Hot Club de Paris

Subject: Hot Club de Paris
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 05 Mar 07 - 08:16 AM

There's a relatively new rock band ( from Liverpool, I think) who, for some insane reason, call themselves "Hot Club de Paris". Now, anyone hearing that name would - I hope - expect a Django type ,gypsy jazz group. Surely the Trade Description people should be looking into this! What next, I wonder - how about a punk rock band called " The Vienna Baroque Ensemble".

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: bubblyrat
Date: 05 Mar 07 - 08:18 AM

Doing " Baroque Around The Clock ", presumably ??

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: C-flat
Date: 05 Mar 07 - 08:38 AM

Hmm. A rock version of Nuages?

Django must be turning in his grave!!!

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: GUEST,Joe Moran
Date: 05 Mar 07 - 09:12 AM

I must agree with Tunesmith. Imagine seeing a gig advertised as featuring " The Birmingham Bluegrass Band" and finding when you got there that the band played Grunge music - or what ever. I've heard some tracks by this band and their music has nothing to do with Django or gypsy jazz!

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Scrump
Date: 05 Mar 07 - 09:33 AM

I see your point, but I wasn't aware there were any rules about what a group is allowed to call themselves. Would you have expected Queen to be an old woman wearing a crown, and then been shocked to see Freddie Mercury prancing about on stage? :-)

IMO it's up to the individual to check out the artist before booking a ticket for a concert or going along to see a gig.

Having said that, I do remember being disappointed when I went to see Barenaked Ladies... :-)

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: bubblyrat
Date: 05 Mar 07 - 09:35 AM

Isn"t " Rock of Nuages " a new hymn ??

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 05 Mar 07 - 10:06 AM

Get real Scrump! If you saw a band advertised as the Dublin Ceilidh Band, you would have definite reasons to "ask for your money back" if they turned out to be heavy metal band. I would argue the "Hot Club" is now a generic term which applies to a particular type of music i.e. mainly string, 30s swing - with at the very least - a nod towards the music of Django and Stephan.

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Scrump
Date: 05 Mar 07 - 10:42 AM

Tunesmith, I take your point. The band is stupid for picking a name that has no relation to the music they play, as they risk people being p***ed off when they come along to a gig to discover it's nothing like what theye expected.

But the fact is, there's no law against calling a band whatever you like. It's just stupid to pick an unsuitable or misleading name, and hopefully if enough people like you point out your disappointment to these bands, they will consider a change of name to something more appropriate.

When it comes down to it, if a band insists on calling itself something totally unrelated to what they play, I doubt anyone could get their money back easily, because even if the naem is misleading, I expect the 'caveat emptor' principle applies.

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 05 Mar 07 - 11:11 AM

There are laws covering "misrepresentation".

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Rasener
Date: 05 Mar 07 - 12:32 PM

Tunesmith - your refernence to "Quintette du Hot Club de France" with reference to Django, surely has got now't to do with

Hot Club de Paris are an Indie Band.
Indie rock is a genre of alternative rock that primarily exists in the independent underground music scene.
A classically trained pianist, Alasdair is behind all of Hot Club de Paris' harmonies. Many of the songs feature layered up harmony lines and it's this and their natural inclination to write and play in complex time signatures that sets them apart. "Odd time signatures are just something we're used to" explains Matthew, " We listen to so much music that isn't in 4/4 that it's completely natural for us to take influence from that. We don't ever write music just to be awkward, it's just the way we write. People write in 4/4 because that's what they're used to, we're doing exactly the same thing with what we do. " Seems like they know what they are doing in their own way.

So I really can't see what the argument is about.

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 05 Mar 07 - 01:12 PM

I'll say it again! The words "Hot Club" are now a generic term referring to a particular type of music. There are "gypsy jazz/swing string bands all over the world with the "Hot Club" prefix. If a music group decides to ignore this fact, then are leaving themselves open to legal action for misrepresentation!

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: CharleyO'Neill
Date: 05 Mar 07 - 05:58 PM

Who are these jokers?

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Rasener
Date: 05 Mar 07 - 06:50 PM

I doubt it.

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Scrump
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 04:41 AM

Tunesmith, I understand what you are saying, but I don't think anyone trying to take legal action against the band "Hot Club de Paris" on the grounds that they don't sound anything like you might expect them to based on that name (Django, Grappelli, etc.), would stand a snowball in hell's chance of succeeding.

