BS: Yank/Yankee: what does it mean

Subject: BS: what does it mean
From: GUEST,the wonderer
Date: 04 Jul 07 - 09:44 AM

Happy Independance day, hope all of you that are celebrating this event have a pleasant one, But as a limey or Brit or what ever slang word Americans have for us, I interested in knowning how the term Yank or Yanky has come about, can anyone help out?

Subject: RE: BS: what does it mean
From: alanabit
Date: 04 Jul 07 - 09:50 AM

Originally it came from a name "Jan Kees", which for a Dutchman is bit like "John Smith" would be for a Brit. So it became adopted as a generic term for a Dutchman, of whom there were apparently plenty around at the time. From here on, you will be able to read hundreds more erudite, informed and detailed posts than this one!

Subject: RE: BS: what does it mean
From: mack/misophist
Date: 04 Jul 07 - 10:23 AM

You could look here. And bear in mind that before it was New York, it was Niew Amsterdam. Plenty of Dutchmen in Niew Amsterdam.

Subject: RE: BS: what does it mean
From: kendall
Date: 04 Jul 07 - 04:48 PM

In Europe, a Yankee is someone who lives in the western hemisphere.
In South America, a Yankee is someone who lives in North America.
In North America, a Yankee is someone who lives in New England,
In New England, a Yankee is someone who lives in Vermont,
And, in Vermont, a Yankee is someone who eats pie for breakfast.

Subject: RE: BS: what does it mean
From: Ebbie
Date: 04 Jul 07 - 11:59 PM

Kendall, I hadn't heard the last one! Meat pie? Fruit pie? Humble pie?

Subject: RE: BS: what does it mean
From: Peace
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 01:39 AM

"Dear Cecil:

What is the origin of the word "Yankee"? --Listener, WFBR, Baltimore

Cecil replies:

What's so complicated? You got your yankers, obviously you also got your yankees.   However, I can't claim the etymological authorities are exactly lining up to embrace this notion.

The origins of "Yankee" have been fiercely debated throughout the history of the Republic, and to this day the Oxford English Dictionary says the source of the word is "unascertained." Perhaps the most widely accepted explanation was advanced by H.L. Mencken, the well-known newsman-scholar (and don't tell me that isn't an unusual combination), who argued that Yankee derives from the expression Jan Kaas, literally "John Cheese." This supposedly was a derogatory nickname bestowed on the Dutch by the Germans and the Flemish in the 1600s. (Wisconsin cheeseheads can undoubtedly relate.)

The English later applied the term to Dutch pirates, and later still Dutch settlers in New York applied it to English settlers in Connecticut, who were known for their piratical trading practices. During the French and Indian War the British general James Wolfe took to referring derisively to the native New Englanders in his army as Yankees, and the term was widely popularized during the Revolutionary War by the song "Yankee Doodle." By the war's end, of course, the colonists had perversely adopted the term as their own. Southerners used Yankee pejoratively to describe Northerners during the Civil War, but found themselves, along with all other Americans, called thus by the English during world wars I and II.

The alternative explanations--Mencken lists 16 of them--are that Yankee derives from various Indian languages, or from Scottish, Swedish, Persian, etc. James Fenimore Cooper claimed that Yankee resulted from a fractured attempt by the Indians to pronounce the word "English." But most others think Cooper was about as good an etymologist as he was a novelist.

--CECIL ADAMS"

Subject: RE: BS: what does it mean
From: GUEST,The Wonderer
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 11:07 AM

Wow cheers, me dears for that, very interesting, So my next question, is there still a significant Dutch population in New York now?

Subject: RE: BS: what does it mean
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 11:09 AM

... and in Australia, Yanks come from the USA - individually generally liked, as a nation, not overly trusted anymore...

Subject: RE: BS: what does it mean
From: Bee
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 11:33 AM

"And, in Vermont, a Yankee is someone who eats pie for breakfast. " - kendall

Now that's interesting. I thought my Cape Breton farmer grandfather (origins: third gen. from Benbecula, Scotland) and his family were the only people who ate pie for breakfast (along with soaked toast, poached eggs, porridge and tea).

Subject: RE: BS: what does it mean
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 01:46 PM

Ever heard of Franklin Roosevelt? And all the old van Something or others? The Dutch stayed in New York and some contributed to the developing American aristocracy. Descendants, of course, all over the place now.
Later immigration brought many Germans ("Pennsylvania Dutch," etc.) who far outnumbered the Dutch.

Subject: RE: BS: what does it mean
From: MMario
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 02:01 PM

And, in Vermont, a Yankee is someone who eats pie for breakfast. " - kendall

That's right - normal folk have cold baked bean sandwiches.

Subject: RE: BS: what does it mean
From: Mrrzy
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 02:39 PM

Not quite, Kendall. In Vermont, a Yankee is someone who doesn't like cheddar cheese on their apple pie.
Apple pie without the cheese
Is like a kiss without the squeeze.

Subject: RE: BS: what does it mean
From: gnu
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 02:46 PM

"....doesn't like cheddar cheese on their apple pie."

Oh, NOW! That would be a DAMN YANKEE!

Who don't like that?

