BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 13 Sep 08 - 10:00 PM

From the Atlantic Monthly:

McCain: Liar Who Won't Correct

13 Sep 2008 03:48 pm

If McCain were a blogger, he would have had to retract by now. But he's running for president of the United States, so he can say anything, lie about anything and not have to answer for it. Yesterday, John McCain lied on national television about something that no one disputes in the public record. He was challenged by the only serious journalists on television right now - the hosts of "The View" - about the large number of pork barrel earmarks Sarah Palin sought and secured as governor of Alaska, including the "Bridge To Nowhere" that Palin and McCain lied about and are still lying about in public. Here was his clear and irrefutable statement:

    Palin's comments came after McCain sat for a feisty grilling on ABC's "The View," where he claimed erroneously that his running mate hadn't sought money for such pet projects. "Not as governor she didn't," McCain said, ignoring the record.

It has now been a day since McCain lied this explicitly in public. And he hasn't yet retracted his lie. This AP piece is dated as of this afternoon. Why not?

Because if he has to retract this lie, he will have to retract his multiple other lies? While the media demands that Obama respond to things he never said and never meant, McCain is not even asked to retract a bald-faced, massive, obvious, refutable lie.

In the last month, McCain has become the biggest liar in the modern history of presidential politics. He makes Bill Clinton look like George Washington.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 13 Sep 08 - 10:44 PM

What was George Washington lying about?

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Ebbie
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 12:13 AM

"I didn't chop down the cherry tree. Honest." *g*

I would love to see Sarah Palin visit The View.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 12:20 AM

Obama has come out swinging on behalf of straight talk and an end to red herrings, PR deceptions, and show-biz politics. The weakest link in this campaign is Sarah Palin's grasp and position on the core issues.

All her tapdancing will not cover that up.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 12:20 AM

Oh, that old myth!

Ebbie, they would eat her alive! :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Ebbie
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 10:41 AM

Ah, but she might learn a little humility. :)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 10:47 AM

"I would love to see Sarah Palin visit The View."


                If she's smart, she'll avoid those old hags.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 02:41 PM

Friedman lays it on the line in Making America Stupid, an examination of the Republican impact on American intelligence.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Alice
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 02:56 PM

Interesting news headline, a quote from Karl Rove!

Rove: Some McCain ads don't pass '100 percent truth' test
"McCain has gone in some of his ads — similarly gone one step too far," he told Fox News, "and sort of attributing to Obama things that are, you know, beyond the '100 percent truth' test."

click

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: akenaton
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 04:29 PM

I've posted this on another thread, you ladies might be interested :0)

Camille Paglia on Mrs Palin

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Donuel
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 05:37 PM

Read THE WRECKING CREW


It shows why the conservatives always run up an impossible deficit they say they are against, but by doing so it cripples every liberal cause.


Start pre emptive wars, ship crates of 100 billion in cash into a war zone, just five it away to Haliburton and anyone who will take it in Iraq, buy 200 dollare per gallon gas for the Army////
It all goes to tie the hands of a Democrratic administration like it did to Clinton. Buy down the deficit a bit and then let the Republicans do it again.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Alice
Date: 14 Sep 08 - 05:38 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lyaMrS0hzk

Above link to an incident where a woman standing on public property holding a piece of cardboard with "McCain = Bush" written on it is told she will be arrested for trespassing. She says at the end of the video of the incident, Why would a Republican be offended by a sign that says McCain = Bush?


John McCain Kicks Librarian Out of Town Hall Event
"On orders from Senator John McCain's security detail, Denver police escorted a 61-year-old woman away who was waiting in line to attend a so-called town hall meeting with McCain that was billed as open to the public."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Donuel
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 04:51 PM

Sarah Palin is the real deal. When Biden stokes out she will lead from the pulpit and the full force of the US nuclear military.

Who thought that the anti Christ would be a woman?

The campaign is almost drowned out by financial and storm disaster news. Help us on those slow news days...they give us things like lipstick.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 10:00 AM

Palin is the ultimate small-town renegade rising from the frontier to do battle with the corrupt establishment. Her followers take pride in the way she has aroused fear, hatred and panic in the minds of the liberal elite. The feminists declare that she's not a real woman because she doesn't hew to their rigid categories. People who've never been in a Wal-Mart think she is parochial because she has never summered in Tuscany.

Look at the condescension and snobbery oozing from elite quarters, her backers say. Look at the endless string of vicious, one-sided attacks in the news media. This is what elites produce. This is why regular people need to take control.

