BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!

Subject: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Art Thieme
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 11:16 AM

Gary Kasparov has been let out of jail by Vladimir Putin.

My first remembrance of G.K. was playing Bobby Fisher in the world chess championships.

That said, what's Bobby doing now?

Art

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Amos
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 11:19 AM

I believe he builds auto bodies. But, forgive my ignorance, but why was a world chess master in jail? Did he fail to castle in time?


A

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Greg B
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 11:21 AM

Kasparov is now the leader of the opposition party in Russia.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: katlaughing
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 11:56 AM

I heard just a snippet on the radio and was wondering if it was the same Kaparov. Wow!

That's my first memory of him, too, Art.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: pdq
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 11:57 AM

...according to Wikipoopoo...

"Fischer now lives in Iceland, and has also become known for his anti-Americanism and anti-Semitism, despite his being of Jewish descent."

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 12:16 PM

and American!

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 12:31 PM

A man quite willing to engage in self-criticism, perhaps? Or something like that? ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Amos
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 01:05 PM

Sound smore like self-loathing!


A

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: bobad
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 01:14 PM

It's good to see that Putin has finally gotten the hang of the politics of democracy.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Art Thieme
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 01:20 PM

Kasperov was arrested while leading a protest march in Moscow. He was held for the last five days.

Art

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 01:34 PM

What Putin has the hang of doing is governing Russia in a fashion that actually works in that society. As such, he has done far better than his predecessors did.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Amos
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 01:49 PM

Thanks, Art -- I missed the story on his arrest.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 02:37 PM

The real basic nuts-n-bolts explanation for Fischer appears (to me) to be just that he's a nut case. Even among international chess competitors where that's somewhat "normal" he was (is?) a bit bizarre.

Wikipedia has a pretty full history.

I haven't been able to tell from news reports just how much of an "in-charge-guy" Kasparov is in the recent protests, but his name name and reputation should give him some "voice" - one would hope. If he's not the leader he's certainly likely to be high among the leaders. The protest efforts seem to be centered among members of the legal professions(?) but details have been sparse.

I just hope he'll keep his head down and stay safe - and wish him well.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Peter K (Fionn)
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 03:29 PM

He has done far better than his predecessors did.

With the notable exceptions of Gorbachev and Kruschev, Little Hawk. Of course it wasn't his fault he inherited such a mess of rampant capitalism: America's favourite, Yeltsin, was responsible for that. Kasparov incidentally is, or was, a candidate for the Russian presidency, representing The Other Russia which is an amalgam of some of the opposition parties. Naturally he had/has no hope of winning.

I would apologise for thread drift except that the thread has been in drift mode from the start: I don't think Fischer ever played Kasparov at any level. So I will continue the drift in case someone finds it interesting.

Fischer's opponent in the famous clash of Titans at Reykjavik was Boris Spassky, and that was the only true world championship in which he played.

Fischer had wanted the 1972 match to be in Belgrade but Spassky's preference was Iceland. How Spassky won on that point I don't know, since many Fischer conditions, some bizarre, were met without argument. For the rematch 20 years later, the venue was indeed Belgrade and the match was played in defiance of US sanctions then in effect against Yugoslavia. As a result Fischer finished up either indicted or persona non grata in the US and settled in .... Iceland.

He was supposed to play Karpov (not to be confused with Kasparov) in another world championship in 1975, but not all of his 64 conditions (one for every square of the board) were met and he resigned the match. One condition was that the match should continue until one player had won 10 games, which meant it could have gone on for ever. A first-to-six championship in the 1920s took 34 games to complete. Draws have bcome ever more likely in subsequent years, encouraging a theory that the realistic possibilities in chess are close to exhaustion. As I am myself after that little discourse.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 03:30 PM

I've heard a couple of interviews with Kasparov on public radio. He seems brilliant, sincere, erudite, and a true believer in the principles of democracy.

