BS: Am I the only one stunned by oil prices?

Subject: RE: BS: Am I the only one stunned by oil prices?
From: Donuel
Date: 16 May 08 - 02:24 PM

Little teeny niggling ways to conserve.




take stairs, not elevator.

use normal doors and not electric.

seek the local authority/corporations to turn off sodium and mercury lights that serve no purpose.

direct central air conditioning only to needed areas.




there have to be thousands of little things that add up

Subject: RE: BS: Am I the only one stunned by oil prices?
From: GUEST,Guest is Q
Date: 16 May 08 - 03:19 PM

Many myths about mpg, automatic vs. manual, size of power plant, etc.
Government test figures at
Fuel Economy

Here in western Canada, weekend drives of 100-300 miles or more are not uncommon, to visit parents, kids, the farm, the vacation property, the ski resort, etc., often hauling several people, their gear and supplies. Very small cars are usually a second car, used in town only.
Note- almost no difference between automatic and manual, automatic now often offers slightly better mileage. A couple of pick-ups and SUVs are listed; very popular and useful here. U. S. data are in miles per gallon, you will have to do the conversion to liters.

A sampling:
Toyota Prius -    city 48 mpg, hwy 45mpg
Toyota Corolla - city 26, hwy 35
Toyota Camry 2.4l - city 21, hwy 31
Toyota Tundra 4.7l -   city 13, hwy 16 -4WD pick-up
Toyota 4-runner, 3.5l - city 19, hwy 28 -4WD SUV

Chevrolet Arco 1.6l - city 24, hwy 34; manual, auto 23-32
Chev Malibu 4cl auto - city 22, hwy 32
Chev Silverado 5.3l - City 14, hwy 19 -4WD pick-up

Ford Fusion 2.3l - City 20, hwy 29 (auto or manual)
Ford Focus 2l - City 24, hwy 35 (manual), city 24, hwy 33 (auto)
Ford Taurus 3.5l - City 17, hwy 24 -AWD

Audi A3 2l - city 22, hwy 29

BMW 328 3l - city 19, hwy 28
MINI Cooper 1.6l - city 26, hwy 34

Honda Civic Hybrid 1.3l - City 40, hwy 45

Jeep Grand Cherokee 3.7l, 6cl - City 15, hwy 19 -4WD SUV

Smart car   -       City 33, hwy 41

Porsche Carrera 3.6l - City 18, hwy 26   

The so-called Smart car seems to be a bad choice; both Honda and Toyota have models that do better, and are safer- the Smart car should not be allowed on the highway. There ae a couple of sports car enthusiasts in the neighborhood who have Carreras as second cars.

Subject: RE: BS: Am I the only one stunned by oil prices?
From: Ebbie
Date: 16 May 08 - 09:21 PM

M'sieu Ted, a friend of mine in Juneau has a VW Jetta diesel that gets 52 mpg.

Subject: RE: BS: Am I the only one stunned by oil prices?
From: pdq
Date: 16 May 08 - 09:37 PM

"Toyota Tundra 4.7l -   city 13, hwy 16 -4WD pick-up"

Well, my 1987 GMC Suburban gets 13.8 day in and day out. I bought it four years ago and it has never failed to run just fine. It is the dreaded blood enemy of the Environmentalists, yes a 3/4 ton 4X4 that holds a 4x8 foot sheet of plywood in the back storage are. Note: same mileage as this new Toyota with a 4.71 liter engine, the GMC 350 is also called a 5.7 liter.

Subject: RE: BS: Am I the only one stunned by oil prices?
From: Ebbie
Date: 16 May 08 - 09:55 PM

Good lord. I wouldn't be bragging about 13 mpg. My 65 Mustang got 17- and that was bad.

Subject: RE: BS: Am I the only one stunned by oil prices?
From: pdq
Date: 16 May 08 - 10:07 PM

That was 13.8, Ebbie, and I doubt that a '65 Mustang is capable of off-roading or carrying a stack of sheetrock in the back area. My 'burb is also piad for and worth about 10% as much as the Toyota Tundra "Q" mentioned. (smile)

Subject: RE: BS: Am I the only one stunned by oil prices?
From: GUEST,Q as guest
Date: 16 May 08 - 10:53 PM

Yes, that Tundra is quite the vehicle. I looked it up because the guy across the street just bought one to replace his old Chevy pick-up.

2005 VW Jetta diesel, 1.9l - City 32, Hwy 41. No longer available in the U. S; I understand because of emission problems.
Your Juneau friend is adding a bit of imaginary mileage.

2008 VW Jetta 2l, 4cyl - City 22, hwy 29
2008 VW Jetta 2.5l, 5 cyl - City 21, hwy 29.

A fellow in the next block just bought a VW Touareg SUV with all the bells and whistles- 10 cyl, 5 liter diesel. Set him back about $60,000. City 15, hwy 20 mpg. Definitely not reminiscent of the Beetle.
The Touareg also comes in a 6 cyl, 3.6 liter gasoline model; City 14, Hwy 20.
I have a Jeep Grand Cherokee, 1995, 6 cyl 3.7l gas, which does better in the city, and is (was) much more reasonable in price. I bought it in 1996, ex-lease. It hauls the family, dogs, and lots of junk, and will probably do me for another 5 years.

