 sj |
||
|
||
Chord Req: Figuring out chords...
|
|
|
Subject: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: GUEST,Jim Mack Date: 29 Feb 08 - 07:15 PM I was wondering if anyone here who had any (succesful) experience transcribing songs had any advice on how to figure chords you're not familiar with, in a song. Thanks Jim |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: Leadfingers Date: 29 Feb 08 - 08:49 PM Quite often , there are several chords that 'fit' , but some sound better than others . Its a bit like asking how long is a piece of string ! |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: Richard Bridge Date: 01 Mar 08 - 03:09 AM If all else fails, decide what the note is and then try every chord with that note in until one sounds right. It almost always works. |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: Sooz Date: 01 Mar 08 - 04:50 AM Almost! Theres always one....... |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: GUEST,Johnmc Date: 01 Mar 08 - 07:35 AM If you mean finding particular shapes for guitar, I find it vital to establish whether a capo is being used. In other words, the key may not imply shapes we use for that key when not capoing. e.g. you know that chord when you slide a C shape up two frets - very hard to get that without that shape against the open strings. So find key, ask if it is standard tuning, is it capoed, and then proceed as everyone suggests. |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 01 Mar 08 - 07:49 AM It's interesting that two ways of seeing the task involved here seem to be emerging. One (eg Johnmc) sees it as a matter of identifying what a particular person (eg on a recording) had been doing. The other (eg Richard) sees it as a matter of finding the chords he'd like to use in order to play the tune, regardless of what anyone else might have done when they were playing. |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: GUEST,kendall Date: 01 Mar 08 - 08:07 AM What Richard said works for me.Leadfingers also makes a good point. |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: GUEST,Chicken Charlie Date: 01 Mar 08 - 11:19 AM I've been in that situation frequently, having picked up guitar "knowledge" in fits & starts from a wide variety of people. I can, I believe, improve on Richard Bridge's suggestion somewhat, because I was once told by a roomie who had a PhD in music (he played keyboards) that the melody note is likely to be the MIDDLE note in a suitable triad. So if the melody note at that point is F#, try playing a D behind it. Yes, other chords exist with F# in the middle, but you will have cut the number of options way down. What I usually do now is experiment with the more common progressions in the key of the song, once I figure out what that key is or what key I want to play it in. There are a few "accidentals" which can be buggers to guess right, but most of your chords are going to be interrelated in a simple way. (I don't know how much "theory" you're into or how you think of it, but if I Roman-number the notes of the scale of the key I'm in, songs are going to start building around I, IV and V, aka the tonic, sub-dominant and dominant, aka C, F and G, or E, A and B (Louie, Louie), or whatever. Patterns can be I-IV-I-V, or I-IV-V-I, etc. A few do a mournful thing where they drop from I to VII. "Blue Diamond Mine," a real sad mountain thing, goes I-VII-I-V-I. That works for a few other songs too. In both those cases, actually, instead of playing V as a straight major, you play its seventh, so it's really I-IV-I-V7. You can also go from I to III, especially if a phrase almost repeats and you want to ramp up the second repetition. You could play the line "Five foot two, eyes of blue" all on I, but it sounds better as (I) Five foot two; (III) eyes of blue .... You've also got very common four-chord progressions like Tonic to relative minor to sub-dominant to dominant 7th, which in C is C, Am, F, G7. (Everly Bros.; Dream, etc., etc.) Or it varies to C, Em, F, G7 (I Started a Joke, etc., etc.) Finally, you've got "passing chords" to get from one principle chord to another. I-I-IV-IV might be changed to I-I7-IV-IVm or I-I7-IV-IVdim. I'm discovering that a lot of times if you have a change from I to V, you can make it I-II-V and it sounds closer to the melody and a whole lot more exciting. (Waitin' for a Train, e.g.) Ignoring the fact that as an inveterate (invertebrate?) "trad" person I have probably given you examples you have never heard of [:)], I hope that helps. All this to say: stay in the key and try the middle note idea, & come back and tell us what works. BTW, what's the song?? Best of luck, Chicken Charlie |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: Richard Bridge Date: 01 Mar 08 - 06:27 PM OK, Charlie - try "Henry Martin". I'll come back later with the chord run I actually use. It's a bitch! There is also one "chord" I play as part of a closing sequence to St James Infirmary (to which I have somehow picked up a corrupt tune and rhythm). It is no chord I have ever found in a book, and that one I found after about a day's work going over each string on the guitar until I found the note I wanted on that string. 335443. Key of Em. And, MacGrath, yes, I usually am looking for the way I want to play the song, not the way anyone else does. |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: Gene Date: 01 Mar 08 - 08:06 PM For Jim Mack...perhaps a source of lyrics and chords, like the one available below would be of help to you in learning the chord patterns of a substantial number of well known songs... A so-called FAKE book contains the major parts of a song and chords, but often not all the lyrics... The one below is MORE than a FAKE book, containing complete songs in many cases...AND IS FREE... Good Luck Pickin' & Grinnin'--- http://www.foundationwebsite.org/CountryMusicLyricsVol1WithChords.htm |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: Scorpio Date: 01 Mar 08 - 08:36 PM God, I wish understood this shit! |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: GUEST,Chicken Charlie Date: 01 Mar 08 - 08:41 PM Richard B.