DT Threads in the future

Subject: DT Threads in the future
From: GUEST,Bill Kennedy
Date: 26 Jun 02 - 03:17 PM

This is for general discussion, prompted by the immediate experience of the 'early Leonard Cohen' thread, which not everyone will read. Hopefully this thread title is inviting enough to draw more 'Catters into the discussion that follows, if not feel free to retitle it or direct others to it if you deem it important enough.

Having come upon many instances where a 'link' given in a thread is no longer available, and knowing that in general the web life of various sites is not eternal, I would propose that some pertinent information that is being referred to in a 'link' be also entered in a thread message, so it remains available for the life of the thread. Not to say that the 'click here' function is not quick easy and attractive, but it becomes useless when that 'here' is no longer 'there'. I guess it goes along with the general idea of DT Study threads, cleaning up the data base, etc. for someone to synopsize what the link was for, and offer the info as well in a thread. What say you all?

Subject: RE: DT Threads in the future
From: MMario
Date: 26 Jun 02 - 03:21 PM

it does make sense -

Subject: RE: DT Threads in the future
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Jun 02 - 03:23 PM

I'd agree up to a point - for the lyric requests that can be found quicky and easily at any number of locations, I think 'Click Here' is still the best approach.

Subject: RE: DT Threads in the future
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Jun 02 - 03:33 PM

The question was also discussed in this previous thread

Subject: RE: DT Threads in the future
From: GUEST,Bill Kennedy
Date: 26 Jun 02 - 03:47 PM

thanks, second guest, I would never have thought to search the forum, and if not obvious, I am referring to links external to DT only.

Here's what Joe Offer said in link of guest above:

"If lyrics are in the Forum or the Digital Tradition already, please do not post them again. If somebody requests that song, post a link or copy-paste the URL of the thread where the song is located. If the lyrics are offsite please post them (unless they're pop lyrics that people aren't likely to request again). Two reaons for that - links tend to expire, and then then we don't have access to the song any more. Secondly, lyrics that are posted in the form can be found by a Mudcat search, and that's very handy."

I guess it's been discussed enough before, but my experience is that in many threads that go back a ways, that are resuscitated, earlier links are often no longer available, so it doesn't hurt to reiterate this here, even if it may be in the FAQ, which I confess I don't always immediately look to for answers.

Subject: RE: DT Threads in the future
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 26 Jun 02 - 04:31 PM

Good advice - on a number of occasions I've posted a link to songs on my own website rather than post the words, and now I've had to move the website to another server, which means those links won't work properly. I'll know better in future.

But this is for songs and information about songs - when it comes to other stuff people are arguing about, I am all in favour of using links for long articles that are seen as relevant etc, rather than posting them in threads here.

Subject: RE: DT Threads in the future
From: Susan of DT
Date: 26 Jun 02 - 09:29 PM

I still prefer teaching people how to search the Digital Tradition to giving them a link.

Subject: RE: DT Threads in the future
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 26 Jun 02 - 10:01 PM

So do I. Within minutes, though, several people will turn up providing links (more or less useful, as links made through some routines will last, and others will not) without making any effort to explain what they've done, and will quite often criticise us for not being as helpful as they imagine they have been. If you want to help someone to do a job, don't do it for them; show them how to use the tools for themselves, so next time they can find their own way; and can teach others.

Subject: RE: DT Threads in the future
From: Wolfgang
Date: 27 Jun 02 - 05:18 AM

As for information in the forum or the DT, Malcolm and Susan make a lot of sense and I shall follow that advice. As for Bill's specific question, should we include lyrics (information) from an outside source instead of a link, yes, if the lyrics or the information are relevant to Blues/Folk in a broad sense. Otherwise, no. For pop lyrics or no-music questions I prefer a link.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: DT Threads in the future
From: Joe Offer
Date: 27 Jun 02 - 05:47 PM

I think it's best to keep Mudcat as rule-free as possible, but some people have taken to copy-pasting long articles that have nothing to do with music. Here's what I posted in the FAQ today. it will probably be subject to "future development." Opinions?
-Joe Offer-

---

Please remember that Mudcat is a Music Forum. We welcome discussion of all topics, but we give special emphasis to music. If you wish to discuss other topics, you are welcome to post your own opinions. Please do not copy-paste the entire texts of lengthy non-music articles that are available elsewhere on the Internet - just post a link and summarize the article in your own words. If you find music information or lyrics you wish to share, particularly if it is about folk music, please DO post the entire text, plus a link to where you found it. Thank you. -Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: DT Threads in the future
From: Don Firth
Date: 27 Jun 02 - 06:08 PM

I definitely agree, Joe. Many of the long articles that people cut and paste (post) tend to be in threads discussing current news stories, such as the Pledge of Allegiance decision. I venture to say that this thread and many like it will drop off the bottom in fairly short order. In the meantime, the links to the news sources and articles will still be there for people to read if they wish. There is no point in permanently archiving this stuff. Also, most of these articles are copyrighted, and I wonder about the legality of cutting and pasting them here. Iffy proposition, I think.

Don Firth