BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?

Subject: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: GUEST,josepp
Date: 12 Jul 12 - 09:53 PM

If yes, how long?

Explain.

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: Bobert
Date: 12 Jul 12 - 10:09 PM

No!!! Why punish the current program for sins of folks gone???

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: catspaw49
Date: 12 Jul 12 - 10:25 PM

I was one who hoped against hope that Joe Paterno was of a different generation and probably did not fully see the truth of what was happening. I looked at his long career and all the good he had done and wanted to believe he was not really involved. I began to see that he was but I thought that surely an in depth report would find he just didn't do as much as he could. I really wanted to believe that but I just waited for the report and then...............

I was wrong on all counts and so was Paterno. So was the board and the administration and damn near everyone even vaguely related to the football program. The utter truth of the report was even more damning than the trial or anything I would have imagined. The report highlights the power of college athletics and the money it brings. It condemn the institutional problems at PSU but also at every large university where football brings in huge amounts of cash.

It will take a lot of things happening to overcome that institutional problem at Penn State. Last year Ohio State almost got the death penalty over tattoos for memorabilia and some cheap used cars. The NCAA needs to act on this if they are to have any credibilty themselves. Five years would not be too long.

The Paterno name needs to be removed from buildings and his statue needs to come down. The university needs to start immediately imposing penalties upon itself and completely restructure all athletics, withdrawing voluntarily from football. If they don't the NCAA will do the worst and/or the Big 10 will drop them.

Its a bitch when your heroes have feet of clay............

This is the best I've read....from an Alumnus.



Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: Jack Campin
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 07:02 AM

Why does that report call Sandusky's sexual partners "children"? They were all over 18, weren't they?

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: JJ
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 08:16 AM

The boys Sandusky raped were all UNDER the age of 18, as far as can be known at this time.

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: Charmion
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 08:35 AM

Partners? Excuse me?

The boys Sandusky raped were targets, prey.

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: catspaw49
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 09:12 AM

Most of his target group was 10-12 at the time their rapes occurred.

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: olddude
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 09:29 AM

I agree with Spaw, Joe was a hero to me .. now his memory is nothing more than a footnote. Remove all references to him.

As far as the football ... No way too much money involved. The NCAA will not do the right thing and suspend them .. nope .. it is about the bucks

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 10:20 AM

Penn State has done a pretty good job of shooting off its own right foot. I don't see how the NCAA putting a slug or two through its remaining foot is going to benefit anyone.

The NCAA usually concerns itself with issues that, if unsupervised, would give a team an unfair advantage over opponents. They don't like it when prospects are bribed, ineligible players are allowed to play, or players use steroids. What occurred at Penn State did not give its team an unfair advantage unless one stretches the definition of "unfair advantage" to include retention of a coach who should have been fired for reasons totally unrelated to team performance. The crimes which occurred are beyond the NCAA's bailiwick. The only way they can be considered an infraction of NCAA rules is by stretching some vague ethics clause to cover the situation.

If the NCAA's goal is to "maintain a level playing field", it doesn't need to do so by taking Penn State's program down a notch. It's already dug itself into a hole the size of Pittsburgh.

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: Wesley S
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 11:27 AM

" What occurred at Penn State did not give its team an unfair advantage "

I'm going to have to disagree. The actions taken in the coverup were done to protect the football program. I think a minimum of a one year suspension is not out of line. The coverup went all the way to the top of the schools administration so the football program needs to be punished. Otherwise the coverup succeeds.

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: catspaw49
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 11:28 AM

For the NCAA it is all about the money. They need to join the 21st Century and come up with some type of pay program for the athletes and about a hundred other changes.

But I disagree that they have no authority or responsibilty in this case. What this case is really about is the inner functionings of large corporations and not just a little college football problem. Every university of any size relies on its football or major sports programs to fund not just other and smaller programs but also university projects outside athletics. In any corporation there is often a closed culture that develops with its own internal rules and hierarchy and this is where the larger football programs are at.

Just before Penn State's debacle the NCAA had gone hard after Ohio State and succeeded in getting certain sanctions, a change in staffing and other things by invoking their most common rule which involves "failure to properly monitor" athletes and situations. OSU damn near made the "death penalty" because of it. The real story was that some players had traded away football memorabilia for tickets and free tattoos plus in a few cases some really good deals, although quite legal deals, on used cars. It was pretty nickel and dime stuff. The coach DID know and so did quite a few others so heads rolled starting with Jim Tressel. Players were suspended, victories and trophys taken away, and financial penalties ensued. Now if the NCAA went ballistic over THAT, I can't help but think the Penn State rapes just might also be a failure to monitor.

Penn State is well on its way to doing the right things but I think they have to do more and closing down the football program for a year and showing a complete restructuring and philosophy that would prevent anything even remotely like this in the future. Something that would stand as a model for other schools. In the long run they have the possibility of becoming the model for other schools to follow and could once again say they can have "Success with Honor." And this time it would be true.


Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: Bill D
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 11:51 AM

The whole sordid mess was predictable given the 'reverence' for the school & sports program. If it had happened at Kentucky, or Duke...or any of a dozen other schools, there might have been similar results.

(I suppose that now, other schools will be especially careful... and there are no obvious Sanduskys in MOST schools).

This won't change the basic attitude of "do 'almost' anything to promote & protect the sports programs", but it will at least make a few think about what 'almost' means.

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: GUEST,olddude
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 02:44 PM

Schools like Penn State, Notre Dame, Miami etc they are all about football. The education thing is secondary. Most of their players graduate and can't count their nuts twice and get the same number.

I love football, I am a junkie with football, I am friends with NFL hall of fame players and coaches ... but it is a game. Life is reality and schools that have big programs are all about the money it brings in. The head coach at any of these schools has far more power than the President of the University or the board. That is fact. I seen it first hand when my close friend was the Head Coach at ND. When I walked in to see him the administration and staff all swooped all over me cause I must be someone important to be friends with the "Coach". Insane.

Now when you lose, they will curse your wife, kids, dog, mother ...etc

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: GUEST,josepp
Date: 13 Jul 12 - 06:28 PM

I think Penn State should get the death penalty but that would be bittersweet. It's really no different than the Catholic Church scandal and not nearly as extensive. The same element of worship is in both. Oh, yes, there are people that worship college football and worship Paterno. And it was covered up the same way and for the same reason. Yet the Catholic Church served will never be served with a death penalty and it deserves it way more than Penn State.

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: GUEST,gillymor
Date: 16 Jul 12 - 03:53 PM

Shut 'em down and all other college football programs and start over with student atheletes (no atheletic scholarships)and let Pro football start their own farm system where young aspirants will be able to get legally compensated for their efforts without having to pretend to be students. As for those who like to play football and attain an education let them compete without scholarship, for the love of it (the definition of amateur) in a scaled back and heavily regulated version of the NCAA. Same goes for basketball.
When the football program is dictating morals at these big universities something ain't right. I know I'm just pissin, in the wind here, but...

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 16 Jul 12 - 04:01 PM

"Penn St football--death penalty or no?"....Why??..Barney Frank, and Rahm Emmanuel would oppose it...well, except maybe the football program...but he'd want want more locker room interviews!

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 16 Jul 12 - 04:08 PM

No Penn State football should not be killed and JoePa's statue can stay as long as a blindfold is added it is facing a statue for every little boy that was raped.

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: Bobert
Date: 16 Jul 12 - 04:23 PM

What about all the kids who have been recruited, some going back to their freshamn years in High school, and playing for Penn State??? I one year suspension *is* the death penalty... Their players are going to transfer out and that alone will set the team back years well beyond one year... Heck, given the bad PR, if nothing happens then Penn State will pay for years in recruits going elsewhere...

Leave them the neck alone and make all the coaches take poligraphs 2 or 3 times a year...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: Wesley S
Date: 16 Jul 12 - 04:40 PM

" make all the coaches take poligraphs 2 or 3 times a year..."

And ask them what? About their sexual preferences?

Besides - who's going to want to take a polygraph because of someone else's bad behavior?

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 16 Jul 12 - 05:00 PM

" make all the coaches take poligraphs 2 or 3 times a year..."

or.....

Take hack saw to the crotch of Paterno's statue. Put up a sign saying: "This is what we will do if we catch you abusing children or covering up the abuse of children."

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: Tiger
Date: 16 Jul 12 - 05:29 PM

Bobert, you sound just like all of the other enablers - protect the football program at all costs. Too bad you're not so concerned for the victims and their families.

This whole scenario occurred because the football program became the 'elphant in the room," exerting a wildly disproportionate influence on the University, alumni, community - maybe even the whole state.

Business as usual will not cut it. If football is so damn important, the current team members can transfer with their scholarships. We need to show that football isn't everything. It's the insane football-over-all mentality that needs to be crushed.

Only the Hammer of Thor will do.

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: Bobert
Date: 16 Jul 12 - 05:39 PM

Tell ya' what, Tiger... If it were up to me football would be abolished or altered so that it wasn't messing so many people up... Like touch football... No one comes out intact... No one... I played ball in high school and have had a bad right knee ever since... I know it was football because I remember the night I got hurt like it was an hour ago...

I gotta a friend, Pat Fisher, who played cornerback for the Washington Redskins... When he was 40 he walked like he was 70... Beat the crud up...

I'm just saying that if yer gonna have football then don't bust innocent peoples balls for stuff they clearly didn't do...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 16 Jul 12 - 05:43 PM

All I have to say to you Tiger is If you are gonna ban college football, Reggie Bush is a way better reason than Joe Paterno.

Subject: RE: BS: Penn St football--death penalty or no?
From: Bobert
Date: 16 Jul 12 - 05:48 PM

I was thinkin' of O.J. myself, Jack...

B;~)