BS: DC Gun Ban Banned

Subject: RE: BS: DC Gun Ban Banned
From: pdq
Date: 21 Jul 08 - 11:57 AM

"Some of us are as opposed to liberal gun laws as YOU are."

Not to impolite, but that statement seems to be obtuse by design.

The right of a private citizen to own and carry a firearm is in the US Constitution. Laws are made by legislative bodies and are subject to change at will. Constitutional mandates are permanent unless that document is amended.

Subject: RE: BS: DC Gun Ban Banned
From: Big Mick
Date: 21 Jul 08 - 12:27 PM

Unfortunately, friend Spleen Cringe, you are the victim of false impressions, just as many of us Irish are with regard to "Enlish" or "Brits". The fact that Americans have the right to keep and bear arms does not mean that they all do. In fact, most of the people you meet do not even own a gun. The danger of being the victim of violent crime is no actually less these days in the United States than it is in Canada, Great Britain, or Australia. This is also born out internally in the States. There is an inverse relationship between crime rates and gun control laws here in the States. In States with more liber "conceal/Carry" laws, the violent crime rate is much lower than in States where they have the most restrictive laws. The more time you spend in this country, the more you will find that our people are not wild eyed maniacs with weapons, but generally a friendly, welcoming people just as they are in your country. Those that own weapons legally, for the most part, are law abiding folks that keep their guns safe and do not walk around toting them or ever even using them for the purpose that you are worried about. We surely have criminals and ignorant types that want to brandish them. But you have those too.

I understand, on an intellectual level, why you would not understand our obsession with guns. I would only say to you that this right goes back to our earliest days, that it was born of the idea that a populace should never be seen as unarmed and helpless against criminals or governments, that it has developed into a part of who many of us are, that most of us simply look on this as a part of our heritage and never use these for the things you fear, and that I doubt that it will change.

And to answer the question you posed, yes, I have weapons. I only rarely "carry" and then only when I feel the need. Handguns are not my most preferred weapon of protection except in very specific circumstances which happen very rarely, and now that I have retired probably won't happen again. But I will keep them well maintained, in good order, secured against accidental usage or theft, and I go and shoot to stay competent and for relaxation.

All the best,

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: DC Gun Ban Banned
From: Bill D
Date: 21 Jul 08 - 05:51 PM

"...that statement seems to be obtuse by design."

?? Obtuse, pdq? The man suggested that most Americans like and keep firearms....*I* said that many of us do not. Seems clear & simple to me.

THEN you state the obvious...as if it told us something. In fact, several of the Supreme Court justices have grave doubts about the true intention of the founders when writing the 2nd amendment. Many other quite well-intentioned and intelligent Americans also doubt 1)that the founders meant it the way you indicate, and 2) that if they did, it needs to be re-thought & revised.

We all KNOW that it takes a complex process to either overturn a decision about a challenge to an interpretation of the Constitution, or to revise and clarify the document itself. You seem to assume that stating how a majority of the court thinks right now...(NOT a majority of citizens)... settles the discussion.

I am quite aware that split decisions on the court are still favoring the gun lobby...I do reserve my right to question their wisdom.

Subject: RE: BS: DC Gun Ban Banned
From: pdq
Date: 21 Jul 08 - 05:58 PM

By using the phrase "liberal gun laws" you imply that you and your friends have the right to control gun ownership by statute.

Nice try, but some of us will not let that go by unchallenged.

Subject: RE: BS: DC Gun Ban Banned
From: Bill D
Date: 21 Jul 08 - 06:31 PM

oh, LORD! "liberal" means, in this case, 'generous' and 'open'...not 'those favored by *gasp* LIBERALS'! The gun laws in the USA are, currently 'liberal'...which means, interestingly, approved by many 'conservatives'. It means, to me, that WAY too many people can own guns.

...and do not forget - many aspects of gun ownership ARE controlled by statute! Even in DC, there are many, many restrictions on who may own a gun, how it can be registered, where it must be kept, how it can be acquired...etc. All I want is a court ruling that tightens the statutes as much as possible.

Subject: RE: BS: DC Gun Ban Banned
From: pdq
Date: 21 Jul 08 - 06:39 PM

The US Constitution has always been interpreted as allowing for "reasonable restrictions" on this issue and many others.

Local and state legislators can never ban guns without being in violation of the US Constitution.

Such laws may stand for a long time because people are unwilling to mount a challenge, but they are still unconstitutional. That is the heart of this Supreme Court decision.