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BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5
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Subject: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: Dave the Gnome Date: 20 May 26 - 11:58 AM There is a known issue with threads that go over 700 posts so this is a new UK politics thread in anticipation of the old one closing. Old one is still available to read here |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: Stilly River Sage Date: 21 May 26 - 10:01 AM This new thread is quiet so far - does that mean everything has settled down in UK politics, or are you all just at a loss for words (as is the case on this side of the pond)? (Just giving it a boost to be noticed.) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: Dave the Gnome Date: 21 May 26 - 10:47 AM There is a bit of a lull while the press regroup to attack the Green Party. They have found that antisemitic doesn't work against a party with a Jewish leader :-D The firt incling I have had is that they wre now jumoing on the TERF bandwagon and claiming that the Greens support transgender folk entering single gender toilets to attack and rape ciswomen... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: r.padgett Date: 21 May 26 - 11:09 AM All ~ nearly action stops due to activities re Burnham's attempt to get elected as an MP for Makerfield Sweeting as a back bencher making his policy statements Starmer and Reeves making Govt policy "going forwards" and cheaper chocolate and free travel during August school hols! Ray |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: The Sandman Date: 22 May 26 - 04:38 AM IMO, many of the labour front bench are puppets or and supporters of Israel, I hope Burnham might be more independent. however at the moment I might vote either the green party or corbyns party depending on individual candidates in my constituency. free travel should be extended to railways for old people as it is in ireland, another good social democratic idea would be to provide free school breakfasts,,children can work better if they are not hungry |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: r.padgett Date: 22 May 26 - 01:33 PM Free school break fasts are available to primary aged kids already yes all for free train tickets for OAPs ~ Freedom Riders ~ group been in existence a long time Ray |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: Nigel Parsons Date: 22 May 26 - 01:41 PM "another good social democratic idea would be to provide free school breakfasts,,children can work better if they are not hungry" While it would benefit some pupils it is taking more responsibility from parents, and placing it elsewhere. As a general measure it is not one I would agree with. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: r.padgett Date: 23 May 26 - 12:59 AM Now Nigel that comment is a bit harsh for the poor in 2026 UK ~ though I get the point some may well be taking the state for granted Ray |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: MaJoC the Filk Date: 23 May 26 - 07:00 AM
There'll always be an overlap. Then there's those* who should do it, but don't, because they don't want people to realise they're poor .... * The inhabitants of Cockbill Street come to mind. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: The Sandman Date: 24 May 26 - 01:48 AM nigel . it is a principle of paternalistic capitalism feed an animal well and it will work better the reverse princple is portrayed in the song barnyards of delgaty the people that are very good at taking the state for granted are the rich who hire expensive accountants to evade tax As I came in by Turra Market Turra Market for to fee, I fell in wi' a wealthy farmer, The barnyards O' Delgaty. Linten adie toorin adie, Linten adie toorin ee, Linten lowrin, lowrin, lowrin The Barnyards O' Delgaty He promised me the two best horses Ever I set my eyes upon; When I got home to the Barnyards There was nothing there but skin and bone. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: MaJoC the Filk Date: 24 May 26 - 04:17 AM > the rich who hire expensive accountants to evade tax .... Ah: the alpha freeloaders. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: The Sandman Date: 24 May 26 - 07:15 AM some may be taking the state for granted.......Andrew Mountbatten ....Fergie, a couple of the parker bowles? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: The Sandman Date: 25 May 26 - 09:36 AM imo the website would benefit if the librarian was encouraged to promote it daily on facebook.and promote it on associated groups such as trad music facebook groups |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: Rain Dog Date: 25 May 26 - 01:14 PM That Starmer has a lot to answer for. There was no mention of the VWML in the Labour manifesto. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: The Sandman Date: 25 May 26 - 02:15 PM another reason not to vote for them? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: Dave the Gnome Date: 27 May 26 - 06:32 AM Dick. Was your post of 25 May 26 - 09:36 AM meant for here or the VWML thread? