BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?

Subject: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: GUEST,Cold S
Date: 13 Jul 04 - 05:21 PM

(C)hurch (O)f the (L)atter (D)ay (S)aints = Cold S..great Nic hey.
Why do the Mormon Temples have freemasons symbols on their silk baptism trunks???? Who is running who here please?

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: michaelr
Date: 13 Jul 04 - 07:25 PM

Both controlled in secret by the Illuminati, just as Bush and Kerry are.

Next question!

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Blackcatter
Date: 13 Jul 04 - 11:46 PM

Gnomes of Zurich

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 13 Jul 04 - 11:52 PM

heloo, waht all this is about?

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 14 Jul 04 - 02:02 AM

I dunno, but it sounds like another case of bigotry. We've had quite a spell of that lately. I'm getting sick of it.
-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: GUEST,John O'Lennaine
Date: 14 Jul 04 - 02:57 AM

Dan Brown, in "Angels and Demons" suggests that the Freemasons have been infiltrated by a less desirable incarnation of the Illuminati after the Masons gave them refuge from Vatican persecution (as scientists) hundreds of years ago.

His contention is that the Illuminati have powerful men situated in all levels of government and in all major financial institutions worldwide.

Joss Weddon has a similar group which he calls The Circle of Thorns, but they don't seem to have been powerful enough to save themselves form the Network's sponsors, who are probably Illuminati members.

I don't know where the Mormons come in, but the suggestion that Bush is Illuminati is a scarey one, and feasable.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 14 Jul 04 - 04:36 AM

It's all secret jOhn, masons and morons= secret society.

eric

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: el ted
Date: 14 Jul 04 - 05:23 AM

Some masons are masons, and some mormons are mormons.... errrh... I'll get my coat!

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Jul 04 - 10:20 AM

gee - ever think it is possible for more then one tradition to use the same symbols?

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Blackcatter
Date: 14 Jul 04 - 01:07 PM

Ya mean like the swastika?

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 14 Jul 04 - 02:19 PM

The swastika, with different meanings and history, was commonly used by the Navajo and other groups until it became identified with the Nazis.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 14 Jul 04 - 06:19 PM

Tha Nazis, Adolf in particular, were also responsible for the ruination of that cool facial feature, the square mustache.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: GUEST,marks
Date: 14 Jul 04 - 09:32 PM

They are all controlled by space aliens from the Greater Magellenic Cloud - and they are so far ahead of us technically that we might as well go with the flow and not worry about it.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Blackcatter
Date: 14 Jul 04 - 11:36 PM

the Greater Magellenic Cloud is just a front.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: GUEST,Dáithí
Date: 15 Jul 04 - 08:26 AM

...and swastikas feature in some masonic ritual (as well as Roman mosaics and Indian texts) as do pentagrams.
That's the trouble with having a few thousand years of history to draw form. Those guys were lucky!

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Les from Hull
Date: 15 Jul 04 - 09:29 AM

Freemason and Mormons? I think they're both in league with Great Cthulhu, the Mafia, the Fungi from Yuggoth, the Bavarian Illuminati, the Boy Scouts of America, the Arms Industry, Folk Singers, Lepidopterists, Taxi Drivers, Stoats and Weasels...

There's a lot more to add, but I've got to go and pick up my prescription.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: el ted
Date: 15 Jul 04 - 09:52 AM

Don't forget cough medicine Les. The forecast ain't too good for tomorrow night. Oh, and get some garlic to keep the beast of Farlington at bay.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: beadie
Date: 15 Jul 04 - 10:11 AM

Les:

Be careful with whom you associate the "stoats and weasels." As a ferret owner, a lover of mustelidae of all sorts and (some would say) a weasel myself, I believe that using this family's name as an analogy for any religious or fraternal organization such as the Mormons or Masons is an offense to the animals.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Les from Hull
Date: 15 Jul 04 - 11:10 AM

I was always getting mixed up between the two, then someone told me that weasels are weaselly recognised and stoats are stoatally different. But you've got to admit they're sneaky little devils, these mustalids. There's obviously something going on there.