Yes, I agree it's plain stupid to call yourself that if you don't play the type of music the name implies, as you risk annoying people; but there's nothing anyone can do about it legally.

Would you have Blair interfere even further in our freedom than he already has done, by introducing laws about what names a band is allowed tocall themselves? I certainly wouldn't want that.

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: ThreeSheds
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 05:15 AM

I once went to a John Martin concert in Hull and as JM was fumbling his way way through the first joint/song to sychophantic applause a commotion broke out on the front row,more interesting than the concert,it turned out to be a rather noisy husband and wife spat which culminated in the man storming out dragging his wife along while she protested "Well when I asked for tickets for Juan Martin they could have told me it was John Martin!"

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Rasener
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 06:52 AM

>>"Hot Club de Paris" on the grounds that they don't sound anything like you might expect them to based on that name (Django, Grappelli, etc.), <<

Well that would have been the last thought on my mind.There are some single minded people around.

If a band comes up with a name and providing there isn't already a band with that name, then who has the right to say that they shouldn't use it. thoughts of Cliff Richard and the drifters spring to mind LOL.

using that logic of Tunesmiths.

Show Of Hands conjures up thoughts of being in the Union

Albion Band conjures up a brass band that plays at the West Bromwich Albion Football Clubs games

The Churchfitters conjures up a load of chippies that refurbish churches

There are probably a lot of names that conjure up something entirely different to what they do.

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Scrump
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 07:28 AM

Would somebody have complained that the Pretty Things were ugly b*gg*rs? :-)

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: manitas_at_work
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 07:36 AM

"Albion Band conjures up a brass band that plays at the West Bromwich Albion Football Clubs games"

Bright and Hove Albion.




Actually.

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: manitas_at_work
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 07:37 AM

woops! That should have been Brighton and Hove..

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: BuckMulligan
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 07:38 AM

Legal action? On what grounds? "You didn't sound like I thought you would?" Maybe Richard Bridge could cite something afoot in the UK, but I doubt there's even the most ephemeral basis in the US for such "action."

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Scrump
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 07:42 AM

Well I don't think Cliff Richard looks anything like a cliff. And the Hollies looked nowt like holly, nor did they sound much like Buddy Holly. Misleading in my view. Sue 'em all!

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: GUEST,Joe Moran
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 07:54 AM

I've been following this argument, and I feel that Tunesmith has a very valid point. Advertising your product as something it is not, is breaking the law. If the "Memphis Blues Band" were advertised as appearing at a venue near me, I would be most agrieved if I paid out good money to see them only to find that they turned out to be a group of Bulgarians singing unaccompanied Balkan folk songs!

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Scrump
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 08:00 AM

I think we are all agreed that if a group chooses a name that has some indication as to the type of music they might be expected to play, and it turns out that they don't play that type of music at all, then anyone going to see them or buying one of their CDs without checking them out first would feel aggrieved.

But:

1. Caveat emptor applies - if you don't find out more about an artist or band before going to see them, it's your fault if you don't like what they do.

2. Whether you like it or not, there's nothing illegal about this.

Would you like the government to licence band names like they do with cars? I wouldn't.

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Rasener
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 08:01 AM

Now this is some Heavy Rock Band Tits Of Death

What does that conjure up, do they have bird flu?

And Neil Young isn't young anymore

The Carpenters - bet they never touched any wood in their lives

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Rasener
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 08:11 AM

Since when do you go and see somebody who you have never heard of before, without finding out what they do. I certainly don't, but them maybe some of you have more money than sense.

Now here is an example of not doing what your image portrays.

My Mom and Dad who are religious, had seen Cahs & dave on the telly many times and liked the music they produced. So they booked tickets at the theatre in Birmingham. On the night they had a meal foirst and then went to the show. Chas & Dave during the show were effing and blinding and my parents were deeply offended and left.

They had no idea that their show on telly was any different to going and seeing then at the main theatre in Birmingham.

You couild say that they should have known better, but they didn't.

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Rasener
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 08:12 AM

Sorry Chas & Dave

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Scrump
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 08:48 AM

There's no need to apologise to those foul-mouthed cockneys - they were the ones whop should apologise to your mam and dad.