In other words, his chances of achieving a position of real political power are zip.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Art Thieme
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 04:08 PM

Now I am thinking that i'm confusing Kasparov and Spassky. When your memory goes, forget it!-------It was Fisher who walked out of the match hosting hotel's lobby on Dec. 24th saying, "I hate to hear chess nuts boasting in an open foyer..."   




(Art)

Subject: RE: BS: Kasparov and Fisher!!
From: Slag
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 04:31 PM

Chess is full of nuts! Gk, perhaps excepted. Paul Morphy, the first international champion who pretty much birthed the modern game, wound up in an asylum in New Orleans. He would march around shouting "the little king is coming, the little king is coming."

Upon losing a game to an unknown the brilliant Dr. Alexheine (not sure of the spelling anymore)grabbed his king, knocked over the table and shouted "I know I must lose. God knows I must lose! BUT WHY MUST I LOSE TO THIS IDIOT!!!" whereupon he threw the king out the window. Talk about no glory in winning...!

Fischer got dirty treatment by the F.I.D.E. and I think it really pushed him all the way over but he definitely had one foot beyond the pale and the other perched upon it in the first place.

It was my understanding that in the old USSR chess was a required subject in school (which I think is a pretty good idea in and of itself) and that way they could glean virtually all their population for strong players and prodigies. That a brilliant mind like Kasparov came to the fore as a chess champion says not so much about his singular ability as it does about the Soviet system. That he has strengths in other areas such as politics (unlike Fischer) should not be tied to his prowess as a World Chess Champ. He is a multifaceted individual. Fischer was more of a savant.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Bill D
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 04:53 PM

Kasparov has seen the world, and knows a bit about various forms of government...and can see the flaws in the Russian system. That makes him dangerous. Intelligence AND awareness are not a safe combo in Russia.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Slag
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 05:14 PM

Yes...!

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 05:34 PM

The flaws in the Russian system are obvious...just as are the flaws (different ones) in the American system. There is much to criticize in both cases. Intelligence and awareness, strongly employed in such criticism, is largely quite unwelcome in BOTH cases.

This, however, does not change the fact that Putin understands how to effectively govern Russia, whereas his predecessors clearly did not. They were selling the country out (after 1989) to western carpetbaggers and Russian Mafia crooks. Russian history suggests very strongly that the population in that country expects a government to be firm and authoritative and to use a heavy hand...and when it doesn't, the place falls apart in short order. You cannot successfully convert Russia into the kind of liberal society and democracy we have traditionally considered most desirable in the more prosperous nations of the West, because Russia has not been built on those liberal democratic traditions. That's my opinion. It's not like England, France, Canada or the USA.

Putin has read the situation correctly, I think. There will always be plenty to criticize about government in Russia...and such critics will always annoy hell out of those in charge...just as such critics over here annoy hell out of George Bush, for example. ;-) Meanwhile, the business of keeping the country (Russia) functioning will rest with people like Mr Putin.

Critics of official policy are good for a society. They serve as a conscience and a wake-up call. If put in charge, however, they might find it a lot tougher to realize their ideals than they suspected...specially in Russia.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Slag
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 05:44 PM

And by extension you could argue that Sadam Hussein better understood what the people of Iraq needed to keep them happy, er... at least controlled. We should have left him alone. A couple of Exocet strikes every now and then and a few military personnel killed is a whole lot better than the weird war we are involved in now, huh?

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 06:17 PM

Matter of fact, yes. Exactly. Iraq would have been far better off continuing under Saddam Hussein than it has been as a result of Mr Bush's illegal and totally inappropriate war. It would still be a secular society. It would still be an effective counterweight against Iran in that region. Fewer people would have died. Fewer would be refugees. Fewer people would be mad as hell at the USA. Fewer terrorists would be operating IN Iraq. And Saddam would still be a bastard...running a reasonably stable country.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Art Thieme
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 07:07 PM

Slag and Little Hawk,
You beat me to the posting of it! I've been thinking that for some time now.

Art

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: bobad
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 07:23 PM

"Russian history suggests very strongly that the population in that country expects a government to be firm and authoritative and to use a heavy hand.."