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: r.padgett Date: 27 May 26 - 09:10 AM Our Rach is considering raising petrol by 2p per litre? Hope not ~any petrol and diesel increases affect everything including food What can be taxed? I still reckon a Capital gains tax on House prices is a good idea ~ devising the calculation would be interesting but I think few would argue that current valuations of housing is too HIGH! Streeting has his own thoughts on this too Ray |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: r.padgett Date: 28 May 26 - 01:46 AM All stops whilst leadership elections for Labour MPs and possible PM fight What on earth is happening ~ of course MPs will be off on their hols if not now shortly Ray |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: r.padgett Date: 28 May 26 - 09:51 AM Youth un employment ~ the unemployment is an issue that was first kicked down the road by employers saying that school leavers were not educated with skills that the employers needed ~ hence they were encouraged to stay at school and university Then Blair brought in payment for education by those students, I think an American idea ~ this is shown to have its faults which have now come home to rest! I wonder whether the help centres and call centres for large businesses with UK customers should have UK based helpers/advisers and not in far distant lands where English is not the first language could be considered or am I being racist? Ray |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: MaJoC the Filk Date: 28 May 26 - 12:44 PM > or am I being racist? Practical: I find phone conversations difficult at the best of times, and it's worse with call centres where the wage slaves are punished if they go off-script. Having to decrypt the Mumbai Mumble as well just puts the brown-coloured cherry on top. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: r.padgett Date: 28 May 26 - 05:52 PM I too have suffered these phone calls and they are not pleasant Ray |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: The Sandman Date: 29 May 26 - 02:36 AM What can be taxed? What can be taxed? quote increase betting tax, tobacco tax, alcohol tax to reduce inflation on goods,encourage transport by electric vehicles by canal and rail and by sail where possible |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: The Sandman Date: 29 May 26 - 02:59 AM There are currently about 1,271 zero-emission Heavy Goods Vehicles (HGVs) on UK roads. While this marks a 28% year-on-year increase, it represents a tiny fraction of the total 741,010 HGVs registered nationwide.Electric lorries are gaining serious momentum in the UK, especially for urban and regional distribution. However, the transition presents some hurdles: Pressroom Newsroom Electric Freightway helps drive more than a quarter of UK eHGV registrations Electric Freightway supported 161 of the UK’s 587 zero emission HGV registrations in 2025 – more than a quarter of the total market Electric or ‘eHGV’ registrations rose 171% year-on-year, surpassing 1,000-truck milestone New vehicle models and high-power charging infrastructure continue to accelerate real-world adoption of electric freight |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: r.padgett Date: 29 May 26 - 03:07 AM So Rachel's NI hike are now being reported as having a negative effect on youth employment ~ WE (or right I) said that would happen That first budget sounded the death bells for Rach and Keir ~ why did Labour not sort proper tax measures for the wealthy during last 15 years? Ray |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: The Sandman Date: 29 May 26 - 03:16 AM perhaps, because they are being led by the wrong people who are members of the establishment who cow tow to the very rich. we need harold wilson |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: peteglasgow Date: 29 May 26 - 04:31 AM if only the trade unions had more power over the labour party policy......i hope andy burnham will give the government a more left and people friendly steer, but i have my doubts - it's all depressingly familiar. some hope with michael foot, tony benn, jeremy corbyn, even ed miliband, then kier liar-starmer and now andy burnham. all of them are victims of the daily mail, the billionaires and the labour right wing. anything progressive -like hope- is ruthlessly suppressed. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: r.padgett Date: 29 May 26 - 12:41 PM Trade Union power in UK Govt would certainly be a BIG influence good or bad and probably include left wing and Corbyn voters ~ interesting position would follow Ray |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: The Sandman Date: 31 May 26 - 01:12 PM UK trade union membership has fallen significantly since its peak of 13.2 million in 1979, dropping to approximately 6.4 to 6.6 million members. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: Rain Dog Date: 31 May 26 - 03:14 PM In the last election 9,708,716 people voted for Labour. The party's vote share was 33.7%, the lowest of any governing party on record, making this the least proportional general election in British history. The percentage of eligible voters was 20.1% 8 out of 10 eligible voters did not vote for Labour. Was it a surprise that they did badly in the local elections? No. Let those figures sink in. I was one of those 9,708,716 |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: r.padgett Date: 01 Jun 26 - 01:46 AM Conservatives are suffering it seems at the hands of the far right Revolting party and Labour voters are be devilled by the lies and basic issues regarding immigration putting fear reminiscent of the Nazis 1939 rise ~ bad times Ray |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: r.padgett Date: 01 Jun 26 - 01:50 AM Tourist tax at £2 per room per night? Families hit by this specifically Stay at home? What control do visitors have and carparking and facilities must be available at fair prices and huge charges are not acceptable Ray I will stay at home from the looks |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: Backwoodsman Date: 01 Jun 26 - 07:57 AM Interesting that ‘Fishy’ Rishi Sunak stated last week that the minimum wage is ‘too high’. Am I the only one who finds it difficult to take that kind of opinion from one of the richest men in the UK - and one who has never had to live and bring up a family on Minimum Wage? How does someone with a combined wealth with his wife of around £640 million have the absolute gall to claim that someone on £12.71 per hour is too well-off? It’s disgusting. