BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)

Subject: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: GUEST,12String Stan
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 12:06 PM

Some of you may/may not know, but from Jan 20th Irelands Mph speed limits, are being converted to Kph. They are also buggering it up even more, by abolishing the "General National" speed limit of 60mph, and designating limits depending on the class of road.
But this nonetheless signifies the loss of something, what i don't know, but something.
Will We Irish ever be able to join the "Kilometere" High Club?
Will Kerry people proudly proclaim, Inch is a "Kilometere"?
Will peace in the north be Kilometeres away...
And will anyone who is wrong, ever be "Kilometeres" off

I Lament on. Good bye 60, 40, & 30 MPH, hello 50, 80 100KPH,

Anyone any noodles on this subject they care to throw in??

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: gnu
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 12:55 PM

You'll get used to it. As a matter of fact, it's easier to calculate ETA in SI. When I travel to the USA now it's like taking a step back in time. Welcome to the future.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Bill D
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 01:14 PM

Getting the USA to convert to the saner metric measurements is like getting the UK to drive on the right side of the road...good luck!

I 'think' in miles, but I'm sure that I could adapt in a short time...even at MY advanced age!

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 01:51 PM

Nothing "saner" about metric measures - in fact they are much less related to the normal human body than the previous system (eg a foot is more or less a foot, and inch is roughly the width of a thumb); and in some ways less handy in other ways - 12 is divisible by 2,3,4 and 6, whereas 10 is only divisible by 2 and 5.

There's a convenience in having a single system shared by different countries, that's true enough - it's just a pity the one that won out was the metric system. But there it is.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 02:19 PM

I prefer the metric system...

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Bill D
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 02:21 PM

I dunno, McGrath...it always seemed to me that counting by 10s was 'related' to the human body...at least *I* have the usual # of fingers.....and remembering 5280 ft and 1760? yards, etc. was always kinda tedious. And, being a woodworker, I have to deal with adding 1 17/32" to 3'4¾" and triple checking my answer.....metric does have its benefits...

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Snuffy
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 02:43 PM

McGrath's right. It's just the decimal numbering system that makes it appear hard. If we had a proper Base-12 numbering system .....

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 02:50 PM

BillD in the UK we do drive on the right side of the road.
It just so happens that the 'right' side of the road is the left hand side of the road!
IIRC it was Napoleon who changed a lot of countries over in both measurements, and which side of the road traffic should pass, just to annoy the English!
Anyway, you could always take the option preferred on the Greek islands, and drive down the middle!

Any suggestion that American cars passing left side to left side exacerbates the coriolis effect and leads to the formation of 'Twisters' is an urban myth (maybe).

Cheers

Nigel

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Bill D
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 03:00 PM

why, Nigel...since most people are 'right' handed, driving on the RIGHT leaves the RIGHT hand more freely available to shift, tune the radio, dial the mobile phone, shave, comb one's hair and gesticulate at other drivers! (Which hand was it that Napolean kept tucked away under his tunic?)

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: diesel
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 03:02 PM

Some of the absurdities around the Dublin area (I'm sure it'll appply elsewhere also) is the sight of a dual carriageway of good standard, having it's 40mph limit brought down to 38.5 mph when related to the 'closest' Km/hr round-off. Surely in this day they could have rounded upwards if the road merited it.

I speak in particular of the N4 at Liffey Valley and N11 at stillorgan if you know them.

My guess is in 20 yrs or so they'll changeover the side of the road we drive on as well...Oh boy I can't wait.

Diesel

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: MudGuard
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 03:20 PM

Kevin, why do you just pick the 12 when you say that the metric is less sane than the older British "system"?
Just because 12 is divisible by some numbers. Ok. But in your "system", the 12 is not appearing very often:

5 and a half yards are 1 rod
4 rods are 1 chain
10 chains are one furlong
8 furlongs are one mile
3 miles are one league

Ok, not very much use of the 12 here in lengths, lets look for more use of the 12 in other measures.

16 ounces are one pound?
14 pounds are one stone?
20 fluid ounces are one pint?
...

