BS: German award for Rumsfeld

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Dec 03 - 02:10 PM

Rumsfeld's paper on Defense - 1999.

Pearl Harbor events are ubiquitous in his writings.
http://www.angelfire.com/md2/customviolins/runsfeldtext.jpg

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Dec 03 - 02:00 PM

Rumsfeld as an Empire builder

http://www.angelfire.com/md2/customviolins/bushroman.jpg


New Rumsfeld/Goebbles Monument proposed...

http://www.angelfire.com/md2/customviolins/iraqmon.jpg

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: Pied Piper
Date: 22 Dec 03 - 12:54 PM

So the weasel worded Machiavellian hypocrite's got an award has he.
Might I suggest another; the Joseph Goebbels award for services to truth.

TTFN
PP

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: Steve Parkes
Date: 22 Dec 03 - 12:19 PM

Yes, Kevin, but technically it's "abroad"!

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 22 Dec 03 - 08:18 AM

<"...we never believed in shitting on our own doorstep".

Apart from Irelamd of course...

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: Steve Parkes
Date: 22 Dec 03 - 08:12 AM

... apart from Texas, California, etc.

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: Steve Parkes
Date: 22 Dec 03 - 08:11 AM

Was the "Old Europe" the one where, before WWI, a country would declare war on a neighbouring country an the other coutries would stand around and watch the fight? My History is a bit patchy, but I think Austria-Hungary spoiled the old system because (a) they were really two countries, and (b) they got their mates to gang up with them, so the little countries had to get their Big Brothers to come and sort 'em out.

In GB, we only picked fights with countries a long way off (once that Napoleonic business was sorted out -- he was another one who wouldn't Play The Game). Like the Americans, we never believed in shitting on our own doorstep.

Steve

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: Little Hawk
Date: 21 Dec 03 - 11:45 PM

That was the problem in Vietnam. Not enough fields. Too much jungle. Mind you, they tried hard to deal with that by spreading agent orange all over the place, but then those danged hippie protestors started mailing bricks to the Rand Corporation (postage due) and stuff like that, and it all went down the tubes. I blame Jane Fonda. And the press. And Joan Baez. And the New York Times. And Walter Cronkite. And the Chicago Seven. And Bobbie Kennedy. And Martin Luther King. And Muhammad Ali. And....

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 21 Dec 03 - 10:38 PM

The late Kenny Everet [ bless him ] used to do an American General character who had the same answer to all problems ' round em all up, put em in a field and bomb the bastards '
eric

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: GUEST
Date: 21 Dec 03 - 02:33 PM

Good Old American (Colonial ism ... ) Repeal the Land laws, declare war on the Navajo, heck lets cleanse Oklahoma as well. Then we can let Donald Footinmouth run for chief Gas Chamber manager.

Those pesky Indians not to mention the Mexicans...

Hooray for Old America!

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: Little Hawk
Date: 21 Dec 03 - 12:50 AM

Yes, it's been durable. The Civil War was its greatest test by far, and killed more Americans than any other war since...maybe more than all the others put together.

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 20 Dec 03 - 08:47 PM

One thing that can be missed is that the USA is one of the oldest countries around. Over two hundred years, and still with the same Constitution and system of Government! Not many like that. (The Isle of Man? Andorra?) You've got to admire how the old girl gets around, and still has a full set of teeth...

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: GUEST,Frank
Date: 20 Dec 03 - 07:03 PM

Since many of the great works of art, philosophy and science
come from "Old Europe", it's hard to see this term as a denegration.

A "New Europe" as a military base for America's current administration on the other hand would seem by contrast
rather disgusting desecration.

Frank

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: Bill D
Date: 20 Dec 03 - 05:00 PM

'old America' is a funny beast, McGrath..we spend 300 years absorbing complex mixtures of people from practically every culture on earth while trying to operate under a form of government designed to let everyone have input to the format and policies, and we still get questions that seem to be amazed the we can't operate in a cohesive, organized way on most issues. (That is, until something like Pearl Harbor happens.)

I suppose life for many here is almost too 'easy' to worry and think everyday....some seem to feel that "it will all be ok..it always is".

We have almost no mechanisms for changing government between elections..(yeah, recalls in states, and impeachment if it gets TOO bad)..so many people don't see any clear need to 'wake up' more than once every 4 years...and THAT process has become so pre-digested and tedious that it is boring! (and I suspect the the powers that currently be would just as soon keep us snoozing while they continue to automate the "democratic process" so as not to disturb our naps.)

uh....that IS what you asked about, isn't it? :>0

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 20 Dec 03 - 02:01 PM

When's the "old America" going to wake up?

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: Little Hawk
Date: 20 Dec 03 - 12:08 PM

Bravo for "the old Europe", I say! Way to go, Donald.

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Dec 03 - 11:47 AM

Donald knows that after the election he may not have a job. We know that Donald knows one thing. What we now know is Donald's knowning. This is a known known ING.

But it all depends on what is is..

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 20 Dec 03 - 09:23 AM

Actually that known-unknown things is quite right and relevant.

Runsfeld didn't make it up - I read where someone chased up a philosophy text from which he'd lifted it. You've got to punctuate it properly, of course, and I think some newspapers had a bit of a problem there, because they don't normally worry too much about doing stuff like that.

And just imagine Bush trying to get through a sentence like that, even with an autocue...

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 20 Dec 03 - 07:05 AM

The Germans actually have a word for Rumsfeld, DUMKOPF.
irec.

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: Ebbie
Date: 20 Dec 03 - 04:25 AM

Prefaced by: (Loosely paraphrased)

There are known knowns, we know that we know them, but there are also known unknowns, we know we don't know them. There are also unknown unknowns, we don't know them- and there are more of them every week.

Subject: RE: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: Donuel
Date: 19 Dec 03 - 07:12 AM

"This new known as opposed to old knowns was unknown until we made it known worldwide. Unknown knowns are still a threat to our national security that we know we can come to know better. Unknown unknowns however are our greatest challenge to make known to those with a need to know."

Subject: BS: German award for Rumsfeld
From: Wolfgang
Date: 19 Dec 03 - 06:36 AM

The end of the year is the time for several yearly awards like sportsman of the year etc. Today has been announced that the German 'word of the year' award goes to Rumsfeld for 'das alte Europa' ('the old Europe'). The award is given for new words or a new sense in a combination of words that is likely to make a lasting contribution to the German language (Tschernobyl, holocaust, Aids are examples of winners in other years). The committee said that the expression 'the old Europe' has added to the coherence of Europe and has increased the proudness for an independent position. Whether this has been the purpose of the author of that expression, the committee said, is immaterial for the award (it is an immaterial award which goes to the word and not to the person, though mostly the persons mentioned are proud about it).

Thank you, Donald, for giving us this expression. We are proud to make use of it, though a tiny bit differently from what you may have had in mind.

Wolfgang