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: The Sandman Date: 01 Jun 26 - 09:57 AM i agree |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: r.padgett Date: 04 Jun 26 - 01:22 AM Stabbing 8 times and police handcuff him as he lay dying ~ caused by lies spoken by assailant and nothing to do with police attitude to minority races imv Ray |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: The Sandman Date: 04 Jun 26 - 02:13 AM Police body camera footage released on Monday after the sentencing showed Mr. Nowak lying on the ground, saying “I can’t breathe” and telling officers repeatedly that he had been stabbed. One police officer can be heard saying, “I don’t think you have, mate.” quote from new york times |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: Nigel Parsons Date: 04 Jun 26 - 06:22 AM "Interesting that ‘Fishy’ Rishi Sunak stated last week that the minimum wage is ‘too high’. Am I the only one who finds it difficult to take that kind of opinion from one of the richest men in the UK - and one who has never had to live and bring up a family on Minimum Wage? How does someone with a combined wealth with his wife of around £640 million have the absolute gall to claim that someone on £12.71 per hour is too well-off? It’s disgusting." £12.71ph for a 35 hour week = £444.85p.w. Basic State pension £184.90p.w. New State Pension £241.30p.w. I think maybe Rishi Sunak has got a point, particularly as the rise in minimum wage, and extending it to younger workers, seems to have persuaded businesses to reduce hiring. How rich Rishi (and/or his partner) is should have no relevance to the discussion. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: Backwoodsman Date: 04 Jun 26 - 07:38 AM I agree, Nigel, the State Pension is far too low (reportedly only thirteenth amongst European countries). However, the level of the State Pension, a Benefit paid by the State to people on the basis of their age is an irrelevant comparison to the minimum wage paid by employers to working people for their labour. Apples and Oranges. It’s interesting, and very enlightening regarding your mindset, that you seem to believe that payment for work should be related to the level of a State Benefit. Perhaps you need to take the Tory blinkers off and do a bit of unbiased thinking? And, if you fail, or more likely in your case, refuse to see the incongruity of a man with a fortune of £640 million telling someone who is paid £445 for a week’s work that he is ‘too well-off’, I suggest there is something sadly amiss with your perception of equity. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: Nigel Parsons Date: 04 Jun 26 - 08:41 AM However, the level of the State Pension, a Benefit paid by the State to people It is NOT a 'benefit' it is part of a contract made between the government and the public paid as a result of us paying NI over the decades. If it was a 'benefit' it would be a gateway to other benefits. And, if you fail, or more likely in your case, refuse to see the incongruity of a man with a fortune of £640 million telling someone who is paid £445 for a week’s work that he is ‘too well-off’, I suggest there is something sadly amiss with your perception of equity. And if you fail to see that the Labour Party's minimum wage policies are causing unemployment, and putting people out of business, maybe you are blinkered. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: Backwoodsman Date: 04 Jun 26 - 05:33 PM In fact, since the 1946 National Insurance Act, the State Pension is legally classed as a Benefit, accepted and described as such by both Labour and Tory governments, including during the fourteen years of Tory mis-rule which ended in 2024, by their Tory press and media, and by the current ‘Blue Labour’ government. Whilst I agree with your sentiment and I dislike the State Pension being included in the list of State Benefits for the reasons you give, that agreement doesn’t alter the fact one jot. But none of that lends any credence to your comparison of Minimum Wage v. State Pension - they are unconnected, and it’s a very strange, disjointed thought-process that would believe they should be otherwise. And have you considered that there are a great many Benefits claimants who either choose not to work because low wages make it more profitable, or who do work but, because of their low wages, have to claim Benefits in order to live? One of the answers to reducing the Benefits bill and lowering unemployment is to make work more attractive by making pay better. Not a universal panacea, but an important element in the battle against rising Benefits bill and unemployment. I’d have thought that an habitual imbiber of the Tory Kool-aid would have been all for that. And finally, as usual you’re carefully avoiding the question - do you see the incongruity of a man with a fortune of £640 million telling someone who is paid £445 for a week’s work that he is ‘too well-off’? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: The Sandman Date: 05 Jun 26 - 10:51 AM the incongruity of a man with a fortune of £640 million telling someone who is paid £445 for a week’s work that he is ‘too well-off’? " quote whoever says such a thing does not understand the consumer society, for the consumer society to work consumers must have money one person is unlikely to spend spend 64 million, as q |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: The Sandman Date: 05 Jun 26 - 12:05 PM as quickly as 64 million spend a pound |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: r.padgett Date: 06 Jun 26 - 01:32 AM NIRP is a pension funded by PAYG ~ aka Pay as you go out of current funds ~ initially by NiC ~ National Insurance funds but probably insufficient to cover the pension bill New generations need to pay for the pensions bill so children's number need to be kept up!! This payment provides a fall back where some people have been unableto make private provision by payments to pension schemes etc Value of NIRP needs to be maintained of course by whatever index by law Ray |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: The Sandman Date: 06 Jun 26 - 03:26 AM the uk does not need advice from vance |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: Backwoodsman Date: 06 Jun 26 - 08:09 AM ”This