So it is really very helpful that 12 is divisible by 1,2,3,4,6,12 as the 12 is used so much in your "system".

And of what help is it that the length of the measure "1 foot" is ROUGHLY the length of one foot?
If you go to the shop to buy boards for building a shelf - do you measure the board by stepping on it? Or do you let the salesperson step on the board to get its measure?
Probably you use some standardized measure stick with standard feet and inches marked on it. So the rough equivalent of length units to human body parts does not really help ...

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: MudGuard
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 03:28 PM

Btw, changing the speed limits to Kmph is only consequent - the distances are already given in kilometers in Ireland (at least in the Republic).

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 03:45 PM

BillD:
A nice non sequiteur there.
The positions of controls are based on the side of the road used, and so do not enter the equation at all. Most cars in UK are right-hand-drive, thus allowing the driver to be better positioned for viewing the road.

The origin of the side of the road used (apparently) goes back to the days when horses were the means of transport. Passing right shoulder to right shoulder made it possible to draw a weapon quickly if needed, and put one in the best stance to use it. The only exception being in jousting tourneys where the weight of the lance meant that support was required from ones steed, so competitiors rode down the right-hand side of the lists, allowing their lances to be held across their steeds and aimed at their opponents.

Similar arguments are used for shaking hands right handed, to show peacable intentions because you are depriving yourself of the use of your sword arm.

Similarly, anyone visiting many ancient castles will quickly note that spiral staircases always wind the same way. Moving down a staircase you are always turning counter-clockwise, this is because you could only attack from below and the holders of the castles kept for themselves not only the advantage of fighting from above, but also the advantage of freedom of movement. The defenders would have their right arms swinging in the open area of the staircase, whilst the attackers would find their movements restricted by having the central pillar against their sword arm.

And all this has got bugger all to do with road speeds, but there you go!

CHEERS

Nigel

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 04:29 PM

"If you go to the shop to buy boards for building a shelf - do you measure the board by stepping on it?"

I do actually. Or rather, before I got out to buy some something where accurate measurements aren't that important I'm very likely to step it out, or use the width of my hand, which is close on four inches. No point in being more accurate than you need to be.

"...the distances are already given in kilometers in Ireland" Except where there are still old signposts up giving them in miles. I'm pretty sure there are still a fair number of them. For a long time it was confusing because there were signs of roughly the same vintage, some in miles and some in kilometres, and no indication of which.

It's silly name for a unit of measurement anyway - no settled way of spelling it or pronouncing it.

I'm glad the Americans are sticking to the old measurements (even if they do get them wrong from tiem to time - niotably the pint and the gallon). I always find it pleasing the way the USA goes on about being a modern country, when in many ways it's among the most old-fashioned places there are (that is a compliment in my books).

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Bill D
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 06:43 PM

oh, sure, Nigel..I know that controls are built to reflect the side of the road...my point is that we Americans get to shift and do all those other things with the right hand, which is a bit easier for 'most' people. You have centuries of tradition, and no doubt one can do it all either way, with practice.

But with 98% of the world choosing driving on the right and controls on the left, perhaps it's time to adapt? *grin*

Well, I suppose it will never happen, due to the prohibitive cost of changing all the signs, signals and road design. And what WOULD you do with current vehicles while the change-over was being attempted? The accident rate would surely rise when sleepy folks forgot where they were.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: s&r
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 07:12 PM

I'm all for metric/decimal. I get ten kilometres per litre in my car..

Can't wait for decimal time - ten seconds one minute, ten minutes one hour etc.

Seriously, I'm with Kevin, but not because of body units rather the convenience of trade measurements. Horses are in Hands, bricks in courses. and so on. Tradesmen already ignore metric rules which is why Kitchen units are given in millimetres, waist and collar sizes in centimetres; no-one uses decimetres for anything. Metric/decimal was great for the abacus though

Stu

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 07:47 PM

The really annoying thing is when you want to fix something, and you go down to buy a length of wood, for example, and you find they've gone metric on you and the width you want isn't available anymore. Basically the idea is, you aren't supposed to fix things, you're supposed to throw them away and start afresh.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 07:47 PM

In all seriousness, I'd love to see metric time catch on as well...

