BS: Re Racist remarks

Subject: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Peace
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 02:59 PM

I wish to make somthing clear to members of the Mudcat. I did not see the racist thread posted by one of the then-members. When I saw some remarks Jerry R and a few other 'catters made in response to the Ten Commandments thread--which I never did see, and when I was able to figure out what was really happening, I felt sick to my stomach. I do not, under any circumstance, support or harbour views of a racist nature. If anyone thinks that, I hope this will change that thinking. To be clear, I will argue aspects of politics, language, religion, etc. But racism is not something I would ever argue about. It's wrong, and that's that.

If any long-time catters want my resignation from posting I will ask Joe to remove me from the Members board, and I will promise not to post as GUEST.

My thread to tar heel was meant to offer some support to a man I thought was in need of a helping hand. I still offer him the hand of friendship. But I do not support racism regardless of its guise. That is one of the few things about which my mind is unchanging.

Sincerely,

Bruce Murdoch

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: dianavan
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 03:40 PM

Bruce: My thread to tar heel was meant to offer some support to a man I thought was in need of a helping hand. I still offer him the hand of friendship.

Be careful of trying to befriend someone who would wear hunting gear for target practice.

I, for one, do not want you to give up your membership. There are probably many people who have been offended by my posts but everyone is entitled to their opinions - unless it is hate mongering. But now that he is gone, who will I fight with? I'm not going to worry, though, he will probably just post as a guest. Or maybe Martin Gibson will fill his role.

d

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: CarolC
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 03:51 PM

I once told a friend I had been getting to know in PMs here in the Mudcat, that there are probably as many different ideas of what sort of person I am among people here in the Mudcat as there are people reading my posts. It's not possible to know about everything everyone has ever posted here.

I think you're a good man, brucie, and I think you should stick around.

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: GUEST,kridic
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 04:07 PM

brucie, brucie, brucie!

Your humor would be missed, even by me. Your contributions are fun and sometimes informative. You have never been out of line (well, at least not way out of line).

Don't be silly (just funny) and stay.

"Stay, just a little bit longer, Oh please, please, please, please, please say that you will stay" (song connection).

kridic (unjustifiably so)

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 04:15 PM

Don't leave, brucie!!! You are sorely needed for useful comments on vital threads like "Chongo Chimp", and so on.

Besides, who among us has not inadvertently offended someone at some time? It happens, even with the best of intentions. When it does, you simply explain yourself better, that's all. Perfection is not a requirement of membership!

I wasn't aware that tarheel had disappeared. When, how, and why?

- LH

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: wysiwyg
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 04:16 PM

It's still FEBRUARY! That means it's SILLY SEASON! That means people act like idiots! Don't get so worked up-- it will all settle down in short order. It's pre-spring-fever-fever.

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 04:18 PM

Yeah, that's probably it, Susan. :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Walking Eagle
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 04:25 PM

You've been good to me Bruce. I certainly do not think that you support any racism. I saw the thread in question and it was not pretty. I think I may have posted to it. I continued to ask folks to check ths' website as he really knows his music. I think he has gotten in the clutches of some very influential hate groups as he mentioned something about cutting an pasting email notes to the 'cat that he received. McGrath made mention of some good threads that th had posted in the past. He even provided links to them for people to check. I wonder if anyone did this.

It is possible for people to reject some ideas that people have and still recognise them for other better traits.God help us if we ever become so polarized that we don't speak to others with different views. That leads to wars.

Carol is right when she writes that we don't know who we are among here on the 'cat. Something that I find refreshing.

Stay Bruce. Tar heel, if you are reading this. I wish that you would share your musical knowledge with us. I have written that a few times before. If anyone even reads my posts.

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Catherine Jayne
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 04:53 PM

You have been very supportive to me Bruce through our communications in PM's and on threads. I want you to stick around, you are a good man with a lot of love, knowledge and experiences to offer.