I like a ferret, me. Who can ever forget John 'Otto' Cleese's plainive rendition of 'I've got a ferret sticking up my nose'? That's what music's all about, mate.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Blackcatter
Date: 15 Jul 04 - 11:18 AM

Millard Fillmore

-------------

They've changed the voting! We can no longer vote for presidents who's dolls the company already makes. They haven't changed the results to George Washington is effectively on top of Reagan forever. I wish I could have gotten Lincoln over Nixon though.

Keep voting for Fillmore though. It's just gotten a bit easier sicne Clinton, Reagan and Washington cannot be added to.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: GUEST,reality
Date: 15 Jul 04 - 08:28 PM

Some masons are masons.


Some masons are just a jar.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Rapparee
Date: 15 Jul 04 - 10:10 PM

Ah, ya know, the fact that symbols used by Freemasonry are also used on the "Temple Garments" (which are themselves derived from the long underwear worn by 19th C. farmers) of Mormons is not exactly news.

The official name is "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints" or, unofficially, the LDS Church or Mormon Church. It's somehow more polite to refer to members of that church as being "LDS" rather than "Mormons" but either is acceptable.

There is also the Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, which was founded by Emma and Joseph Smith Jr. when Brigham Young grabbed the reins after the "Saints" (as they call themselves) fled Nauvoo. Still a third group split off and settled on Beaver Island, Michigan; the founder of this group grabbed dictatorial power and was finally gunned down by his followers.

The LDS Church is a direct descendant of (and subservient to) the Discalced Knights Templars, which survived by fleeing to North America and are now working hand in glove with the Tri-Lateral Commission and the Moloch Worshippers at the Bohemian Club in San Francisco.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: A Wandering Minstrel
Date: 16 Jul 04 - 08:14 AM

It should be noted that Dan Brown is an excellent writer of FICTION!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: GUEST,John O'Lennaine
Date: 16 Jul 04 - 09:32 AM

Minstrel -

That's true, but good fiction is always surrounded by and based on fact, and Brown is renowned for the exhaustive research behind his novels.

I'm not saying that everything he writes is necessarily true, but given the political state of the world at present, one can be forgiven for wondering.

There are all sorts of theories about Mormons, Masons, Knights Templar and Illuminati, and most of it is fairly obviously malicious bigotry as Joe said earlier, but this should not prevent us from asking questions about the true reasons our national leaders do what they do. Especially when what they do is otherwise so mystifying.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Rapparee
Date: 16 Jul 04 - 09:42 AM

Mystifying? The word should be "mistifying" because they're wandering around in a fog.

Don't discount blind ignorance, fanaticism, and congenital stupidity.

As for the Illuminati, etc. etc. running things -- former male bovine nutriment! Give the human race some credit for being able to screw things up without guidance, will ya?

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: GUEST,crazy little woman
Date: 16 Jul 04 - 02:49 PM

Re "There is also the Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, which was founded by Emma and Joseph Smith Jr. when Brigham Young grabbed the reins after the "Saints" (as they call themselves) fled Nauvoo."

This church has had the name "Community of Christ" since April, 2001.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 16 Jul 04 - 02:51 PM

To quote: "Why do the Mormon Temples have freemasons symbols on their silk baptism trunks????"

I never both with people who pepper their correspondence with repeated question marks or exclamation points. Such marks look SO juvenile.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: darkriver
Date: 16 Jul 04 - 04:40 PM

Let's not forget W.A.S.T.E. either.
The biggest, the baddest....

Doug

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Rapparee
Date: 17 Jul 04 - 03:43 PM

Crazy li'l woman -- I didn't know that. Thank you! Last I knew, they owned the Temple at Kirtland, OH.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 17 Jul 04 - 03:50 PM

Nothing to do with Gnomes BC. Stop putting these ugly rumours about;-)

I think evrything is run by the people that run everything...