But then, I'm not afraid of progress or change...

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Bill D
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 07:59 PM

That might mean 100 seconds in a minute and 100 minutes in an hour? It could work with digital clocks (we already have stopwatches which do 100ths), but no one could read the marks on the courthouse clock!

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Fibula Mattock
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 08:33 PM

Can't see how it matters much since the M50 will still be one giant car park...

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Bill D
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 09:18 PM

like the Capital Beltway around Wash DC....I sometime wonder how they all got ON the road so they could sit there.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Peace
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 09:27 PM

Until you get used to metric, you'll see speed signs that say 50 km. As a fast way for you to know what that is on your speedometer, multiply by .6. If math isn't your long suit, just multiply by 6 and drop the end number.

100 kmh is roughly equal to 60 mph.
50 kmh is roughly equal to 30 mph.
30 kmh is roughly equal to 20 mph.

BM

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: gnu
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 10:34 PM

Well, I think it's best just to get used to it. I recall a carpenter on one project who would use his conversion calculator to convert metric to Imperial and then measure off distances using his tape measure, which was graduated in Imperial AND metric. Jaysus, what a waste ! When I showed him that he could forget the calculator and just use his "hand held manual metric-Imperial linear measurement conversion device" he was a bit pissed, but found it worked just as well. Thirty two pounds equals one slug... aaarrrrggggghhhhhh !

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Bob Bolton
Date: 09 Jan 05 - 11:01 PM

G'day Bill D,

"... I know that controls are built to reflect the side of the road...my point is that we Americans get to shift and do all those other things with the right hand, which is a bit easier for 'most' people. You have centuries of tradition, and no doubt one can do it all either way, with practice ..."

Well that certainly explains a lot about Americans' driving ... I'll stick to using my dominant right hand to steer ... and quite successfully using my left for minor chores like gearchanging - or occasional fiddling with radios, sound gear &c!

And, after an education entirely based on foolish (or really - in their intent to swindle the poorer classes - plain dishonest) Imperial measurements ... when I came to work at the technical end of a precise medium - photography, I quickly concluded that anyone who wanted to muddle his way through with Imperial measurements was a fool not worth employing ... or even talking to.

Regard(les)s,

Bob

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Bill D
Date: 10 Jan 05 - 12:08 AM

G'day, Bob...y' mean my theory is all wet? Oh, no! First mistake I ever made!....(Y' see, I have never driven a right-hand drive car..per'aps I need to get abroad a bit and try it. Like in the outback where I'm not so likely to hit anything while I try to remember why the gear shift is not THERE when I reach for it.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Bert
Date: 10 Jan 05 - 01:09 AM

The metric system is wonderful!! It makes it easier to divide by ten at the expense of making it impossible to divid by three.

And that's what you call progress?

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: GUEST,MudGuard
Date: 10 Jan 05 - 07:54 AM

(as a guest as I can't log in at the moment)

Bert, see my post above - how many furlongs make up one third of a mile? Or how many ounces make up one third of a pound?
In both cases, you have fractions ...

If it were a twelve-bases system, I'd agree, but it is a
3 or 4 or 5.5 or 8 or 10 or 12 or 14 or 16 or 20 or ... based non-system.

s&r, you are contradicting yourself with
Tradesmen already ignore metric rules which is why Kitchen units are given in millimetres, waist and collar sizes in centimetres;
How can they ignore metric rules by using metric measures?

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Jan 05 - 09:20 AM

Customer: I'd like 3 6-foot battens, please
Salesman: We don't do feet and inches. It's all metric now.
Customer: Well I'll have 3 2-metre battens, then
Salesman: We don't do 2-metre lengths.
Customer: What lengths do you do?
Salesman: 1.8m and 2.1m
Customer: How long are they?
Salesman: 6ft and 7ft.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 10 Jan 05 - 12:03 PM

Metric weights and measures are also superior in that they are interchangeable; a litre of water weighs a kilo--how nifty is that?