Love
Khatt

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: katlaughing
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 05:05 PM

Brucie, yer having daft thoughts...my PMs still stand. Stick around and let the dust settle.:-) Used ta be Spaw was the one who kicked up all the kitty litter; now I see he has a little help and that's alright, too.:-)

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Amergin
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 05:19 PM

dont be daft...all i saw was that you posted a thread apologising to some one...and extending your hand in friendship....that doesnt say that youre a bigot...that just says youre a nice bloke.

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Backstage Manager(inactive)
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 05:21 PM

Brucie,

If a fool be ye
You're a fool like me.

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Peace
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 05:42 PM

I wasn't lookin' for sympathy; but, it sure was nice to get it. I always felt there was something honourable about falling on one's sword, but I never thought tripping onto it was dignified. Thank you. I felt so embarrassed about it all that I really didn't know what to do. Thank you for your many kind words. The people I've had the good fortune to meet on the 'cat have been a blessing to me, and I didn't want to have a 'shadow' hanging over me from yesterday (probably a good song in there), and I no longer feel I do. Y'all are responsible for that. I owe ya, and I won't forget it.

Bruce Murdoch

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Walking Eagle
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 05:49 PM

Oh No! He owes us one folks! Duck for cover! **BG**

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Rapparee
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 06:02 PM

Hide the wimmen and likker!

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Peace
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 06:06 PM

Rap, that is very unkind. OK, maybe the likker, but ya know? Man does not live by bread alone!

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Rapparee
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 06:27 PM

Damn straight! Meat 'n' taters 'n' beer!

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 06:34 PM

I didn't see the racist stuff either, just the silly stuff about lefties and such, which is water off a duck's back.   I don't believe in making judgements about things I haven't seen about people I've never met.

Racism is always vile. People who, coming out of a racist culture, say racist things, aren't always beyond redemption.

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: GUEST,Martin Gibson
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 06:37 PM

I do not live by meat 'n' taters 'n' beer. It's quite hazardous to your health, makes you fat, and smell like a gin mill.

I have also no intention of filling any racist roles as suggested stupidly by dianavan.

I will continue to make comments criticizing when somone trys to stuff politically correct crap down my throat. Or extremely left wing causes just for the sake of being radical.

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Amergin
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 06:40 PM

the four main food groups...the chips group...the meat group...the tater group...and the beer group...

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: GUEST,Martin Gibson
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 06:50 PM

Amergin, no sweat off my back if you are either in:

The fat group
The heart disease group
The type 2 diabetes group
The drunken slob group

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Bobert
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 06:51 PM

Hey, brucie, shame on you fir thinking that your offering of love to someone who is obviously suffering form the effects of hatred would warrent your sensorship. That's crazy... You have done what Jesus would have done in the situation. Good for you. My hat is off to you.

Ain't a danged thing wrong with caring for yer fellow-man, even when you don't agree with him. We need more "brucies" and less "tar_heels" (who are so steeped in prejudice that they can no longed look across the table at a man without malice because of who their parents were.)

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: catspaw49
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 07:03 PM

What the hell is the problem here anyway? Brucie, I really haven't been around a lot for awhile now but these other folks know you and seem to like you. Makes me kinda' suspicious since they're mainly numbnuts types like Hawk...........Anyway, whatever you are troubled about (and I went back and found the problem--Chuckles has always been a problem--), stop it.   Okay?

Now me, I like a lot of racist remarks and very few are made around here. So I hang out at another place where all we do is make racist remarks!!! Racism is the order of the day and if you ain't a racist, don't stop by!!! We even fight about what kind of racism is better. It's all great to me though. Just this afternoon I watched The Wisconsin Kid rip them up at Rockingham.......Racism at it's best........it was great!!!

Stay if you want and forgive me if my racism offends you. If you can't forgive me, well then just fuck ya' for a row of soldiers!!! Also, stay away from that Chongo Chimp shit......it smells bad and is slippery as all hell.


Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 07:07 PM

Where is the link for the site Spaw?

Not that I or anyone else here would go there! We just want to make sure we don't "accidentally" go there.

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: CarolC
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 07:11 PM

Amergin, you forgot the ketchup group.

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 07:14 PM

Bruce and I have exchanged several PMs about this. I never for a MOMENT thought that brucie is racist. He's just a loving man who wanted to offer friendship to someone who is need of a lot of help. I have the highest regard for Cousin Brucie as a man, and as a friend.

Tar Heel needs a lot more help than we can give him in here, and because he gets "off" and making people angry, I don't think he's at a point where a hand of friendship is going to make the difference.
I can deal with conservative ideas... me and jimmyt are the best of friends, and just about anything else, but racial slurs like the ones in the Ten Commandments thread should not pass unchallenged. In my questionably humble opinion

But brucie... U Da Man. U leave and we coming after u.

Brer Jerry

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Rapparee
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 07:19 PM

Shucks, I thought the major food groups were salt, sugar, grease and alcohol.

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: catspaw49
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 07:20 PM

Sure Guest........Lots of Racist Discussions at This Sight!

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Peace
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 07:25 PM

Jaysus: Spaw, dianavan's lookin' for you to be Secretary of Gas when she becomes President. Check it out.

Thanks, all. Honey, I'm home.

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 07:39 PM

Way to go Spaw!

Uh, I accidentally clicked on your racist site link and boy there is some racy stuff there!

brucie, PLEASE don't go there, it'ill ruin you...

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Peace
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 07:53 PM

Couldn't resist. Only Spaw, ya know?

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 07:59 PM

Yep, only Spaw.

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Mary in Kentucky
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 09:18 PM

Spaw, now you've done it! Mudcatters are pretending they know what Rockingham is!

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: catspaw49
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 11:43 PM

Think I should try them out on "The Rushville Rocket" or "The Intimidator"?????

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 22 Feb 04 - 11:57 PM

rasists is bad, dont be rasist.john

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: dianavan
Date: 23 Feb 04 - 12:21 AM

I'm so sorry, Martin Gibson. I mistook you for a racist. I guess you're just a misogynist pig or something like that. Oh, oops - name calling is really politically incorrect! Maybe you're just a stone cold capitalist who doesn't have a drop of compassion for the working class poor. I don't know what to call you. How about Marty the Smarty?

d

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: paddymac
Date: 23 Feb 04 - 12:25 AM

"Racism" means different things to different people. In the states it is most commonly used to refer to biases and/or prejudices based on naive presumptions about genetics. Europeans seem to more commonly use it in the sense that Americans would use some derivative of "ethnic." The "problem" is wide spread around the globe. No one group or area has a corner on the market. I've always thought it was petty and stupid. Saints and sinners both come in all kinds of people. My life would be a lot duller and boring if I only ever knew or loved people "like me."

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: open mike
Date: 23 Feb 04 - 12:40 AM

spaw's link looks like a drug site to me..don't go there!

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 Feb 04 - 09:20 AM

We missed out the unidentified black crunchy bits group that I always get when I cook breakfast!

Most 'ists' are bad. Racists, Sexists, Trombonists...

Cheers

:D

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 23 Feb 04 - 09:55 AM

Lyricists are o.k., in my book.

Jerry

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 Feb 04 - 10:05 AM

But do Lyrics think they are OK? What have you got against people from Lyr anyway?

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Peace
Date: 23 Feb 04 - 01:55 PM

Yeah, and what about King Lyr?

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Folkiedave
Date: 23 Feb 04 - 02:15 PM

I was one of those who asked for the post to be removed. Second or third I think.

If Bruce supported someone out of friendship then god luck to him.

Dave

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Feb 04 - 02:21 PM

I think the point he made was, had he seen the post he wouldn't have offered support. But as we know it was deleted before he had a chance to see it. So no harm done.

