BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site

Subject: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 21 Aug 12 - 12:04 PM

63 hours to go!

The Great Sioux Nation is DESPERATELY trying to raise $1 MILLION to buy their own land back! It's 'officially owned' by The Reynold Family, 1900 acres known as 'Reynolds Prairie' which is also one of their most Sacred Sites, called Pe'Sla....


Save Pe'Sla Donation Site - Please Donate if you can and/or Share everywhere

It's all starting to 'snowball' now. Over $1,000 has just been donated in the last 10 minutes. Total was just over $144,000 last time I looked a few moments back, with around $50,000 of this having been donated since just yesterday!

We CAN do this, if we all pull together, so if you good people could share this story out, I know they'd all be so deeply grateful

Thank you, Mudcatters!
:0) xxx

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 21 Aug 12 - 01:17 PM

This is one of the official photos I copied so that it could be shared around FB more easily, with much information and many links to the right of the picture. You may have to press the 'See more' button to open it all up though....Donation Petition is right at the top...

Save Pe'Sla Photo to share in FB, with loads of links

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: GUEST,Stim
Date: 21 Aug 12 - 04:34 PM

Not meaning to offend, Lizzie, but one wonders why, if this is and always has been sacred land, that the Lakota didn't start saving money long ago against the possibility that someday the Reynolds family would be willing to sell it to them?

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: katlaughing
Date: 21 Aug 12 - 07:40 PM

Where would they have gotten said money to save? Some of the worst poverty in our country is on the Rosebud Reservation and others in the Dakotas. And, who knows how long the Reynolds family have "owned" it. For that matter, why should the Lakota have to pay to retrieve sacred land which was stolen from them in the first place? Did you even read the first link?

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 22 Aug 12 - 03:46 AM

Thank you, Kat. I know you understand so well. xxx

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: GUEST,Stim
Date: 22 Aug 12 - 05:57 AM

I meant no offense, I just wondered why nothing had been done before now, and why the effort seems so haphazard.

This is an important sacred site, after all, and there are a number of organizations who work to preserve and protect sacred sites. There is are even Federal Programs to do this.

There is an answer, actually, a couple answers. First, that the site has been owned by the Reynolds family since 1876 and remained pretty much undeveloped, and it hadn't occurred to anyone that it needed to be protected or preserved till the property showed up unannounced on the auction site.

Second part of the answer is that the Lakota/Nakota/
Dakota folks, in true American fashion, sued the Feds, owing to the fact that the Black Hills were granted to the tribes by Congress, who snatched them back when gold was discovered. The Supreme Court ruled in favor of the tribes, and awarded $17.5 million in damages, but the tribes never picked up the check because they just wanted the land back(this, incidentally, is why you should always get title insurance).

My guess is that very old Reynolds that owned the land passed away, and the next generation live somewhere else entirely and just told the lawyer to sell the property, and neither knew nor cared that it was a sacred site.

Most of the Story Here!

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 22 Aug 12 - 06:26 AM

There may be some very good news coming, as money is now pouring in from other Tribes too...Hopefully it will be enough to buy the land, but I'm worried about the Corporate Bastards getting in there, being prepared to pay FAR more, so donations are still needed.

'The Black Hills Are Not For Sale' is the saying of the Sioux. They have shown the world that NO AMOUNT of money will make them give up their fight for the land that was stolen from them. They don't want compensation, they just want their land. Pe'Sla is not just in grave danger of being lost to them as a Sacred Site, but of being lost forever if a major highway IS put across this incredibly special site.

I have such Deep Respect for them.

I know some of them have now been in contact with the Reynolds family, meeting with them a few days back. I just hope this family will open their hearts and see beyond the $$$$s to The Spirit and The Soul of The Native Americans and The Ancestors....

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: maeve
Date: 22 Aug 12 - 07:18 AM

From Stim's link: "The Sioux Nation was awarded approximately $17.1 million in 1974 by the Indian Claims Commission for the illegal annexation of the Black Hills. The sum reached $106 million when the value of gold taken from the hills was considered.