Subject: RE: BS: what does it mean
From: Bee
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 09:13 PM

The proper serving of cheddar cheese in a Cape Breton kitchen is as follows, in the afternoon:

Place great slab of cheese on pie plate.
Place in coal kitchen stove oven.
Watch through half open door until just melted.
Divide into servings, pour molasses over top.
Eat with bread and tea.

No need to ruin an apple pie, Yankee or not!

Subject: RE: BS: Yank/Yankee: what does it mean
From: Rapparee
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 09:26 PM

Loggers ate pie for breakfast. And lunch. And dinner. A whole pie each. And if they didn't get it they'd strike.

Subject: RE: BS: Yank/Yankee: what does it mean
From: Bee
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 09:31 PM

No wonder. Imagine the amount of calories required to perform the work they did without collapsing. Pies, made almost equally of lard and sugar, would keep a man going as little else would.

Though I hear remarkable quantities of beans were served in logging camps.

Subject: RE: BS: Yank/Yankee: what does it mean
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 09:38 PM

I wonder how you got wind of that Bee?

:-P

Subject: RE: BS: Yank/Yankee: what does it mean
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 09:52 PM

I hate the Yankees. Let's go Mets!

Subject: RE: BS: Yank/Yankee: what does it mean
From: Peace
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 11:14 PM

"along with soaked toast"

When I was a kid my grandmom would often use up bread that was going stale by cutting it into chunks and pouring warm milk over it, adding a bit of sugar and boom, that was breakfast. Is that what soaked toast is?

Subject: RE: BS: Yank/Yankee: what does it mean
From: Mrrzy
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 11:25 PM

gnu, here in the Old Dominion, a yankee is a northerner who comes down south - and a damn yankee is one who stays.

In the same vein, when I asked if my kids were Southerners or Yankees, given that their father was southern and their mom northern, and was told If your cat crawled in the oven and had kittens, you wouldn't call'm muffins, now, would you?

In other words, my kids are Yankees too, even though they were born and are growing up in Virginia.

Subject: RE: BS: Yank/Yankee: what does it mean
From: Bee
Date: 06 Jul 07 - 06:28 AM

Peace, my grandparents version of soaked toast was thick slices of toasted homemade bread, buttered, placed in a wide bowl, sprinkled with white sugar, and boiling water poured over top. Sometimes they put poached eggs on top of it.
I always thought it was kinda disgusting, but it was normal breakfast food for them.

Subject: RE: BS: Yank/Yankee: what does it mean
From: The Walrus
Date: 07 Jul 07 - 03:41 AM

"...my grandparents version of soaked toast was thick slices of toasted homemade bread, buttered, placed in a wide bowl, sprinkled with white sugar, and boiling water poured over top..."

That sounds like 'Skelly' (or 'Skilly'), the food of the very poor,
Stale bread, soaked with boiling water to make a thick 'porridge' and seasoned with whatever came to hand, sugar (as above) or salt and/or pepper - this is where OXO cubes came into their own.

To bring music into this - 'Skelly' is mentioned in the bugler's memo lyrics* for the 'Mens' Meals' call:

"The Officers' wives get Puddings and pies,
The Serjeants' wives get skelly..."

Walrus


* Traditionally, buglers have added lyrics to calls as an aide memoire.

Subject: RE: BS: Yank/Yankee: what does it mean
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 07 Jul 07 - 07:44 AM

THE cheese to eat with apple pie is WENSLEYDALE.

eric

Subject: RE: BS: Yank/Yankee: what does it mean
From: Alice
Date: 07 Jul 07 - 09:17 AM

Milk toast was my fave breakfast when I was a kid. (Warm milk poured over buttered toast.)
Reading the description of water poured over toast made me gag, but if you're hungry, I
guess anything will do.

Subject: RE: BS: Yank/Yankee: what does it mean
From: The Walrus
Date: 07 Jul 07 - 01:10 PM

"...THE cheese to eat with apple pie is WENSLEYDALE..."

Whereas the cheese for a pork pie is Stilton (blue or white)

W

Subject: RE: BS: Yank/Yankee: what does it mean
From: Peace
Date: 07 Jul 07 - 01:35 PM

As a kid I thought stale bread with warm milk and a bit of sugar--sometimes molasses, and when times were good, brown sugar--was haute cuisine. We did have it a few times with water instead of milk, but it would get some nutmeg or pieces of apple to pick up the slack for the milk being still in the cow.

Subject: RE: BS: Yank/Yankee: what does it mean
From: robomatic
Date: 07 Jul 07 - 01:45 PM

In Boston, a Yankee is someone from Beacon Hill (You're talkin' bout pie, I'm talkin' about the 'upper crust').

I've been thrilled to hear about Southerners coming to terms with the fact that they're 'Yanks' abroad. Causes me no end of mirth. One wartime Britisher told me they'd called the moving armor "Sherman Yanks".

Subject: RE: BS: Yank/Yankee: what does it mean
From: open mike
Date: 07 Jul 07 - 03:16 PM

my mother, near the end of her life liked milk toast..
most other food was too spicy or disagreed with her.
one of the other people who lived in her assisted living
home called it "grave yard stew" which apparently it was,
in a way, for mom.

I live near a place called Yankee Hill in California
and was near a place in Nebraska Yankee Hill Brick Company.

in South American and Central American and Mexican parlance
Yanqui is the way to spell Yankee. (as in "Yanqui go home")