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: GUEST,John O'Lennaine
Date: 17 Jul 04 - 10:32 PM

I've just read the first 118 pages of "Deception Point" and I retract everything I said earlier in support of Dan Brown.

It's a crappy book.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: GUEST,John O'Lennaine
Date: 17 Jul 04 - 10:33 PM

So far.

Still reading.

(Sigh)

John

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: C-flat
Date: 18 Jul 04 - 02:47 PM

I'm in the middle of the same book myself.
I really enjoyed the "Davinci Code" and "Angels and Demons" but I find myself skipping through this one without being properly engaged in it.
C-flat.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Peace
Date: 18 Jul 04 - 05:12 PM

It should be 'whom'.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: GUEST,John O'Lennaine
Date: 18 Jul 04 - 08:33 PM

C flat -

I loved "Angels & Demons" and "Digital Fortress" is just as good, but this one seems to use the same formula without enough substance to justify it.
Still reading, but only just.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Rapparee
Date: 18 Jul 04 - 08:39 PM

For you Da Vinci cryptographers -- the book is a novel. Fiction. Untruth. Made up. A lie written for profit.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: C-flat
Date: 19 Jul 04 - 03:22 AM

Most fictional books are written for profit. What I like (usually) about Dan Brown is the way he works in a lot of factual information around his story to give it more credibility. He certainly does his research.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 19 Jul 04 - 12:36 PM

My opinion is, it's the morons who are in the ascendancy at the moment. In Washington, I mean.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Blackcatter
Date: 19 Jul 04 - 12:45 PM

DtG,

Of course you're going to deny that.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Once Famous
Date: 19 Jul 04 - 12:57 PM

Last I heard Jackie Mason was not in charge of the Osmond family.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Jul 04 - 08:56 PM

Rapaire -

You say that with such conviction.
Certainty of that calibre always makes me uneasy.

Is it so unbelievable that a handful of the obscenely wealthy might club together in order to further their own aims covertly?

That's all it would need.
Oh, and for most of us to dismiss such notions as impossible fantasy.
It would need that too.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: GUEST,John O'Lennaine
Date: 19 Jul 04 - 09:03 PM

Sorry.
8.56 pm was me.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Bill Hahn//\\
Date: 19 Jul 04 - 10:03 PM

Ah the DaVinci Code. What a winner he had with that one.   

I must admit ---without giving away the twist ending---I did like his interpretation of symbols---from the crucifix, the even sided (Swiss/Templar) cross and the star of David.   Loved the symbolism he created there---or as the Ronnie Gilbert/Holly Near song says---and I love it---There is Something About The Women.


Bill Hahn

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Rapparee
Date: 19 Jul 04 - 10:13 PM

What I find unbelievable is that humans beings could keep secrets like that needed for hundreds of years, not that some might club together for power.

Not even the Catholic Church has been able to do that, and it's had a pretty long run.

It's just not human nature, and the Second Law of Thermodynamics holds for human institutions are well as in physics.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: GUEST,Pakise
Date: 21 Jul 04 - 01:12 AM

Re "There is also the Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, which was founded by Emma and Joseph Smith Jr. when Brigham Young grabbed the reins after the "Saints" (as they call themselves) fled Nauvoo."
FYI-
The Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints came into being in the 1850s. The "Reorganization" believed that Joseph Smith Jr. had designated his eldest son, Joseph III, to be his successor as president of the church. The Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints was organized on April 6, 1860, at Amboy, Illinois, under the leadership of Joseph Smith III.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Rapparee
Date: 21 Jul 04 - 11:52 AM

Sorry about the confusion; there's enough without me added to it.