The claim was later argued before the Supreme Court in 1980 and upheld, awarding the Sioux Nation $106 million. This sum, with interest, was up to over $570 million in 2010. It is now believed to be close to $1 billion."

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: maeve
Date: 22 Aug 12 - 07:25 AM

Sorry- hit Enter too soon.

I meant to add that the settlement was never accepted, since the Dakota, Lakota, and Nakota believe, accurately, that the land was stolen from them. The long-term stability of their position seems a clear indicator of the strength of their moral position. Despite such poverty of material things, the blood money has not been accepted.
My respect and prayers are with them.

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: GUEST,Sugarfoot Jack
Date: 22 Aug 12 - 11:35 AM

"one wonders why, if this is and always has been sacred land, that the Lakota didn't start saving money long ago"

A couple of years ago in North Dakota I was lucky enough to meet a chap who was a Spirit Rider, and despite being white had been accepted into the inner circle of the Lakota on Pine Ridge. He told some great stories but left me in no doubt these people have nothing. Like indigenous peoples the world over they've been, and continue to be, treated like subhumans. They didn't save the money because they don't have it.

Down at the Grand Canyon I was shocked to find a room full of native jewellery and other items in the gift shop. A fellow was checking the stock and as I got my wallet out to buy something I asked him where he sourced all this stuff from. It turns out they're from the pawn shop in the Navajo res. That left a sour taste in my mouth, so I put my wallet back and left.

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: GUEST,Dawes Rolls
Date: 22 Aug 12 - 01:39 PM

Rosebud Indian lands total 2 MILLION square miles and have a population of about 20,000.
So...(multiply by 1000 divide by 5)that is 100 square miles per person. OR 60,000 acres per person.

"Fund Raising for Native Americans" is one of the largest frauds....and most lucrative bonanza gyps in the USA.

Liz - as you sit nibbling your pork pasty reflect:

1. What actual "charity" are you giving to? (When you follow your link)
2. Are the funds held in escrow? (what company)?
3. If the purchase falls through (it will) what happens to the unspent funds?
4. What are the administrative costs - and the "board of directors" 'honorarium?"
5. Who would manage the lands if purchased - under what name will they be held?
6. What worthy, REAL charity within YOUR immediate community can you contribute to?


While your links indicate "tax free gift"
Neither the "last real indian" NOR "Rosebud Sioux Tribe"
are on the Internal Revenue Service (.gov) list of approved charities for tax deductions.
(much less Mr. Iron Eyes nor Ms. Jumping Eagle)


descendant of Joseph Hall

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 22 Aug 12 - 01:55 PM

The land was taken away from these tribes through numerous dishonest dealings. The Dawes act that Gargoyle references was a way to try to round up Indians back in the 1880s - it would give out a portion of land to each who registered and take the rest back (many tribes refused to, in protest, and are now shit-out-of-luck).

There are billions owed to tribes by the Dept of the Interior and that lawsuit has dragged on for years.

The American Indians in most areas have been treated like poor-stepchildren (Indians are to the rest of America what Palestinians are to Israel). That said, I am always suspicious of fund-raisers and the touchy-feeling spiritual outpouring of groups who are wannabes and outright fakes. It seems there just isn't a way for a lot of tribes to catch a break - the government won't work with them and the people who raise money on their behalf are often times crooks who take the money and run.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 22 Aug 12 - 02:55 PM

All those concerned with the fundraising can be traced. MANY newspapers are now taking up the story too. Other tribes have come forward to help, bringing over $1million with them. They're probably going to need far, FAR more than that amount, sadly.

This case has now received so much publicity that if it were in the slightest bit 'dodgy' it would have been blown apart by now, so please, don't come visiting the 'suspicious minds' to me.

These guys are genuine and they're worried sick..

Recently, those on Pine Ridge put out a call for help after they were devastated by a Hurricane. Many came to their aid...including Paul McCartney, who donated generously to them 'behind the scenes'. You'll have to take my word on that one, as I was told it by someone who knows all about, because of other famous people they're in contact with over Leonard Peltier.

