Lyr Req: Venture, Gwen - singer Joe Hanson

Subject: Lyr Req: Venture, Gwen - singer Joe Hanson
From: Don Firth
Date: 22 Apr 06 - 06:05 PM

Sometime around 1952, I was digging through the record bins in Campus Music and Gallery for folk albums and ran across a 10" LP by a fellow named Joe Hanson (or Hansen, I don't recall which now). Joe H. had a sort of reedy sounding light baritone, and the drawing on the cover—no photograph—depicted him accompanying himself on the autoharp—not cradled in his left arm, Stoneman or Carter family style, but laying flat on his lap. He did pick out melodies a bit, but mostly he just strummed chords.

I was there on a buying spree, looking for records I could learn songs from (this was during those wonderful days of yesteryear when you could take a stack of records into a listening booth and audition them before buying). I had already picked out several and wanted this record too, but since I had already busted the budget badly, I figured I'd come back for it. But when I came back, someone had beaten me to it.

Some of the songs on the record (maybe eight or ten altogether) I've since learned were from Cecil Sharp's One Hundred English Folksongs:   songs such as "The Drownèd Lover" and "The Sheep-Shearing," He also did a sort of fast, almost jig-time version of "Greensleeves" (more verses than you really wanted to hear), "The Bold Princess Royal," and a couple Welsh songs. One of them was "All Through the Night."

The other was "Venture, Gwen." And that's what prompts this inquiry.

The melody is stuck solidly in my head. I can sing the melody right on, no problem. But I can't remember more than a very few of the words that Joe H. sang. I've searched the Cat and I've googled like mad, but all I have been able to come up with are references to the song, plus "Mentra Gwen," which appears to be essentially the same song. But the only lyrics I've found are in Welsh. No English words, at least English words that I can wrap my mouth around. I've googled for Joe Hanson (or Hansen) and come up with zippo, nada, nuttin'. No references to him or to the record, which I think was on Obscurity Label rather than Elektra or Riverside or any of the usual suspects. Definitely not Folkways.

The general thrust of the song is that someone is courting a girl named Gwen. Many lines end with "dearest Gwen, fairest Gwen." There is a line that says "my men-at-arms surround thee," and it refers to his castle, which he seems to be offering her if she will take him as her lover or husband. And it ends with a sort of triumphant, "Thou hast ventured, ventured, Gwen!"

I will be most grateful to anyone who can give me some information about this song and/ or Joe Hanson (or Hansen).

And I will be eternally grateful to anyone who can supply me with the set of words that Joe H. sings.

"Thank you, thank you in advance!!" he said, his eyes glowing with eager hope and his lower lip a-tremble.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Venture, Gwen - singer Joe Hanson
From: Don Firth
Date: 22 Apr 06 - 06:07 PM

Actually, any set of singable lyrics in English will be most appreciated.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Venture, Gwen - singer Joe Hanson
From: Mick Pearce (MCP)
Date: 22 Apr 06 - 07:07 PM

Don - AP Graves Celtic Song Book has an English version under the title Venture Gwen. If you give me a few minutes I'll type it up for you.

Mick

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Venture, Gwen - singer Joe Hanson
From: Mick Pearce (MCP)
Date: 22 Apr 06 - 07:18 PM

OK. Here are the words that Graves wrote. I don't know if it's the set that your singer sang though. I'm just off to bed now, but I'll see about putting the tune up tomorrow it it's not already here (I haven't checked for Mentra Gwen threads yet).

Mick

---

VENTURE GWEN
(English words to Metra, Gwen by AP Graves)

O'er Cymru, like a star,
  Brightest Gwen, whitest Gwen!
Thy fame has flashed afar,
  Brightest Gwen!
The cresset on yon gateway
Was set to light they late way;
Fear not to enter straightway!
  Only, venture, venture, Gwen!

Far better here to bide,
  Fairest Gwen, dearest Gwen!
Than tempt the mountain side,
  Dearest Gwen!
Their torches wave us thither,
Then, arm in arm together,
From out the angry weather,
  Let us venture, venture, Gwen!

What means this marshalled line?
  Whitest Gwen, brightest Gwen!
These men-at-arms are mine,
  Brightest Gwen!
Thou Queen of Crogen Castle,
Yet I, its Lord, thy vassal!
Now welcome to the wassail,
  Welcome, welcome, welcome, Gwen!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Venture, Gwen - singer Joe Hanson
From: Mick Pearce (MCP)
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 11:43 AM

The tune has been posted (I thought I vaguely remembered a thread) along with a lot of information on versions of the song in this thread: Lyr Req: Mentra Gwen, neu Cwynfau y Wraig Weddw.

Mick

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Venture, Gwen - singer Joe Hanson
From: Don Firth
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 01:08 PM

Michael, thanks a million! I really appreciate that!

The A. P. Graves translation you posted is almost right on with the meanings of the translation that Joe H. sang, but Joe H.'s words had a more poetic flow. This, of course, is the big problem with translations. But this definitely jars my memory. It scans well with the melody I remember, and I may be able to play with the words a bit and see what I can come up with. As a matter of fact, my wife is a poet, and she may be able to lend her talents to this.

In my search, I checked Mudcat first and found the thread you linked to and scanned through it, but I'll go back to it and give it a more thorough read.

It surprises me that Joe H. seems to have completely disappeared. I've tried googling various permutations of his name combined with the names of songs on his record, but I come up with nothing, not even on the Folk Index. Probably a one-shot on a very small label. Too bad. He was a pretty interesting singer and he did the songs well.

Anyway, I appreciate your efforts. Again, many thanks!

Don Firth

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Venture, Gwen - singer Joe Hanson
From: sian, west wales
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 02:19 PM

Can't remember if I mentioned it in the other thread but ... Mentra Gwen is also used to refer to that particular metre (meter?). So, I imagine you've got the right song - words and music - as they're generally the most popular in our lifetimes. (As on Contemplator ) But you'll note that they're the same meter (metre?) as Captain Kidd, Admiral Benbow, etc.

The Contemplator website also opens with another of the Mentra Gwen tunes (Dyffryn Clwyd) as an example.

Have fun.

sian

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Venture, Gwen - singer Joe Hanson
From: Don Firth
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 03:36 PM

Ye gods, I must be slipping!

In all the searching I did, I didn't think to check Contemplator, where I've been able to find so much good stuff. Thanks, Sian!

Between the two sets of words, I should be able to come up with something that I hope will do justice to the original in Welsh. Or, at least, get as close as I can to the romantic/poetic effect that my first hearing of the song seemed to convey.

Getting a good singable translation can be a bear, but Joe H. seemed to have one. I really should have consigned myself to peanut butter sandwiches that week and bought the record!

Many thanks!

Don Firth