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 23 Feb 04 - 02:50 PM

Not having seen the offending post I'm willing enough to accept that it deserved to be scrubbed. I gather it was some kind of racist parody of the Ten Commandments.

Here's a non racist parody from 1877 . The Workingman's Ten Commandments:

First Commandment.—I am thy lord and master, who has brought thee off and out of British bondage into a land where there are free institutions and equal rights given to all—black, red and white men.

Second Commandment.—Thou shalt have no other master besides myself, and do as I bid you do; for I am rich, and give you as much wages as I please.

Third Commandment.—Thou shalt not bow down to any other master, and not belong to trades' unions, or lecture on the principles of the working party, or do anything contrary to my wish or command, for, if you do, I will call on the military.

Fourth Commandment.—Thou shalt not serve any other master, or work for any more pay than I give: for I am jealous master. I will have you discharged on the least provocation, and half starve your wife and children, and have you punished as a communist, and not treat you as an American citizen, but as a tramp and a vagabond.

Fifth Commandment.—Thou shalt not call me any other name but sir and master: for I am a rich man and have piles of money, and therefore you are my slave, for I own your body and soul. Six days you must labor and do all I bid, or I will give you another reduction. If you murmur or growl I will make you work also part of the night: for I am all-powerful, and I can use the law to suit myself.

Sixth Commandment.—Thou shalt honor my money-bags, and also my high social standing in society. Then thy days shall be long on earth and in my employment, which I give thee with my usual blessing of long hours and small pay. So says thy master.

Seventh Commandment.—Thou shall not incite riots with intent to kill. If you do, I will have you arrested and make you give bonds for three thousand dollars and promise of good behavior in the future.

Eighth Commandment.—Thou shalt not strike for any higher wages, so as to be able to make an honest living, and keep your children from begging, and make you eat bread and water three times a day—that's good enough for a greasy and ignorant mechanic, or a dirty, black miner.

Ninth Commandment.—Thou shalt not steal or commit any other nuisance, for I will find you guilty and have you punished; for I am mighty and my name is Capital, Capital.

Tenth Commandment.—Thou shalt not covet my money, or own a house or lot, for if you do I will have it sold by the sheriff and own it myself and shall say "hands off;" and I will say to the Government, you must protect me in all my undertakings, for I am mighty, and my name is Capital—0! Capital.

Source: Brotherhood of Locomotive Firemen's Monthly Magazine II (December 1877): 15–16.

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Kim C
Date: 23 Feb 04 - 02:56 PM

Ha! I do know what Rockingham is! I was being racist yesterday myself. I was really pulling for Jamie McMurray - he finished pretty well at third. Maybe next time!

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: GUEST,Martin Gibson
Date: 23 Feb 04 - 06:12 PM

dianavan

I do have compassion for the working poor. I actually tip them pretty good if they speak decent English and get my order right.

What else do you want me to do? Lick their asses like you do?

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 23 Feb 04 - 06:20 PM

Would there be polaroids?

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: dianavan
Date: 23 Feb 04 - 08:28 PM

Martin Gibson - I don't lick anybody's ass but if someone will get me a big stick, I'll give you a lickin' of another kind!

...and I sure don't kiss yours!

d

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: GUEST,Martin Gibson
Date: 23 Feb 04 - 09:02 PM

Oh come now, dianavan.

Please don't get violent or threatening!

Get lilly high and calm down.

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: CarolC
Date: 23 Feb 04 - 09:44 PM

I vote for the polariods.

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: Hrothgar
Date: 24 Feb 04 - 04:52 AM

That Fourth Commandment, McGrath - would the word "communist" be as great a condemnation in the 1870s as it became later?

Possibly an anachronism?

Subject: RE: BS: Re Racist remarks
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 24 Feb 04 - 02:23 PM

Insofar as you can trust anything on the Internet the Workingmen's Ten Commendments seems genuine enough. The term "communist" was current then of course, and was often flung around hysterically, and often not particularly accurately.