If ALL they wanted was money, the Sioux would take what the government's been trying to give them for a long time, and party for the next 100 years, but they are NOT like that. They are HONOURABLE People whose Souls are NOT up for sale and they just want their Sacred Land to be Respected, to be theirs, and to be treated as human beings!!

I'm so SICK of the Corporate and Political Feckers who are treating Indigenous People like shite all over the world!! Christopher Columbus is Alive & Well, except that nowadays he's called CATERPILLAR Columbus and he comes not with ships, but with JCBs, to pillage their land, forests, rivers and mountains!

You have NO idea how HARD they're all trying to come together, to fight The Bastards, when they have NOTHING to fight WITH, other than their bodies, their Souls, their Spirits! They are standing in front of JCBs, sitting down in front of trucks, tearing apart dams with their bare hands!

So, Gargoyle, get off your backside and go and HELP them, even if ALL you can do is use your words on a screen in a POSITIVE WAY, because they are fighting for YOUR world too!

Michael Bucher - Sacred Ground

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 22 Aug 12 - 03:02 PM

James Anaya of the UN asks US Govt. for Pe'Sla to be saved.....

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: katlaughing
Date: 22 Aug 12 - 03:32 PM

Thanks for the links, Lizzie.

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: GUEST,Stim
Date: 22 Aug 12 - 03:56 PM

"That said, I am always suspicious of fund-raisers and the touchy-feeling spiritual outpouring of groups who are wannabes and outright fakes." Amen

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: ChanteyLass
Date: 22 Aug 12 - 09:57 PM

I signed the petition when Avaaz sent it to my Inbox.

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: GUEST,bankley
Date: 22 Aug 12 - 10:34 PM

with over 400 Native gaming establishments in the US operated by over 200 tribes, you'd think they pass the hat for their Lakota brothers and sisters. The Seminole own the Hard Rock Cafe, hotels and casinos. Some traditionals are against the gambling, but it seems to me that there should be something set aside from the billions taken in, to help out in cases like this. just a thought.

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 Aug 12 - 11:10 PM

Good point, Bankley.

I have signed the petition.

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Aug 12 - 12:24 AM

Care to wager?

http://rosebudcasino.com/

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 23 Aug 12 - 06:07 AM

I have a horrible feeling that if the 'boot was on the other foot' the Sioux would be behaving in much the same way. In spite of their, much vaunted, 'spirituality' they were the dominant military power on the northern plains from about the end of the 18th century to well into the 19th and they probably took the Black Hills from someone else by force.

They fought with many of the neighbouring tribes like the Pawnees. The Pawnees were not nomadic, like the Sioux, but grew crops and lived in earth lodge villages. Because of this lifestyle they more easily fell prey to European diseases - like smallpox. When they were at their weakest the Sioux preyed on them mercilessly - stealing their horse herds, burning their crops and besieging their villages.

It's worth bearing in mind that, in spite of superficial differences, we're all human beings and all capable of bad behaviour - including the persecution of minorities.

I wish the Sioux people well in their present struggle (it's in my nature to be on the side of minorities and against their persecution)but making them out to be some sort special 'angels' doesn't help their cause.

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 23 Aug 12 - 06:19 PM

Well, not only has the donation campaign now been extended for a further 16 days, but tonight the news is just in that the auction has been cancelled, at the request of the Reynolds family's representative. No-one knows quite why at the moment, but the details are up on the site of the Auctioneers.

They've also said that should they be unsuccessful in purchasing Pe'Sla then the money will be given to other Sacred Sites also facing grave danger of being sold off or destroyed....

And Ron, yes, I hear what you say and I agree with you.

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: katlaughing
Date: 23 Aug 12 - 08:26 PM

That is good news about the cancellation of the auction.

As to their history, Wiki has some interesting info: CLICK HERE.