I am not as much a student of history as you LH but my impression is that governments that use murder and imprisonment as tools of control over their populations do not fare well in the long run and accomplish very little in the way of cultivating a society that respects the government and the rule of law.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Bill D
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 07:33 PM

Boy, I hate to agree with that, LH...but in hindsight, it seems that you are right. And in those circumstances, there 'might' have been a way to get rid of him eventually, with less loss of life property damage, and with FAR less money spent.
   and there is evidence that Bush was warned by various experts on the Middle-East that Iraq would be a sandy quagmire if he invaded.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 07:40 PM

I would certainly agree with that in a general sense, bobad.

On the other hand, I see no reason to change my opinion about what kind of government seems to work best in Russia.

As far as "the rule of law" goes, oppressive governments usually have little or no trouble instituting laws which make their abuses of their population technically entirely legal...in that society.

As to whether such a government fares well in the long run, that can depend on many factors, such as...

How well they handle the economy.
How well they provide employment and social services.
To what extent they maintain the support of a majority of the citizens at any given time.
To what extent they can direct the population's hostility at someone else rather than at the government.
To what extent they have the confidence of the citizenry.
To what extent they avoid terrible blunders in war and foreign policy.

Hitler's government, for example, handled all of the above matters very well, except the last one...his government failed when it got the country into wars way too big for Germany to handle. He was very successful domestically, but he overstepped himself in embarking on reckless military adventures.

The USA has a government at various levels which sanctions murder...in the form of capital punishment. This is pretty much unknown in western Europe, and it is regarded as barbaric by most Europeans. I'd have to agree with them on that. Still...it's legal in many American states.

You see, it all depends on one's perspective, and perspective is influenced by whatever a people are already accustomed to and mostly satisfied with. That varies from one place to another.

It looks to me like a majority of Russians think Putin has been doing a good job governing Russia. As long as they continue to think so, his position is strong, correct? That doesn't mean his hands are clean, and I'm not saying it does. If he had totally clean hands, he would not be running Russia! ;-) Nor would he be able to run Russia, and keep his hands clean.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Peter K (Fionn)
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 08:08 PM

Why are women no good at chess?

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 08:25 PM

Most women are simply too intelligent to waste their time playing a game like chess...they deal in the much more complex and challenging game of human personality interplay instead. And they're good at it! Far better than men in most cases.

But anyway, it is not even true that women are no good at chess. There are some excellent female chess players around...just not many...because like I said, they're mostly not interested in wasting their time that way.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 08:45 PM

It's not that women aren't good at chess, or even that they don't like it. It's all the beer guzzling, tobacco chewing, and general hell raising that goes on at those notoriously rowdy post-match parties.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 09:05 PM

That and the obligatory "whoopee cushion" jokes at all those high level chess matches. Women don't find that at all funny.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Slag
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 10:04 PM

Like I said, the Little King is coming, the Little King is coming!

Re Iraq, LH: It is amazing how subtle and clever our State Department has been conducted. It was as though "We'll fool 'em with razzle dazzle and mumbo jumbo and they'll never guess that we are really concerned with our own self interests (read "oil"). That is a "Hydra" subject and away from this thread but ... there it is. As in chess, the object is to win. It makes the pronouncements of real peace, democracy and representation seem like cheap window dressing or fodder for the party loyalists.

The Poison Pawn! Or the King's Bishop Gambit. A token gift, a concession but with a big nasty string attached. Would that a democratic spirit rose from the people of Iraq. That would go a long way to really ensuring stability, peace and progress in the region. Even if you see our efforts as noble, it's OUR idea, NOT THEIRS!

Sorry about the drift. I still think Kasparov has a brilliant mind that is not limited to the 64 squares but maybe you're right: it may not be right for Russia.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasparov and Fischer!!
From: Art Thieme
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 11:45 PM

My thanks to so many of you for making this thread more fascinating than it had any right to be.

