BS: What means 'responsible'?

Subject: RE: BS: What means 'responsible'?
From: wysiwyg
Date: 16 Dec 05 - 08:52 PM

I disagree. I think when a lame duck claims responsibility, what he's asking us to do is to chalk the matter up to his personal record, and not blame his staff or other cronies who hope not to be punished in the next election.

Specifically, I think the way he worded it means, "I did it and you might not like it, but it was may call and I made it and it's OK with me if you don't like me-- but don't toss my clones out, or the people my handlers put up in my place, next time around. Blame ME, cuz I don't care WHAT you think of my priorities, cuz I am the Chief and I WILL wage my jihads as I see fit."

And now his underlings and handlers can deflect our accusations about their own responsibility-- they can safely blame him without fear of offending him-- cuz isn't that what lame ducks are FOR?

That's what I heard, anway.

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: What means 'responsible'?
From: bobad
Date: 16 Dec 05 - 03:26 PM

Except that Georgie doesn't have the wherewithal to plot this out for himself, the script was probably written out by his advisors.

Subject: RE: BS: What means 'responsible'?
From: Amos
Date: 16 Dec 05 - 03:10 PM

ROTFLMAO! Deda, I think you have hit the subtext right between the squinty li'l eyes!


A

Subject: RE: BS: What means 'responsible'?
From: Deda
Date: 16 Dec 05 - 02:18 PM

In Bush's case I think this word means: "Golly, if I call myself responsible, people like me better than they do if I say I had nothing to do with it. My poll numbers have been in the toilet, so I'll say I'm responsible for something, then they'll like me and I'll get to be like the Oscar Meyer weiner for another day. And absolutely nothing has to change one iota. Hey, cool! Lookit me, I'm responsible, I'm responsible, hey look, I'm responsible, ha ha ha!"

Subject: RE: BS: What means 'responsible'?
From: EBarnacle
Date: 16 Dec 05 - 10:37 AM

When I was in my psychotherapy training program, we were taught to encourage people to think in terms of responsible, rather than guilty.

Responsibility says I chose to do this action. It implies that the doer did nothing wrong and sees no need to punish him/herself. It also implies that, if the consequences were unsatisfactory, they would be addressed and corrected.

Guilty includes the expectation of or being deserving of punishment.

In general, the differentiation is between being a child and an adult. As such, SOB chose the wrong word. There is not way he is an adult.

Subject: RE: BS: What means 'responsible'?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 16 Dec 05 - 08:43 AM

Don't blame me, I was only giving orders.

Subject: RE: BS: What means 'responsible'?
From: open mike
Date: 16 Dec 05 - 06:38 AM

i think of it as meaning Able to Respond....

Subject: RE: BS: What means 'responsible'?
From: John O'L
Date: 16 Dec 05 - 01:52 AM

Carol C has it. He is saying "I'm to blame but I'm humble & honest enough to admit it, and you can also assume the presence of some kind of inner strength enabling me to rise above all that's petty and insignificant to become almost...well, statesmanlike...
In fact I'm a better president now, having admitted and gloried in my dishonesty & guilt than I was before when I was simply dishonest and guilty."

Subject: RE: BS: What means 'responsible'?
From: Amos
Date: 15 Dec 05 - 08:00 PM

Acknowledging one's own causation, is what it means; as such Bush's assertions are partial and cosmetic, but they are a LOT better than he did last year. But being anything but right is beyond him, I reckon.


A

Subject: RE: BS: What means 'responsible'?
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 15 Dec 05 - 05:00 PM

Agree, CarolC, just a minor change: Not a request for, but an assumption of forgiveness; I find that assumption infuriating.

Subject: RE: BS: What means 'responsible'?
From: CarolC
Date: 15 Dec 05 - 04:44 PM

Reagan took responsibility for the Iran Contra scandal, and he never offered to resign either. In the US, apparently, admitting responsibility for a serious error or infraction is merely a request for forgiveness, or an indication that we are supposed to forget the error or infraction, pretend it never happened, and move on.

Subject: RE: BS: What means 'responsible'?
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 15 Dec 05 - 04:43 PM

The missing sentences are:
"It is true that much of the intelligence turned out to be wrong. SO THE REASONS I GAVE FOR ATTACKING IRAQ & SADDAM WERE ERRONEOUS. I EITHER LIED, OR I WAS TOO STUPID TO REALISE THE INFORMATION WAS WRONG. As president I am responsible for the decision to go into Iraq...etc etc etc"

Subject: RE: BS: What means 'responsible'?
From: Wolfgang
Date: 15 Dec 05 - 04:03 PM

There I was thinking that the English understanding of 'I am responsible (for a mistake, serious error)' was in some subtle way different from the German translation.

For when in Germany a minister or chancellor starts talking like Bush did in Dick's quote you can be fairly sure that in the next sentence he'll declare he resigns.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: BS: What means 'responsible'?
From: Beer
Date: 15 Dec 05 - 03:47 PM

Wouldn't it be wonderful to have Lenny Bruce with us to hear what he would have to say.

Subject: RE: BS: What means 'responsible'?
From: autolycus
Date: 15 Dec 05 - 03:28 PM

So what is "taking responsibility" supposed to mean? If thousands upon thousands upon thousands die, or it's illegal, that he resigns. As a Lenny Henry character wouls say,""I dawn't fink sooooo."

Subject: RE: BS: What means 'responsible'?
From: GUEST,ehee
Date: 15 Dec 05 - 11:56 AM

He's admitting that it was done on faulty intelligence, but he's asserting that it was still a good idea anyway, so therefore he's glad he did it, and willing to take responsibility for it. I think that's what he means. That makes sense to him, but probably not to most other people, but it would depend on who you talk to.

Subject: BS: What means 'responsible'?
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 15 Dec 05 - 11:52 AM

"It is true that much of the intelligence turned out to be wrong. As president I am responsible for the decision to go into Iraq," Bush told a foreign policy forum on the eve of elections to establish Iraq's first permanent, democratically elected government.

I always thought that "responsibility" carried an implicit threat of some punisment for mis- or mal- or non-feasance. Apparently not.

Like Nixon, who claimed to be "..responsible but not guilty..", I suspect that what's really meant is "guilty, but irresponsible."