BS: Worst prizefighter EVER?

Subject: RE: BS: Worst prizefighter EVER?
From: Rabbi-Sol
Date: 25 Feb 07 - 10:45 PM

Another mismatch was Floyd Paterson vs. Roy Harris from Cut-n-Shoot, Texas. He lasted about 6 or 7 rounds. He was a very brave fighter but just did not have the skills to go up against Floyd. That was the first closed curcuit telecast that I ever attended.

                                             SOL

Subject: RE: BS: Worst prizefighter EVER?
From: Deckman
Date: 25 Feb 07 - 11:48 PM

When Floyd was in training for the 1957 fight with cousin Pete, I used to go out to his training camp in Issaquah, Washington. I'd already met Floyd socially, so he made my Father and I welcome into his "compound." To this day, I've NEVER seen hands faster than Floyd Patterson's. Just about the time that I'd see a left hook comming, he'd already pounded three rights into his sparring partner. This man was greased lightening. Bob

Subject: RE: BS: Worst prizefighter EVER?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 26 Feb 07 - 12:05 AM

I never dreamed this thread would inspire so many interesting posts about the history of boxing. Thanks for your contributions, Deckman.

Subject: RE: BS: Worst prizefighter EVER?
From: GUEST,emjay
Date: 26 Feb 07 - 12:22 AM

Thanks to Bob "Deckman" Nelson who made sure he read this, Vince, my husband has a lot of comments and he started talking about the questionable circumstances surrounding Sonny Liston's death. He was supposedly afraid of needles, was found dead with a needle in him, and Vince thinks Liston took a dive in his first fight with Ali. The so-called "Phanton Punch." And Vince thinks Louis would have knocked Ali out in their primes.
He does think the bad ones are well covered. And he would be interested in comments.
Martie (emjay)

Subject: RE: BS: Worst prizefighter EVER?
From: Peter Kasin
Date: 26 Feb 07 - 04:03 AM

Bonavena was a tough fighter, who, as mentioned, went the distance with Joe Frazier, and who also beat Karl Mildenberger, a top contender in the mid-sixties. I've not heard before that Ali's knockout of Bonavena was a fix. What evidence is there?

The "phantom punch" was in the second Ali-Liston match. Is it that second one that Vince means?

Subject: RE: BS: Worst prizefighter EVER?
From: emjay
Date: 26 Feb 07 - 01:56 PM

Vince says the phantom punch was in the first fight, that Ali was talking to Liston after Liston went down. Ali didn't have a knock out punch, most of his fights were stopped when his opponent couldn't protect himself from Ali's barrage of punches or because the opponents were cut up by Ali's punches. He thinks some fights were stopped too soon, but Ali was great boxer just not the greatest.

Subject: RE: BS: Worst prizefighter EVER?
From: Rabbi-Sol
Date: 26 Feb 07 - 02:23 PM

If I remember correctly, in the first Ali-Liston fight, Liston just quit on his stool after the 6th round. There were no knockdowns in that fight. It was the second fight in which Liston went down for the count from a supposedly phantom punch.

                                                   SOL

Subject: RE: BS: Worst prizefighter EVER?
From: Peter Kasin
Date: 26 Feb 07 - 07:04 PM

Vince is confusing the first one with the 2nd. The so-called "phantom punch" was in the 2nd fight. Rabbi-Sol has it right.
Ali was not a lights-out puncher in the mold of Foreman, liston, etc, but he could punch pretty well. Take a look at the films of his knockout of Cleveland Wiliams, for one, and his knockout of Zora Folley for another, just to name two.

Subject: RE: BS: Worst prizefighter EVER?
From: Rabbi-Sol
Date: 26 Feb 07 - 07:24 PM

The worst fighter sportsmanship-wise was the Polish fighter Andrew Golota. I belive he was disqualified more than once. His last fight against Riddick Bowe in Madison Square Garden touched off a riot.

                                                 SOL

Subject: RE: BS: Worst prizefighter EVER?
From: emjay
Date: 27 Feb 07 - 01:32 AM

Thanks! Now I have to tell Vince he was wrong? I think that's the second time since I met him -- fifty years ago! And you have it right. Just on the off chance that someone else made a mistake, I checked.
The things you can learn on Mudcat!
And I was just reading the thread about Adam Arkin. Great stuff!
Martie

Subject: RE: BS: Worst prizefighter EVER?
From: Peter Kasin
Date: 27 Feb 07 - 02:57 AM

Martie, that's ok. I fully expect to be wrong about something at some point in my life, too (big grin).

Golota is known as the "Foul Pole." It was his first fight with Bowe that ended in a riot, but in the rematch, he did the same thing. He was ahead on points, then inexplicably belted Bowe below the belt and was again disqualified!