It's all your fault, and none of mine. ;-)

But I possibly did at long last learn how to spell Kasparov and Fischer at this late date...
Art

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 30 Nov 07 - 12:25 AM

Yeah, Slag. ;-) You know, I think the State Department is basically happy as long as they can just convince a slim majority of Americans that it's not really about oil. They are playing to the home audience.

But what a shame about the world of chess! If chess masters would just get a bit more serious and act like grown, mature men...give up the whoopee cushions and joy buzzers and fake Grouch Marx mustaches and the other puerile pranks they are so well known for...well then, I'm sure that women would be attracted in droves to waste their time pushing little men around on a chessboard. I mean, hell, who wouldn't be? ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Slag
Date: 30 Nov 07 - 03:09 AM

In a Man's world there are just two choices. In the first it's chess and versions of chess, from schoolyard bullies to the Cold War and beyond. The second? Well, it's chest, or variations on the theme. I think you're right about the ladies. They are reading us and drawing up the topography of life while we play games.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: GUEST,Skarpi at work
Date: 30 Nov 07 - 03:48 AM

Hallo all , well Bobby is here and is feeling okei , maybe we should
take Kasparov here too ??

There are lot of women who are good at chess , many of them here
in Iceland .

all the best Skarpi Iceland .

I understand Russia well , I would not like to have rockets
near my bedside and neither would you .

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 30 Nov 07 - 04:18 AM

Perhaps of casual interest, if any actual chess-nuts are watching the thread, is the fairly recent success of a middlin' small town in Kansas at enlisting the aid and participation of Karpov in the establishing of the Anatoly Karpov International School of Chess.

They've been noted in local press releases and occasional "color pieces," and have received totally underwhelming response from the bulk of the people in the region; but seem to be implementing some fairly successful chess-education programs and at least some local/regional competitions.

(I'm waiting for the televised matches.)

John

Subject: RE: BS: Kasparov and Fischer!!
From: Art Thieme
Date: 30 Nov 07 - 01:38 PM

God, I can see it now:

THE FIRST ANNUAL FLINT HILLS WORLD'S CHESS AND FLATPICKING CHAMPIONSHIP !!!! (In case of rain, everyone will go under the Winfield fairgrounds bleachers!)

Art Thieme

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 30 Nov 07 - 03:16 PM

Art -

Now that's comparable to the time you said they took you t'other way from Winfield to Ark City to get boozed up, when they really drove ya' to Wellington - or maybe 'twas t'other way around. (I might have been a little boozed myself back then when we wuz both a bit younger.)

Lindsborg is about 120 miles (190 Km for the UKies) - generally north from Winfield. That's just about like a run into town fer a sody pop for some of 'em up there, but we'd need a little logistical management to get the townies to come down from the really remote places. Some of us "locals" ain't used to drivin' that far for casual purposes, but we could probably get up a crowd.

But if they moved it under the bleachers Bob wouldn't get his cut from all the crafters' booths, so we might have to come up with some alternatives for if the weather turns to "normal."

Since Lindsborg is kind of an "ethnic" settlement, we'd have to teach the church ladies at the fairground to make good 'tater pancakes, but that could probably be arranged.

The crafters could offer "themed" Dulcimers with checkerboard inlays, so beginners could play half a board under a tarp in the campgrounds maybe. I'm not sure we could get many of the guitar pickers to let us cut squares into the back of the Martins, but we could ask I guess.

Sounds like it has real possibilities though.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Slag
Date: 30 Nov 07 - 05:11 PM

J in K, are you rated? "Once rated, always rated" U. S. Chess Federation. I was about a "C" class player when I quit tournament play. I was really just beginning to get good and my best game was over an expert rated player but then I looked at my level of involvement and time consumption and realized it would be my whole life and I would be doing well to have made Master at some distant point in the future (like about now) so I just play the occasional game but I can and do appreciate those with the gift and the dedication.

