head in two,
It's so hard a thing to do,
Lizzie Borden.

You have borne up under all,
Lizzie Borden
With a mighty show of gall,
Lizzie Borden.
But because your nerve is stout
Does not prove beyond all doubt
That you knocked the old folks out,
Lizzie Borden.


rich r

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chad Mitchell Trio: Lizzy Borden
From: masato sakurai
Date: 30 Jun 03 - 09:24 PM

My mistake. "Michael", that is. ~Masato

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chad Mitchell Trio: Lizzy Borden
From: Joe Offer
Date: 30 Jun 03 - 09:10 PM

Masato, is Brown's first name "Micheal"? That's not the standard spelling of that name, but people often spell it that way.
-Joe Offer-

Subject: Add: YOU CAN'T CHOP YOUR POPPA UP IN MASSACHUSSETS
From: masato sakurai
Date: 30 Jun 03 - 08:06 PM

This, I think, is copied from the original. Source: Jonathan Goodman, Bloody Versicles: The Rhymes of Crime (St. Martins, 1971, pp. 18-19; without tune).

YOU CAN'T CHOP YOUR POPPA UP IN MASSACHUSETTS
(Micheal Brown; featured in Leonard Sillman's Broadway revue, New Faces, 1952)

On hot day in old Fall River,
Mister Andrew Borden died,
And they book'd his daughter Lizzie
On a charge of homicide.
Some folks say, 'She didn't do it,'
Others say, 'Of course she did.'
But they all agree Miss Lizzie B.
Was quite a problem kid.

'Cause you can't chop your poppa up in Massachusetts,
Not even if it's planned as a surprise.
No, you can't chop your poppa up in Massachusetts,
You know how neighbours love to criticise.

Now, she got him on the sofa,
Where he'd gone to take a snooze,
And I hope he went to heaven,
'Cause he wasn't wearing shoes.
Lizzie kind of rearranged him
With a hatchet, so they say.
And then she got her mother
In that same old-fashioned way,

But you can't can't chop your momma up in Massachusetts,
Not even if you're tired of her cuisine.
No, you can't chop your momma up in Massachusetts;
If you do, you know there's bound to be a scene.

Now, It wasn't done for pleasure
And it wasn't done for spite,
And it wasn't done because the lady
Wasn't very bright.
She had always done the slightest thing
That mom and poppa bid.
They said, 'Lizzie cut it out,"
And that's exactly what she did.

But you can't chop your poppa up in Massachusetts,
And then get dressed to go out for a walk.
No, you can't chop your poppa up in Massachusetts;
Massachusetts is a far cry from New York.

~Masato

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chad Mitchell Trio: Lizzy Borden
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 30 Jun 03 - 07:49 PM

It's a 3 chord trick in D G and A.

I was kindly sent the tune as a midi by someone here, and I still have it on a floppy (if I can find it), so if you PM me with your email address I should be able to email it to you.

We used to alter the chorus so it was always mama in the first line and papa in the third so tht the audience could join in easier - almost shanty style.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chad Mitchell Trio: Lizzy Borden
From: Bendigo
Date: 30 Jun 03 - 07:43 PM

I thought the Lizzie Borden Trio was a classical music trio of Anne-Sophie Mutter on violin,Yo-Yo Ma on cello and Emmanuel Ax on piano.
          Yes, the Ax Ma Mutter trio....ah well

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chad Mitchell Trio: Lizzy Borden
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 30 Jun 03 - 07:39 PM

Where did the ax-whacks lines come from? Haven't found anything in the way of a song from the time of the trial. Of course one would have been open to suit during her lifetime (Died 1927).

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chad Mitchell Trio: Lizzy Borden
From: SINSULL
Date: 30 Jun 03 - 07:12 PM

Thanks Joe. I looked and didn't see it. DOH!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chad Mitchell Trio: Lizzy Borden
From: Joe Offer
Date: 30 Jun 03 - 07:08 PM

The answer to Sinsull's question is, of course, in the Digital Tradition.
Dick Greenhaus, are you proud of me?
-Joe Offer-

P.S. I double-checked the DT's information with that in The Great Song Thesaurus, and they agree. The lyrics are from the Chad Mitchell Trio recording, and I don't know if they're the same as the original. The Mitchell Trio Songbook does not have this song, and I don't believe we've had a tune submitted for this song.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chad Mitchell Trio: Lizzy Borden
From: SINSULL
Date: 30 Jun 03 - 06:47 PM

This song actually came from a Broadway musical. Anyone know the title?
SINS

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chad Mitchell Trio: Lizzy Borden
From: GUEST,Lidy
Date: 30 Jun 03 - 06:50 AM