The American weights and measures system is older than the Imperial system (like yankee spelling, they came with the original English settlers). They are sometimes referred to as 'common measure' and you see them usually in cookery: cups, tablespoons, teaspoons etc. Damn handy if you don't own a scale. Bit dodgy for baking though.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Bert
Date: 10 Jan 05 - 03:03 PM

In both cases, you have fractions ...(2 2/3 and 5 1/3)

That's just my point. Continued exposure to the metric system removes the though process of fractions other than tenths, and a person brought up using the metric system would not have been able to give the above answer.

Years ago I was working on a conveyor system that had been designed in Germany. It was clear from the designs that the engineers were incpable of even thinking of dividing by three.

They had conveyors with one central leg, or three, or five central legs, but not one conveyor with two central legs because that would have divided the length into three; and they just couldn't do that, even though, in many cases, that would have been the obvious solution to an English designer.

Any restricted denominator system is seriously limited and to make such a system the norm for every form of measurement is short sighted indeed.

Decimal fractions can be very useful, engineers use them often when working with inches. There is nothing stopping anyone using them whenever they are more convenient, but why force them onto every form of measure?

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 10 Jan 05 - 03:08 PM

I don't understand you here, Bert. 500mL is a fraction: (1/2L) ...?

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Bert
Date: 10 Jan 05 - 03:24 PM

500ml is a fraction, but it is a half not a third.

Now you can get an approximation to a third using the metric system but for some reason engineers don't do it with linear measure 'cos the thought process is gone.

Now I have seen 33cl used in Europe but I suspect that it was sales people who thought that up.

Another phenomenon that comes hand in hand with decimal fractions is this modern love affair with excessive accuracy. When the calculator took over from the slide rule folks seemd to think that ten decimal places were required for all measurements.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: diesel
Date: 10 Jan 05 - 03:56 PM

And then it goes live !

http://www.gometric.ie/

rgds

Diesel

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 10 Jan 05 - 04:24 PM

33cl is quite widely used - of course it has the advantahe that every time you spit 1l into three 333cls, you have a profit for the house of 1cl - and with big quantities that stacks up.

"I'm for change and progress" sounds easy, but it all depends on what it actually means. Going forward, when you on a cliff edge, is a kind of forward progress that is best avoided, and dropping dead with a heart attack is definitely a change, but it's not generally felt to be a change for the better. And fashion isn't always the same thing as progress.

Both systems have some advantages. Going back to the old one would be more trouble than it's worth in Europe, but I think you'd probably be best off sticking with the old ways in North America.
.........

When it comes to wood, sure it's easy enough when it comes to length - but a lot tricker when it comes to the other dimensions. You want a one inch plank to mend something and the only thing available is a metric measure which is over or under an inch, what are you supposed to do? Buy it big and plane it down? (And of course that would apply if the change had been the other way round.)

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 10 Jan 05 - 05:08 PM

Wood is never the dimension it says it is, just an approximation. If you wanted a two-by-four that actually was 2" x 4" you need to get it planed and pay ten times the price (learned that the hard way when I sent the wife to buy lumber).

A pint in the Iron Horse in my home town would cost £1-18s-4d instead of £1.92 had the UK not gone decimal.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: GUEST,12String stan
Date: 10 Jan 05 - 05:36 PM

Fuck!
I really opened a bag o cats with this one didn't I!!!

Roll on the metric i say, But the car i have, as most others, the speedo is in Miles, With K's minor underneath, wich means i'll have to mentally travel in mph as i'd have to crane my head towards the dial and squint to see what kph i was doing, probably inviting me to end up in the arse of someone tootling along minding their own buisness. But worry not,as previously mentioned, distance is already measured in K's in Ireland, except in some very rural areas where the very old cast iron signs are in miles, but omitt to tell you this, plus these signs are now finding there merry way onto the walls of Irish pubs all over the world, creating employment for the Fly boy with a spanner. rendering half of rural Ireland totally unsigned.
Now surely the Metric cannot be any more confusing than this!
I await the speeding fines......

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Bert
Date: 10 Jan 05 - 05:44 PM

Actually BigPinkLad they didn't go decimal they went centigesimal. And that was 'cos at that time someone wanted the other one hundred and forty pennies out of the pound.