Here's a little trivia from the Chess World that touches all our lives. Back in the mid 70's there was a fellow, a millionaire who lived near Lone Pine California, a little south of Mt. Whitney, just off Highway 395 as it begins up toward Owens Valley. It's still a pretty desolate place but back then there wasn't even television. This fellow, in addition to being a millionaire, was a chess aficionado and he established The Lone Pine Chess Tournament with a $100,000 prized, the biggest of its day. It was held at his ranch which was several miles west of the tiny town of Lone Pine(restaurant, gas station and a store [great movie location, though]). Those who lost out in the early rounds didn't have much to do other than playing casual games of chess or reading from the gentleman's library.

He studied on the problem and with some help he built a 25' parabolic antenna which he aimed at the various television network satellites. Now here was entertainment. Not only did they now have TV but they also got all the non-scheduled stuff that the live, waiting cameras were picking up! Well, the idea caught on and you see where it has lead!

The Office of the Royal Exchequer stems directly from the noble game as doest the concept of the Cartesian plane. Chess has greatly benefited Mankind in many ways. A great game!

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 30 Nov 07 - 05:56 PM

As games go, it's definitely among the very best.

I used to play a fair bit, but I decided at a certain point that it was eating up too much of my energy. When you play chess seriously you burn off a heck of a lot of mental energy...and for what? That's what I asked myself, and I lost interest in it at that point.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 30 Nov 07 - 06:11 PM

Slag -

My sole claim to chess fame hinges on one single game.

Many years ago, there was a chess club at a place where I worked. I had (mostly reluctantly) plaid a few lunchtime games, and was thus subjected to an unrelenting barrage of extortionate threats that I must come to the club and at least see if I liked it.

I finally relented, and went to a club meeting. A "surprise" to all who attended was a visit by the then current and newly crowned State Champion who offered to "play the club." More or less forced to play I pushed a couple of pieces, and concentrating "really hard" worked my way into one of those long, boring, losing games - not noticing that after about an hour there were only two of us left in play with the champ.

(Over half the club - about 15 or so - went down in less than 10 or 12 moves, which didn't seem to suggest a very stimulating regular competition.)

As the "champion" was quite obviously much more interested in "the other guy" than in me, since I could predict exactly what he was going to do each time he came back to the board, and since I'd known I was irretrievably beaten since the third move (unless he did something incredibly stupid), I took the gentlemanly option, eventually I think after about 80 moves or so, of resigning to permit the two of them to finish their "more interesting game."

It turned out that the "other guy" - unbeknownst to us all - was a Grand Master and 4 or 5 times State Champion with lots of experience in international competition - - semi-retired. Their game did not end but was abandoned when they could not come to a conlusion about whether pieces left could force a mate or had to be played to a stalemate and the staff started stacking up the chairs. (They did a lot more talking than playing during the last hour or so.)

Having so impressed everyone with my extended survival (fatally wounded and bleeding from the second move, but they didn't notice) I was never able to get another club member to sit down and play with me, so I retired from any and all "formal competition."

[Someone told me later that I'd used a "Queens Indian" defense, if you're interested, but I never looked it up. It made for too long a game - at least that time.]

I have never played in any "organized play" or in formal/ranking competition, and in fact never actually "joined" a chess club.

It's a great game, but frankly I'd rather - most times - just hang out with the girls. (Joining in the plots against macho foolishness - as cited by others above - is optional.)

John

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 30 Nov 07 - 06:18 PM

It takes an odd sort of mind to get really seriously into chess. That's my opinion. Of course, I'm prejudiced. ;-) (like everyone)

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Slag
Date: 30 Nov 07 - 07:39 PM

What?! YOU pre-juiced!??? e4, white wins by force! Napoleon said to the effect (I don't do French) "I command the greatest army in the world and nations fall before me. Why can't I manage 16 men on a field 8 by 8?" He was only a mediocre player. Yes, it takes a person of great ego and logical brilliance to be a chess champion.