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: GUEST,999
Date: 23 Aug 12 - 09:38 PM

When indians and whites get it on, I do wonder why no one asks who's pulling the strings. Wanna start a casino? Lets look at money.

Indians never had money. Yes, enough to survive on, but not to start casinos. The only first question is where did the money come from?

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 24 Aug 12 - 03:04 AM

A slower, more covert form of Genocide, Bruce?


"The planned auction of nearly 2,000 acres of land in South Dakota's picturesque Black Hills that is considered sacred by American Indian tribes has been cancelled, though it wasn't immediately clear why.

Brock Auction Company planned to auction five tracts of land owned by Leonard and Margaret Reynolds on Saturday. But a message on the auction house's website Thursday said it has been cancelled a
t the land owners' direction. The auction house and Margaret Reynolds declined comment.

Tribes of the Great Sioux Nation consider the site key to their creation story and are trying to purchase it because they fear new owners would develop the land, which they call Pe' Sla. The property, which spans about 1,942 acres of pristine prairie grass, is the only sacred site on private land currently outside Sioux control.

Rosebud Sioux Tribe spokesman Alfred Walking Bull said he didn't know the auction had been cancelled when contacted Thursday. His tribe, whose reservation is among the closest to the land, had agreed to allocate $1.3 million toward trying purchasing the property, though tribal officials have said they feared the selling price could be between $6 million and $10 million.

Ruth Hopkins, who helps run a website where about 5,000 people have donated more than $250,000 to help the tribes purchase the land, said she didn't know why the auction was called off. U.S. Bureau of Indian Affairs spokeswoman Nedra Darling said she also was not aware the auction had been cancelled and had no comment.

A United Nations fact finder had urged the federal government, and local and state officials in South Dakota to consult with American Indians ahead of the auction.

Roughly 20 tribes make up the Great Sioux Nation, which was fragmented when American Indians were pushed to reservations and the tribes now span several states including Montana, Wyoming, the Dakotas and Minnesota, and Canada.

The tribes believe the Sioux people were created from the Black Hills. According to part of their spiritual tradition, Pe' Sla is where the Morning Star fell to Earth, killing seven beings that killed seven women. The Morning Star placed the souls of the women into the night sky as "The Seven Sisters," also known as the Pleiades constellation.

Tribal members hold ceremonies and rituals on the land."

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/auction-cancelled-sd-land-considered-sacred-17068563#.UDajDMUk2o0

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 24 Aug 12 - 03:18 AM

Taken from the 'TIME Magazine' article below:

>>>>....So if the overwhelming majority of Native Americans like Hollow Horn aren't benefiting from the Indian casino boom, who is? In many cases, the big winners are non-Indian investors, some of whom pocket more than 40% of an Indian casino's profits. Actually, calling these people investors understates their role. They often serve as master strategists who draw up the plans and then underwrite the total cost of bringing a casino online: ferreting out an amenable tribe, paying a signing bonus, picking up tribal expenses and paying the salaries of the tribe's officials, all of this before a spade of dirt is turned. If an Indian band isn't federally recognized as a tribe and is thus ineligible for a gaming venture, these full-service backers will bankroll genealogists to construct a family tree, then hire lawyers and lobbyists in Washington to help change the band's status. And if a reservation isn't prime real estate for a casino, the investors sometimes purchase a more suitable patch and instruct their lawyers and lobbyists to persuade the government to designate the land as a trust, as reservation property is called. Building the casino is the easiest step.

--THE MONEYMEN<<<<

Full TIME artice here

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: meself
Date: 24 Aug 12 - 02:09 PM

Curious fact: 1876, the year the Reynolds family acquired the property, was also the year of the Battle of the Little Bighorn ('Custer's Last Stand').

Subject: RE: BS: Urgent! Save Pe'Sla - Sacred Sioux Site
From: pdq
Date: 24 Aug 12 - 02:14 PM

"Indians never had money. Yes, enough to survive on, but not to start casinos. The only first question is where did the money come from?"

That is a very easy question.

Organized crime, with the help of their willing enablers, the Democrat politicians.