Subject: RE: BS: Am I the only one stunned by oil prices?
From: Naemanson
Date: 17 May 08 - 12:57 AM

Guam

Gasoline - $4.36 a gallon
Diesel - $4.96 a gallon
Biodiesel - $3.60 a gallon
Used vegetable oil - Free for the collecting. Of course you need a filtration system and filters but then the road is yours... if you drive a diesel.

Subject: RE: BS: Am I the only one stunned by oil prices?
From: M.Ted
Date: 17 May 08 - 01:54 AM

If you folks think Americans could choose to buy more fuel efficient cars if they wanted to, check this: European variants of US cars average 60% better gas mileage.

The thing is, most Americans don't realize that this is true, unless they've rented their favorite American cars while overseas, and been dumbfounded to discover that they were faster, handled better, and got way better gas mileage.

Subject: RE: BS: Am I the only one stunned by oil prices?
From: catspaw49
Date: 17 May 08 - 02:13 AM

Gas in Saudi Arabia is 65 cents a gallon. I advocate a multi-pronged program. First, shitcan the shrub and his cronies, then nationalize the oil industry. Next let's invade Saudi Arabia and Kuwait ourselves! That will get the army out of Iraq and everybody wants that! Then we have a National holiday where Sheiks and Oil company execs are allotted to every city around the country and then are strung up by their balls. Everyone gets to take a whack at them like a live pinata until their scrotums snap.

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Am I the only one stunned by oil prices?
From: M.Ted
Date: 17 May 08 - 05:23 PM

Nice thought, Spaw, but I don't think we need to go to all that trouble--we've got an army and a navy over there already, why not just charge them all (Iraq, Iran, and the Saudis) a dollar a barrel to make sure that their oil gets to wherever it's supposed to, without any"trouble". Just to start, of course.

Subject: RE: BS: Am I the only one stunned by oil prices?
From: GUEST,Q as guest
Date: 17 May 08 - 06:26 PM

Many European cars have less in the way of emission-pollution add-ons than American-Canadian cars. In Germany I remember getting a rental model 'like mine at home,' and driving out of the lot. As I applied gas to enter the street, I spun the rear wheels- a bit of shock.
In Mexico, some years ago, our rental car had no choking capability. At our motels, we were woken up in the mornings by people starting up their cars and letting them run. Only a few models had choking built in. Moreover, the gasoline was lower in octane. Probably changed by now.

Oh, sure, Catspaw. The hundreds of thousands of oil company employees will love that. And all of the investors who have energy stocks, either on their own or in their pension funds or savings and loan portfolios or bank savings will be poorhouse bound.

Since Canada is now a major supplier of both oil and gas to the United States, I suppose you will take it over too. And Mexico. And Nigeria. And --

U. S. Imports March 2008

From Canada, 1,727 million bbls
From Saudi Arabia, 1,535 million bbls
From Mexico, 1,232 million bbls
From Nigeria, 1,138 million bbls
From Venezuela, 858 million bbls
From Iraq, 773 million bbls.

Energy information from the U. S. Government, Energy Information Administration.

Oh, yes, you would have to fight off the Chinese, Indians and other large and growing consumers.

Subject: RE: BS: Am I the only one stunned by oil prices?
From: GUEST,Q as guest
Date: 17 May 08 - 06:44 PM

The United States imports large quantities of refined products as well as crude. Compare with figures posted above.

Total imports, March, 2008

From Canada, 2,303,000 bbls/day
From Saudi Arabia, 1,542,000 bbls/day
From Mexico, 1,351,000 bbls/day

Why not refine at home? It is cheaper to refine abroad; the very large new refineries are all being constructed outside of the United States.
The figures in the first post also are in bbls/day

Subject: RE: BS: Am I the only one stunned by oil prices?
From: beardedbruce
Date: 17 May 08 - 08:10 PM

Back in the 1970s the decision was made in the US to sacrifice performance and fuel economy in order to reduce specific types of emissions.


I want to know why I can't find a William Roadster... ( ca 1962-64 steam, cold start to 60 MPH in 90 seconds, burns any liquid that will burn- butter, scotch, rubbing alcohol,,,)

Subject: RE: BS: Am I the only one stunned by oil prices?
From: TRUBRIT
Date: 17 May 08 - 08:29 PM

We've checked the prices -- we are converting to GAS!!! From the time we got the offer from our oil dealer to lock in prices at $3.99 to about five days later while we were still discussing it, the lock n price was $4.20!!!!!! We are insulating, tightening down, considering getting a wood stove back ( we got rid of two 20 years ago) and we are walking away from oil. My natural gas company tells me that the gas comes from the US or Canada - we are unlikely to be at war with either..........

Subject: RE: BS: Am I the only one stunned by oil prices?
From: GUEST,Q as guest
Date: 17 May 08 - 11:29 PM

Gas in a very clean fuel to use, you won't be disappointed with its quality. The price, however, no one can guarantee.
We have used it for some sixty years (Canada). For a short time we has fuel oil to heat an apartment in Illinois. The large tank was a nuisance and the odor (stink!) was sickening. But that was many years ago, fuel oils may be better now.

Subject: RE: BS: Am I the only one stunned by oil prices?
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 17 May 08 - 11:55 PM

TRUBRIT

Eat lots of beans!