BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???

Subject: RE: BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Dec 04 - 03:40 PM

But it isn't widely practiced in Ireland. It seems to be more wishful thinking than tradition, especially when compared with the other traditions, like getting pissed with the lads on New Years, for instance.

Subject: RE: BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Dec 04 - 03:34 PM

Sorry, typed too fast. That's Nollaig na mBan.

Subject: RE: BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Dec 04 - 03:17 PM

In many parts of Ireland, the day is known as Women's Christmas, or Nollaig mBan, which always made me wonder if there isn't a connection to La Befana, and some of those other ladies of the season.

Subject: RE: BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???
From: Emma B
Date: 28 Dec 04 - 03:16 PM

Where my friends live, off the west coast of Ireland, "Little Christmas" is celebrated by the menfolk taking over all the household chores and childminding for the day. I don't know how old this "tradition" is but I can vouch for it's popularity amongst the women!

Subject: RE: BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 28 Dec 04 - 03:09 PM

In that lovely song, "The Cherry Tree Carol", Jesus (miraculously speaking from the womb) has been asked when he will be born, and he says:

The sixth day of January
My birthday will be
When the stars in the elements
Shall tremble with glee
When the stars in the elements
Shall tremble with glee!"

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 28 Dec 04 - 01:55 PM

Twelfth night is Epiphany. Gifts were given then, in commemoration of the gifts given by the Magi. It's been a while since 2yr old boys were slaughtered though..... (side story ~ the Star appeared when Jesus was born so it would have taken the Magi a while to notice it and find Him. They stopped off at Herod's place on the way, which is why, when he realised he'd been tricked, had all the boys of 2 and under killed).

To get people into the habit with the new calendar (when 11 days were 'stolen' to bring the calendar into line) it was put about that it was unlucky to have your decorations or your feasting after that day. It probably was too.. the local priest and authorities would come and punish you for celebrating at the wrong time. The Orthodox churches still celebrate Christmas on 6th January.

The season of Christmas doesn't end until Feb 2nd, Candlemass, so you can keep your decorations up until then if you like!

There are lots of Twelfth night traditions around, but I can't lay my hand on the book at the moment.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???
From: PoppaGator
Date: 28 Dec 04 - 01:33 PM

I've always heard the Epiphany referred to as *Little* Christmas, not "Old" Christmas.

One of my former employers used to brag about how his wonderful "old" family (descended from the earliest French settlers of New Orleans) always kept Christmas as a purely religious holy day, and waited until Twelfth Night (Li'l Christmas) to exchange gifts. You could always count on one of the long-term employees to mutter that the cheap bastard was just making sure he bought his kids their presents on sale, avoiding the crowds and the hassle of shopping in December.

One aspect of Little Christmas that our family almost always observes -- it's the day to "strike the set," taking down the tree and lights and other seasonal decorations. Here in New Orleans (and, presumably, in Venice and Rio and wherever Carnival is observed), Twelfth Night marks not only the end of Christmastide but also the beginning of the Carnival season that culminates on Mardi Gras Day. So, out with the red and green decor and in with the purple, green and gold!

Subject: RE: BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???
From: GUEST,pattyClink
Date: 27 Dec 04 - 01:58 PM

Cross-linking from another thread, pretty rich source on Wassailing done on Twelfth Night / Epiphany

Wassail Page

Subject: RE: BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 27 Dec 04 - 10:49 AM

6th January is of course still Christmas anyway, whven in places where this is celebrated on 25th December - it's the last day of Christmas, and, as such, it's The Feast of the Epiphany, which has the visit of the Wise Men/Magi/Three Kings as the centre piece.

It is a pretty big day anyway, traditionally. It's when children are supposed to get their presents in many European countries. (In Italy they are supposed to be nrought by The Befana - an old lady who missed out on getting along to the First Christams, so she's been making up for it ever since.)

Subject: RE: BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???
From: Hollowfox
Date: 27 Dec 04 - 10:23 AM

It's also when christmas is celebrated in the Orthodox church.
One tradition I read long ago is that water will turn to wine on that midnight. I wish I could remember where I read it; I was supposed to be studying something in college. The story also had a warning in it. A man hid in the barn to see if the animals talked, presumably to hear about the fortunes of the coming year, or perhaps he hoped they'd mention a hidden treasure. At midnight, two voices were heard in the barn. "The water is wine!" "Yes, and you're mine."
By the way, Richard Chase's book Grandfather Tales has some nice stuff about Old Christmas in western North Carolina, including a mummer's play.

Subject: RE: BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???
From: MMario
Date: 27 Dec 04 - 10:18 AM

Techically if you wanted to celebrate "Old Christmas" then it should be ANOTHER 12 days - or January 18th - so that you are celebrating on the 12th night of Christmas according to the old calender...

or take your pick as to which "Old Christmas" you want to celebrate - because the gift giving portion was originally more an epiphany thing - but then because of the calender change...

Subject: RE: BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???
From: mg
Date: 27 Dec 04 - 10:11 AM

It's the feast of the Epipheny isn't it? That is when gifts were exchanged. I'd never heard of the Julian calendar thing. When was the Ephipheny on that calendar? mg

Subject: RE: BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???
From: wysiwyg
Date: 27 Dec 04 - 08:39 AM

Or try this approach:

The Day I Kicked Santa's Ass, And Other Christmas Tales

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???
From: Mrs.Duck
Date: 27 Dec 04 - 07:08 AM

The benefits of celebrating a Julian Christmas are many. You can buy all the presents at sale prices and send Christmas cards without them getting snarled up in the post. The down side is that the 6th January is the first day of the spring term at school so I have to return to work. Bah humbug!

Subject: RE: BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???
From: gnu
Date: 27 Dec 04 - 05:32 AM

How does a chicken kneel ? Or, along the lines of your post, "Why did the chicken kneel?" (Sorry, couldn't resist)You could burn your new Xmas tree for warmth on your midnight vigil.

Subject: RE: BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 27 Dec 04 - 05:31 AM

You could adopt the old Viking tradition of Up Helly A, as used in Shetland.
Guiser Jarl
Giok

Subject: RE: BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 27 Dec 04 - 01:18 AM

It's all part of Christian Myth Tradition that all creation, including the 'Old Religion Gods' acknowledged the birth of Jesus.

Subject: BS: Old Christmas New Tradition???
From: Pogo
Date: 26 Dec 04 - 11:47 PM

I'm trying to get a new tradition started in my family of celebrating January 6th is it? (Old Christmas according to the Julian calender) Any suggestions, recipes, traditions tied to old Christmas that I can integrate into our celebration?

My mother recounted a neat old superstition my great-grandfather believed in, that all the cows, mules, farm animals etc. would kneel at old Christmas at the stroke of midnight...we might include a midnight watch as part of the celebration ;O) incidentally anybody know the story behind why the animals are supposed to do that?

thanks Mudcatters!!!