From an article on Emma Hale Smith:

"The suspension of the Relief Society in 1844, only two years after its organization, was later attributed by John Taylor to Emma's opposition to plural marriage or polygyny (more commonly, polygamy) and concern over her use of the society to preach against it ("Minutes of the General Meeting," [of the Retrenchment Association], July 17, 1880, reported in the Woman's Exponent 9 [Sept. 1, 1880]:53-54). The practice had been privately disclosed as a Church principle in 1840, and Emma's ambivalence enabled her husband to act on her brief acceptance of the doctrine long enough to take additional wives. But her rejection of the principle soon became paramount. Loyal to her husband for seventeen years through all the vicissitudes that his mission had entailed, Emma Smith was unable, at the end, to make the sacrifice that the doctrine of plural marriage required. She struggled between her faith in her husband's prophetic role and her aversion to a principle that he, as Prophet, had been instructed to institute.

After Joseph's martyrdom in June 1844, Emma unfortunately became a symbol of the dissension within the Church. Unable to condone continuation of the practice of plural marriage or the leadership of Brigham Young, who supported it, and ambivalent about the proper line of succession to her husband, Emma made her first priority after her husband's death the preservation of an inheritance for her five living children. Distinguishing Joseph's personal property from that of the Church defied easy solution, however, and involved Brigham Young and Emma Smith in a series of complex and often bitter legal entanglements. Brigham Young, as president of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles and steward of the Church, claimed all that he felt rightfully belonged to its members. Emma Smith, as guardian of Joseph's children, just as vigorously claimed their share, to which she had contributed throughout her marriage to Joseph. Unable to reach an amicable solution and unwilling to accept plural marriage even in principle, Emma elected to remain in Nauvoo with her family while Brigham Young led the majority of Church members to the Rocky Mountains in 1846. On December 23, 1847, Emma Smith married Lewis Bidamon, a non-Mormon, further estranging her from the Church, to which she had once been known as the Elect Lady. Bidamon assisted Emma in raising her five children and remained her companion until her death in 1879 in Nauvoo.

In 1860, Emma's eldest son, Joseph Smith III, after four years of refusal, accepted the invitation to serve as prophet and first president of the Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. It was offered by a group of men who formerly had been members of the Church, many of whom had left to follow James J. Strang for a time. As a group they chose not to go west with the body of the Church. Emma, who had heretofore rejected connection with any of the splinter Mormon groups, was admitted into membership in 1860. In his acceptance speech, Joseph III firmly rejected polygamy as a practice of the new church, and Emma denied that her husband had participated in the practice."

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: GUEST,The Insider
Date: 22 Jul 04 - 04:49 PM

The Church of Jesus Christ and Latter Day Saints, or LDS, is a quasi-Masonic secret society. LDS shares its roots, and hence certain characteristics, with many secret societies, including the Knights Templar, the Freemasons, and the Illuminati.

Like the mythical hydra, many secret societies are in fact different heads of the same Beast.

"And I saw a beast rising out of the sea, having ten horns and seven heads." (Revelations 13:1).

Vigliantabus.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: GUEST,The Insider
Date: 22 Jul 04 - 04:58 PM

The Beast is an allegory for those with eyes to see, and ears to hear.

"If thou understandeth this, thou knowest enough."

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 Jul 04 - 06:47 PM

Oh, it's certainly an allegory all right. It probably refers to an alliance of nations and national leaders. The only question is: which alliance and when? There have been many theories about that over the last 2,000 years.

Subject: RE: BS: Freemasons/mormons,who runs who?
From: Pogo
Date: 22 Jul 04 - 08:00 PM

*coughs gently*

Perhaps...yawl should just ask a Mormon instead of going on assumptions, rumors and " well I've heard..."?

BTW I must confess we have lizard overlords living in the vaults underneath the Temple as well. My lizard-master's name is Zortarf and he's always taken very good care of me I must say as long as I cook his shoo-fly pie just right.

And just for the record Mormons and Masons are two different things by the way...that I am quite certain of but you know...I'm just LDS I don't know that I'd make a good authority on the subject of Mormons.

;O) Any other questions my dears?