-- It wouldn't be a fair test of anything. I already know what the chords to [my take on] Henry Martin are. Or are you saying they're disconnected? Lemme go play thru it. .... I'm back. You didn't miss me!? Am Dm E7. Do you have a problem with something I said?? CC |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: Don Firth Date: 01 Mar 08 - 09:20 PM These are the chords I use: There [Am]were three brothers in [E]merry Scot-[Am]land;I let the downward chromatic scale in the melody (third line) move against the background of a simple Am harmony. Don Firth |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: Richard Bridge Date: 02 Mar 08 - 05:06 AM Played in Em with a 5 string capo at the second fret. In consequence some of the chords require a thumb over at the second fret to bring the bottom note up to F#. I'm putting an asterisk by them. But I'm going to render the chords by shape name as if they were in Dm There [Dm]were three brothers in [thumbyF]mer[C]ry [*A]Scot[Dm]land; In [barre F]merry Scot[barreGm]land there were [barre A]three. And [barreDm]they did [barreA]cast [barre F]lots [barreG]which [barreGm]of [Dm] them [*Am]should [thumbyF]go Should [barreGm]go, should [barreA]go [D9]For to turn [thumbyF]robber all [C]on the salt [Dm]sea |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: Richard Bridge Date: 02 Mar 08 - 02:51 PM Hmm, that stopped that thread! |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: Don Firth Date: 02 Mar 08 - 03:03 PM Interesting! Captain, I'm curious as to what your right hand is doing with that. I accompany Henry Martin with a fairly simple rhythmic pattern; a sort of 3/4 "Burl Ives basic" (bass-fingers-fingers) more or less alternating with an upward arpeggio, but being judicious about which bass notes I play so the bass notes form a sparse countermelody. Sometimes just three bass notes instead of "bass-fingers-fingers." The right hand picking or strumming pattern one uses can have a definite effect on how many chord changes one can use and where the changes come. Don Firth |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: Richard Bridge Date: 02 Mar 08 - 03:45 PM Er- I'm sort of hammering a pomp-rock right hand series of chords wth a plectrum |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: Nick Date: 02 Mar 08 - 08:42 PM >>It is no chord I have ever found in a book, and that one I found after about a day's work going over each string on the guitar until I found the note I wanted on that string. 335443. I'd recognise that chord from quite a lot of tunes usually sandwiched between 335543 and 335343 - an example would be Something by George Harrison under the vocal "I don't want to leave her now" - though not necessarily with the 5th as the root of the chord (more like x35543 - x35443 - x35343) |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: Nick Date: 02 Mar 08 - 08:45 PM Perhaps a smaller version but an even more famous one would be the second chord of the intro to Stairway to Heaven ie a minor chord with a major7 but inverted so that the maj7 is in the root? |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: pavane Date: 03 Mar 08 - 02:07 AM Have you looked at my program HARMONY, which puts chords to a tune. (Provided you can get the tune in abc format) Download from my site |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: M.Ted Date: 03 Mar 08 - 12:05 PM Gene, Thanks for the links to the songbook--the website that it is a part of is very interesting, too--I am not posting a link though, because it is the sort of thing that one should have dig a little bit to find-- |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: Gene Date: 04 Mar 08 - 10:01 AM FWIW DEPT: I find the UPPER CASE style very hard on my fading eyesight and have converted the text of the entire document to English Style Lower Case format. Anyone interested in a TEXT copy, PM me, or Email me at: CN8GV9@AIM.COM |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: bubblyrat Date: 04 Mar 08 - 10:32 AM Beats me, I'm afraid !! I just stick it in double-dropped-D tuning,and experiment with 2 & 3 finger chords until I find something I like the sound of ! Dunno what they"re called, though. I can pick out the notes for most English,Scottish and Irish dance tunes in that tuning, and use a capo a lot to find other keys ( 2nd fret, G shapes for A, D shapes for E, 5th fret D shapes for G and so on)----I do "Lowlands" on the 7th fret !!! ( with another,conventionally-tuned guitarist, of course !! ).Sounds good, too ! Mr D ( as Derek Tarrant calls me !). |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: open mike Date: 04 Mar 08 - 11:53 AM see also the "capo" thread above...well it is "above" at this moment... |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: GUEST,strad Date: 04 Mar 08 - 05:05 PM Like most folk, I have trouble finding the chords that sound right. As a starting point I use the following: If the song is e.g. in D D use D major E use Em F# use F#m G use G major A use A major B use Bm C use Cm From that point I go wandering to see what else sounds right. |
|
Subject: RE: Chord Req: Figuring out chords... From: Richard Bridge Date: 04 Mar 08 - 05:25 PM Quite a lot of folk songs use the relative major so that C would be C major. Ramble Away is an example. |
| Share Thread: |