J of K, congratulations for enduring against one of the luminaries of the game. I played Doug Root in a tournament in Bakersfield CA in the 70s. I think he was about 11 years old and he dismantled me so quick I couldn't believe it. He was a child prodigy but I think he lost steam or interest in young adulthood. I don't know but he dropped below my radar which was refocusing on other things by that time.

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 30 Nov 07 - 07:52 PM

Actually, when I "revived my game" for my visit to the chess club, I discovered that I had benefited greatly from not playing at all for several years, seemingly having forgotten a vast number of stupid things that I did in my earlier playing.

I have been working very hard at applying this theory during about the past 20 or 30 years, in the hope that after another decade or so of abstention at my next game I should be unbeatable!

( ... ... should I happen to live so long ... )

John

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Art Thieme
Date: 01 Dec 07 - 01:08 AM

John, I wish I'd met you in Winfield!

Art

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 01 Dec 07 - 03:42 AM

Art -

I did get the chance to watch and listen to you a couple of times at Winfield, but do regret that I never got (or made) a chance to shake hands and trade lies.

Of course, I'm probably a lot better at the tradin' lies than I was when I saw you last, since I've cultivated my curmudgeonlies for a few years, and sobered up (occasionally) some since then. I haven't noticed that you've lost the touch though, while I've still been tryin' to learn how.

John

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 01 Dec 07 - 10:55 AM

I lost my taste for chess after living down the hall from Olaf for a year. Olaf was a really, really fine chess player, and he beat me about 150 games in a row. That did it for me. ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Art Thieme
Date: 01 Dec 07 - 11:57 AM

I lost the taste for chess after playing at the No Exit in Chicago for 37 years and putting up with the incessant clicking of speed-chess players popping their clocks through my quietest songs. (Alas, the myth of listening rooms!!)

I was never so happy as when the game GO surpassed chess in popularity at the venerable old coffeehouse.

Art Thieme

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Art Thieme
Date: 01 Dec 07 - 12:03 PM

John,
I did realize, after years of tellin' those lies, that liars, like us, are simply blessed with the ability to remember things that never happened!!

Art

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 01 Dec 07 - 03:35 PM

Art -

I sometimes think of my special(?) ability(?) - and the one that gains me such authority(?) when I speak - as remembering things I never knew.

It seems to get easier as I "mature," but sometimes it seems they're just "humoring the ol' fart."

But I thought all your stuff indicated status as an astute historian! I believe everything you say ... is ... was ... .... (?)

John

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 13 Dec 07 - 04:02 PM

A bit of new news on Kasparov - and a sort of novel political maneuver to block him from advancing his politics?

Kasparov won't run for Russian president

Ex-chess champ, Kremlin critic says authorities put up too many obstacles

The Associated Press
updated 3:07 a.m. CT, Thurs., Dec. 13, 2007

MOSCOW - Kremlin critic and former world chess champion Garry Kasparov will not run in Russia's presidential election after authorities repeatedly blocked supporters' efforts to hold a nominating conference, his spokeswoman said Thursday.

Under election law, Thursday is the last day that potential candidates for the March 2 vote have to hold such conferences.

A spokeswoman for the broad-based opposition coalition that Kasparov heads told The Associated Press that organizers have been unable to find an auditorium or hall in Moscow where activists could gather and vote to put forth Kasparov as a candidate.

Spokeswoman Marina Litvinovich accused the government of pressuring landlords to not rent to the coalition, Other Russia.

"Authorities put up as many obstacles as possible to stop us. That's it," she said.

Since leaving chess, Kasparov has become a vociferous critic of President Vladimir Putin's government, cobbling together a disparate coalition of nationalists, left-wing activists and liberals to try to generate broad opposition.

[There's a little bit more at the article, but the gist of it is that a "No Vacancy" sign prevents Kasparov from running.]

John

Subject: RE: BS: Kasperov and Fisher!!
From: Slag
Date: 14 Dec 07 - 05:52 AM

Here's an idea, chess inspired, for political debate! Use chess clocks! That way each candidate has a limited amount of time he can use to either put forth ideas or defend the same. When the clock runs out --- ! He' (She's) done!