They got those pennies fairly quickly and set the stage for rampant inflation.

When they started f^%#ing with the coinage the price of a pint was less than five bob. Now I hope those who think that they got PROGRESS are happy paying one pound and ninetytwo pees for their beer.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 10 Jan 05 - 07:30 PM

I rather assume there'll be little stickers you can put on the speedometer to show kilometres. Overpriced, of course, but they shouldn't cost too much, even so.

If they've rounded the speeds off down rather than up, at least that's a step in the right direction anyway. And that is what I mean when I count some change as "progress". Decimalisation is just a kind of juggling in my estimation. Quite entertaining to watch, quite difficult to do, and you always end up dropping something you didn't mean to drop.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Jan 05 - 08:19 PM

Having gone through complete decimalisation/metrication here in Australia over the last
forty years I find most of the arguements above very familiar, about the only one that I
haven't seen yet is the senior citizen one: "They shouldn't do this decimalisation until
all we old people have died." That is not to say that some of the points made don't have
merit, but the only thing to do once a government has made up its mind to convert is to
learn the new system, even if it's only just as much as you must know for everyday use.
And, by-the-way, the speed conversion between miles and kilometres is 5/8 or 8/5, that is,
to convert miles to k's you divide by five and multiply by eight, 30 mph is roughly 48kph.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 10 Jan 05 - 08:33 PM

Right then, if you're into change, how about this one ( from the New Scientist):

Novel calendar system creates regular dates

A US physicist is lobbying for people to adopt his novel calendar in which every date falls on the same day of the week each year.
..."For many years, I've had to make up a new schedule to tell my class when homework is due," says Dick Henry, a physicist at Johns Hopkins University in Baltimore, Maryland, US. "Here I am putting all this totally unnecessary work in and I decided I better do something about it..."

So Henry designed a calendar that uses 364 days, which breaks down evenly into 52 weeks. In his so called "Calendar-and-Time" (C&T) plan, each month contains 30 or 31 days. He decided on each month's length by forbidding the new calendar to differ from the old one by more than five days and by setting Christmas Day, 25 December, to always fall on a Sunday...

His constraints meant eight months would have different lengths than they do now. March, June, September, and December would each contain 31 days, while the other months would each get 30. To keep the calendar in synchronisation with the seasons, Henry inserted an extra week - which is not part of any month - every five or six years. He named the addition "Newton Week" in honour of his favourite physicist, Isaac Newton.

You can read the rest of it on the New Scientist website.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Wotcha
Date: 11 Jan 05 - 11:25 AM

The conspiracy theorist might surmise that this is another example of EU encroachment on national sovereignty ... didn't Eire have a problem with EU rules being imposed without the will of its people under its Constitution? So far Eire and the UK have resisted Schengen (which was backdoored by the Amsterdam Treaty).

Congratulations on another EU impost: 16% (or thereabouts) mandatory VAT imposed without representation: gotta love the United States of Europe!!



If you go to the Daimler museum in Stuttgart (Bad Cannstadt) you will find that early German vehicles' steering wheels were on the right side (so that drivers could see the ditch just like coach drivers ... nothing to do with drawing swords).

Auf Wiedersehen

Mehr Steuer, bitte!

Brian

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: GUEST,Mingulay
Date: 11 Jan 05 - 11:54 AM

What is the problem about changing gear with the "wrong" hand? How many American built cars DO NOT have slush boxes and only two pedals, or is stick shift now the order of the day?

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 11 Jan 05 - 03:28 PM

Even with an automatic car a handbrake is customary.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Shanghaiceltic
Date: 11 Jan 05 - 07:51 PM

At school we studied in imperial units and I was trained as an engineer in the Royal Navy and all the engineering training was done using SI units.

My first draft to a submarine was a bit of a shock, some pressure gauges were in Bar (1B=14.5 psi roughly) and some were in PSI. Some equipment was made using metric threads for nuts and bolts other equipment was measured in imperial units, so you needed two sets of spanners to have a full tool kit (provided some nice shipmate did not half-inch them).

Subsequent submarines were more metricised but we still kept depth in feet and not metres, we also measured our speed in knots not KPH or even MPH.