The scariest thing I've ever seen was a play put on by some 15 year olds at my old school (I was visiting as a former head girl). They did the story of Lizzie Borden and the acting was superb and the atmosphere they created was downright terrifying. And at the end they did this layered chanting thing from different corners of the hall just going "Lizzie Borden took an axe and gave her father 40 whacks, and when she saw what she had done, she gave her mother 41" over and over again adding more voices and getting louder every time. And at the very end they somehow did this subliminal flicker thing where they just flashed red light on the stage and there were the three characters just standing there... I still get the jitters now just thinking about it!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chad Mitchell Trio: Lizzy Borden
From: GUEST,Paul Sullivan
Date: 30 Jun 03 - 02:30 AM

I'm trying to find a copy of the Fall River Hoedown (Ballad of Lizzie Borden) with guitar chords. Would appreciate any help.
Thanks,
Paul Sullivan

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chad Mitchell Trio : Lizzy Borden
From: Will Bakker
Date: 30 Oct 99 - 03:48 AM

This is funny. In 1966 we made a single with a Dutch translation of Lizzie Borden (Hakliedje) with on the flipside It ain't me babe (Dat ben ik niet). Our record company wanted us to record some songs in Dutch. So we did. Not that I'm very proud of the result, but it takes me back to the days when we (The Mudfield Skiffle Group) did many radio and television appearances and made four singles (only one in English- Molly Dee/Donna Donna). At the moment these over-fifty-guys are rehearsing again as "Mudfield" and do some concerts from time to time with other folkgroups from the sixties. Great fun and it even sounds better thanks to todays microphones and apmplifiers!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chad Mitchell Trio : Lizzy Borden
From: katlaughing
Date: 29 Oct 99 - 08:16 PM

JOE! HI! I looked under Lizzie...no wonder I didn't find it there! Nice to see you're about! kat

Subject: ADD : Lizzy Borden ^^^
From: katlaughing
Date: 29 Oct 99 - 08:15 PM

Here ya go, as found on metacrawler. I think it was just posted by a fan, so Massachusetts is spelled wrong, but I did not change it. Did you see the tv movie in which Elizabeth Montgomery acted as Lizzie? Quite well-done. kat

"Lizzie Borden"

(Sung by the Chad Mitchell Trio)

Yesterday in old Fall River, Mr. Andrew Borden died,
And they got his daughter Lizzie on a charge of homicide
Some folks say she didn't do it others say of course she did
But they all agree, Miss Lizzie B. was a problem kinda kid

'Cause you can't chop your papa up in Massachausettes(sic)
Not even if it's planned as a surprise
No, you can't chop your papa up in Massachausettes
You know how neighbors love to criticize

Well, she got him on the sofa where he'd gone to take a snooze,
And I hope he went to heaven, 'cause he wasn't wearing shoes
Lizzie kinda rearranged him with a hatchet so they say
Then she got her mother in that same old fashioned way

But you can't chop your mama up in Massachausettes
Not even if you're tired of her cuisine
No can't chop your mama up in Massachausettes
You know it's almost sure to cause a scene

Oh they really kept her hoppin on that busy afternoon
With both down and upstairs hoppin while she hummed a ragtime tune
They really made her hustle and when all was said and done
She removed her mother's bustle when she wasn't wearing one

Now can't chop your mama up in Massachausettes
And then blame all the damage on the mice
No you can't chop your mama up in Massachausettes
That sort of thing just isn't very nice.

Now it wasn't done for pleasure and it wasn't done for spite
And it wasn't done because the lady wasn't very bright
She'd always done the slightest thing that mom and papa bid
They said, "Lizzie, cut it out!" so that's exactly what she did!

But you can't chop your papa up in Massachausettes
And then get dressed and go out for a walk
No you can't chop your papa up in Massachausettes
Massachausettes is a far cry from New York

Shut the door and lock and latch it - here comes Lizzie with a brand new hatchet!

Such a snob I heard it said, she met her pa and cut him dead!

Jump like a fish - jump like a porpoise, all join hands and habeas corpus!

---

words and music by Michael Brown, 1952^^^

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Chad Mitchell Trio : Lizzy Borden
From: Joe Offer
Date: 29 Oct 99 - 08:12 PM

Hi - if you search our lyrics database for Borden, you'll find it. Feelin' lazy? - click here.

Subject: Chad Mitchell Trio : Lizzy Borden
From: packrat
Date: 29 Oct 99 - 07:18 PM

Searched the web for over an hour with no luck on finding anything other than the album for sale. Then I realized i should have gone here first. anybody know where i can find these?