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Rasener
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 08:53 AM

LOL I just realised what I have said Scrump..

I wasn't saying sorry to Chas & Dave. I meant to say sorry I typed their names wrong. It should have read "Chas & Dave".

he he. I wondered why you had said that Scrump :-)

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Scrump
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 11:51 AM

Sorry Villan I missed out the :-) from my comment

(and when I said "whop" I meant "who" - curse these damn keybraods! They can't spell!)

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Rasener
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 12:55 PM

Here is the answer to why they called themselves Hot Club de Paris, straight from the horses mouth.

>>
Our name of course comes from Django, and is a Django reference.
However, as far as I'm aware there was never a band in existence
called "Hot Club de Paris"... It's merely a play on The Quintette du
Hot Club de France... so yeh, why not? We all like Jazz, and we play
quite progressive music, in that it involves a lot of time signatures
and non standard arrangements... So why not make reference to
something that was pretty progressive in the first place?!

Matthew - member of Hot Club de Paris <<

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Rasener
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 01:08 PM

And a further comment

>>I've never really lost any sleep over jazz enthusiasts coming to our
shows by accident, no! The whole point is that we didn't want the band
name to be a mission statement, like so many are. It doesn't really
say anything about us and is quite playful and fun... therefore good
enough for us. I don't think Django or Stefan would mind too much, at
least young people are still into their music and willing to borrow a
name from then and try to do something progressive and interesting
with it. I thought that's what music was all about? We're all big jazz
fans, although I'm personally more into Albert Ayler and Ornette
Coleman etc... so why not call our band a jazz name!

Matthew
<<

So there you go, give the young ens a chance.

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 04:37 PM

These guys are cretins on a number of levels! So they admit that their choice of name - at the very least, is misleading. ( In a court of law that could be deemed to be "misrepresentation"). And, the idiots, say that they didn't want a name that was a " mission statement" But their name IS "a mission statement". The title of the band states, "We play swing jazz music with its origins in Django's music from the 30s". Just as a band calling themselves "The Kentucky Bluegrass Band", are telling world that they play bluegrass music!

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Rasener
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 04:46 PM

Oh come on Tunesmith. They are very good musicians, but just not your style.
Whats your problem, have they done anything to upset you?

Give the youngsters a chance, you sound like a grumpy old man.

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 04:55 PM

I haven't heard the band! It's their gross stupidity that bothers me. Imagine if The Beatles had called themselves "The New Orleans Jazz Brothers"!

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Rasener
Date: 06 Mar 07 - 05:06 PM

So what, we wouldn't have had the beatles.

you call yourself tunesmith

well here is a song for you to listen to from Tunesmith and they are very good.

Tunesmith

I am so glad I listen to all types of music without reading too much into the names.

Sometimes I think some people in the folkworld are so up their own bum and so blinkered.

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 07 Mar 07 - 03:25 AM

Villa: Give me one reason why anyone would find that track interesting? Surely, we've heard it all before ad nauseam!

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Rasener
Date: 07 Mar 07 - 04:19 AM

Neil
>>Surely, we've heard it all before ad nauseam! <<

You mean just like folk singarounds!!

You are entitled to your views and so am I. I think that is a good song.

You started the thread and I think you are going over the top about what a band calls itself. Its got now't to do with you or me.

Thats their business. let them get on with enjoying the music just like you have all your life.

Encouragement is what youngsters need.

Les

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Scrump
Date: 07 Mar 07 - 06:25 AM

Maybe choosing an inappropriate name could annoy people who don't take the trouble to find out about a band before goind to see them, but it certainly gets them publicity, doesn't it? Not that I would suggest for a moment that this was the motivation for the choice of name... :-)

Subject: RE: Hot Club de Paris
From: Rasener
Date: 07 Mar 07 - 11:18 AM

Here's a bit more from the leader of the band.

"We're all into folk too. A lot of the tunings I use are Fahey tunings.
I use stuff like CCCGCE and DADEAD in a lot of our songs. I guess
that's why people shouldn't jump to conclusions! Paul, our bassist,
actually does folk stuff on his own. You can listen to it here

http://myspace.com/icekingofcalifornia

Matthew "

Theses guys are actually very good musicians doing music in their own style (for the young ones)