On a flight now most in flight displays will give you altitude in Feet and Meters and speed in KPH or Knots.

My last boat did not have 'bar' as a pressure unit but was fully SI and used Pascals as the pressure unit. 1,000,000, Pascals = 1 Bar, so all the guages had a XX x 10^6 monicker and lots of red and green lines to warn us when a pressure or a level was in a danger area.

I now find it harder to think in imperial units as all my work is now done in SI units. The only thing I dont have to think about is a pint, long may that continue.

The Chinese and the Japanese have there own unit of length but this is only used in traditional craftwork and by fewer people. Their engineering is all done in SI units. I drive here using KPH and I swaer metrically (needs 10 shouts of w******'s to attract the attention of the offending motorist).

'Give them and inch and they take a yard' does not roll off the tongue in metric. There wold have to be arguments about whther to use 'Give them a millimetre...' or 'Give them a centimetre....'

I was once working on a project here on depth measurement on a river was going to be displayed in mH20 (metres of water 1mH2=100 Kpa= 1 bar) Quite easy. In the US there are three imperial level units (Inches H20) because three different temperature levels are specified to define the unit. Therefore metric is easier to use.

It is also far easier to do engineering calulations in SI units without making a mistake than imperial units.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 11 Jan 05 - 08:28 PM

TBPL Metric weights and measures are also superior in that they are interchangeable; a litre of water weighs a kilo--how nifty is that?
That is just because a kilo has been defined as the weight of a litre of water at standard tempreature (4 degrees C) and pressure. Or was it the other way around?

A pint of water weighs a pound and a quarter. Not such a close correlation it would appear. Until you realise that with 8 pints to the gallon, a gallon of water weighs ten pounds.

Nigel

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Gurney
Date: 12 Jan 05 - 02:34 AM

Don't worry about it, just worry about paying for it.

I moved to NZ shortly after they 'went decimal' and all the cars I could afford were in MPH and gallons, etc. I put two felt-tip marks on the speedo,(having been paced by someone in a new car) and then forgot about it. How many speed-limits do you need to worry about?

As someone said up there, wood measures are nominal, for planed timber anyway, as they are 100x50mm (4x2 substitute) only for rough-sawn, and that is likely to be up to 3mm out. After planing and gauging it is 97x47mm or thereabouts, depending on the source. 2.4m x1.2m wallboard. A yard is a 'bit' less than a metre. No problem.

I did understand, though, that the reason that the world used to drive on the left side until Napoleon's Empire is that it was demanded that way by waggoners and coachmen. Right-handed people use their whip in that hand and could use it better down the side of vehicle. This was confirmed to my satisfaction by watching Hollywood movies.

Obviously Napoleon was caggy-handed.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Bert
Date: 12 Jan 05 - 12:59 PM

The reason Napoleon changed from inches to centimetres was 'cos 10 centimetres sounds better that his four inches.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: Bill D
Date: 12 Jan 05 - 01:14 PM

hmmm...most cars I have driven recently (in the US) have both MPH and KPH marked on the speedo---inner ring and outer ring. Seems easy enough for the manufacturer to do.

Subject: RE: BS: Metric Speed Limits (IRL)
From: JennyO
Date: 12 Jan 05 - 08:59 PM

My car has both measurements, and it is an *ancient* 1982 model Holden. I'm in Oz - my generation grew up with the old Imperial measurements, but we went metric long ago. All I can say really, is that after a while you develop strategies to deal with it, and you get used to it. I wouldn't have it any other way now.

It is useful to be familiar with how they relate to each other approximately when you come across things like old cookbooks, and I must admit that when it comes to lengths, such as working out how my furniture is going to fit into a room, or looking at a folded tarp which is 900cm x 600, I quickly convert to a rough approximate measurement in feet, by dividing by 30 (approximately the numbers of cm in a foot) I can visualize the size of something that is 30 x 20ft much better than the other way - or I can look at a garden stake that is 2100mm and think - yeah, that's a 7 ft garden stake. So I guess I have my feet in both camps, but I'm quite comfortable that way.

Jenny