payment provides a fall back where some people have been unableto make private provision by payments to pension schemes etc” Unable to or, in many cases, unwilling to. As the Pension Scheme Administrator in my final job (13 years the Management Accountant of the UK branch of a multi-national plastics-processing company) it was my job to encourage workers to join the company-sponsored scheme, where optional contribution rates began at 0% employee, 5% employer - effectively a non-contributory pension scheme - up to 5% ‘ee and 10% ‘er. I was always astonished when employees refused to join - even at the lowest rates of 0% ‘ees and 5% ‘ers - usually because they thought there was either ‘a catch’, or that it would somehow ‘benefit the company’. There’s an old saying about horses, water, and drinking… |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: The Sandman Date: 06 Jun 26 - 01:57 PM there have been examples of pension schemes here that have defrauded. Pension schemes that have defaulted with contributors' money typically fall into categories of corporate fraud, Ponzi-style scams, or massive business insolvencies where promised funds could not be paid out.Notable historical and high-profile pension schemes and investment funds that collapsed with contributors' money include :1. Corporate Raiding and FraudMirror Group Newspapers: In one of the most notorious corporate fraud cases, media tycoon Robert Maxwell secretly raided and used roughly £450 million of his own employees' pension fund assets as collateral for bank borrowings to support his failing business empire.Custom House Capital (Ireland): An Irish investment firm that ran into major regulatory issues when it emerged that €50 million of client and pension money was tied up in unauthorized, high-risk property investments without contributors' consent. The High Court eventually ordered the fund into liquidation and a compensation process commenced for affected pension savers. 2. Unregulated Investment and Ponzi SchemesDolphin Trust / German Property Investments: This scheme collapsed and wiped out approximately €150 million of Irish pension investors' money. The scheme—which sold high-yield property renovations to thousands of Irish pension holders—turned out to be a massive fraud. The owner was subsequently convicted of serious fraud.Solar 21 (Ireland): An investment firm that raised hundreds of millions from mainly older, Irish pension investors for a waste-to-energy project in the UK. The project collapsed, leaving the firm owing investors roughly €300 million and severely impacting their retirement savings .3. Defined Benefit Deficits and InsolvenciesWaterford Crystal (Ireland): While this was not a "default" due to direct theft, the company's collapse in 2009 led to a pension scheme being wound up with a massive deficit of roughly €110 million. Thousands of former workers saw their promised pension entitlements and retirement savings slashed due to a lack of legal protection surrounding employer insolvency at the time.Equitable Life (UK): A major mutual life insurance company that collapsed due to a severe financial miscalculation in guaranteed annuity rates. It affected over a million policyholders and led to one of the biggest financial scandals in European history, ultimately requiring a government compensation scheme.In cases of unregulated investments, contributors often lose their savings entirely because they fall outside standard investor protection funds. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: r.padgett Date: 06 Jun 26 - 01:59 PM For your information I was a Final Salary scheme pensions administrator for 7 years too when the GMPs first started initially I calculated these manually (1978) And yes some schemes cost nothing and others not a lot ~ employers of course picked up the cost and benefits per the handbook Workers and less well off felt unable to pay/join and yes the schemes are now automatic and employees contributions are more than first stated I did end up lecturing btw Ray |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: Backwoodsman Date: 06 Jun 26 - 02:28 PM Ray, my point was that the fact that some people have no pension provision other than the State Pension may be a matter of choice. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: The Sandman Date: 06 Jun 26 - 03:09 PM if it is a matter of choice, could it be that they have lost confidence because of people like Maxwell, therefore imo the state pension should be increased |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: Backwoodsman Date: 06 Jun 26 - 03:49 PM I can’t, for the life of me, understand why anyone would refuse to join an occupational pension scheme to which they had to contribute absolutely nothing but to which their employer contributed an amount equating to 5% of their wage/salary. They had nothing to lose, and everything to gain, yet they were convinced there was a hidden ‘catch’, or they thought ‘the company’ would somehow gain a benefit from their membership, which they would not countenance. I think the introduction, a number of years ago, of compulsory enrolment in workplace pension schemes is a good thing. Whether the State Pension should be increased is a matter of opinion. As with all State Benefits, it has to be paid for out of taxation - I would be happy to see an increase in State Pension provided it was paid for equitably, by reining-in tax-avoidance schemes taken advantage of by the wealthy, rather than by taxing those at the lower end of the income scale more heavily. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit and other UK politics thread 5 From: r.padgett Date: 07 Jun 26 - 12:54 AM Yes Dick pension schemes have/had trustees but of course these tend to also be CEOs! differing from the professional administrators the law and jobs and conflicts of interest are difficult to reconcile ~ we see such abuses currently with little t of course For the record pension schemes imv have many anomalies ~ I could go on Ray |