And there's a serious argument here. In the current Weekly Standard, Steven Hayward argues that the nation's founders wanted uncertified citizens to hold the highest offices in the land. They did not believe in a separate class of professional executives. They wanted rough and rooted people like Palin.

I would have more sympathy for this view if I hadn't just lived through the last eight years. For if the Bush administration was anything, it was the anti-establishment attitude put into executive practice.

And the problem with this attitude is that, especially in his first term, it made Bush inept at governance. It turns out that governance, the creation and execution of policy, is hard. It requires acquired skills. Most of all, it requires prudence.

What is prudence? It is the ability to grasp the unique pattern of a specific situation. It is the ability to absorb the vast flow of information and still discern the essential current of events — the things that go together and the things that will never go together. It is the ability to engage in complex deliberations and feel which arguments have the most weight.

How is prudence acquired? Through experience. The prudent leader possesses a repertoire of events, through personal involvement or the study of history, and can apply those models to current circumstances to judge what is important and what is not, who can be persuaded and who can't, what has worked and what hasn't.

Experienced leaders can certainly blunder if their minds have rigidified (see: Rumsfeld, Donald), but the records of leaders without long experience and prudence is not good. As George Will pointed out, the founders used the word "experience" 91 times in the Federalist Papers. Democracy is not average people selecting average leaders. It is average people with the wisdom to select the best prepared.

Sarah Palin has many virtues. If you wanted someone to destroy a corrupt establishment, she'd be your woman. But the constructive act of governance is another matter. She has not been engaged in national issues, does not have a repertoire of historic patterns and, like President Bush, she seems to compensate for her lack of experience with brashness and excessive decisiveness.

The idea that "the people" will take on and destroy "the establishment" is a utopian fantasy that corrupted the left before it corrupted the right. Surely the response to the current crisis of authority is not to throw away standards of experience and prudence, but to select leaders who have those qualities but not the smug condescension that has so marked the reaction to the Palin nomination in the first place.

(David Brooks, NYT)

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 10:16 AM

The Atlantic's James Fallows, writing at his blog for the magazine, explains why it matters that Sarah Palin, by all appearances, had no idea what the Bush Doctrine was during her interview with Charles Gibson on ABC News.

The incident "implies a disqualifying lack of preparation for the job," Fallows writes. "Not the mundane job of vice president, of course, which many people could handle. Rather the job of potential Commander in Chief and most powerful individual on earth." He later elaborates:

What Sarah Palin revealed is that she has not been interested enough in world affairs to become minimally conversant with the issues. Many people in our great land might have difficulty defining the "Bush Doctrine" exactly. But not to recognize the name, as obviously was the case for Palin, indicates not a failure of last-minute cramming but a lack of attention to any foreign-policy discussion whatsoever in the last seven years.

In addition, Fallows notes, "The view she actually expressed — an endorsement of "preemptive" action — was fine on its own merits. But it is not the stated doctrine of the Bush administration, it is not the policy her running mate has endorsed, and it is not the concept under which her own son is going off to Iraq."

Matthew DeLong of The Washington Independent puts it this way: "The Bush Doctrine is the most controversial foreign policy concept of the 21st century, and it lies at the heart of the debate over the justification of the war in Iraq. Anyone who has followed this debate, or the broader national discussion of American foreign policy over the last eight years should be familiar with the concept and [its] association with President George W. Bush."

The American Conservative's Daniel Larison, writing at his Eunomia blog, is even more worried. He writes, "Worse than being simply uninterested and uninformed about foreign affairs, Palin is now in a position where she will have to be utterly dependent on the 'expertise' of McCain foreign policy advisors for her understanding of these matters, and these just happen to be some of the most irresponsible and dangerous advisors she could have."
Palin "tried to bluff her way through" the interview, "pretending to know what she obviously did not know," writes David Frum, a former speechwriter for President Bush, at his blog for the magazine. "It's an understandable impulse, and in the context of a single interview, not so very terrible. But is it an impulse that she'd lay aside once in office? Or is it a deeper habit? A lot may turn on the answer to that question." President Bush shares the trait, Frum says. He writes:

A president does not need to know everything. In fact, it's certainly impossible for him (or her) to know everything that he might possibly need to know. That's what the White House staff — and beyond them the whole vast apparatus of the U.S. government — is for. Collectively, the U.S. government knows a lot. And all of that knowledge is at the service and disposal of the president. All the president has to do is — is ask.

But that's not as easy as it sounds.

Somebody who knew President Bush well once remarked to me. "You'll notice he never asks questions."

"Why not?" I said.
"Because he doesn't know what it's okay for him not to know."

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 10:34 AM

On Monday, the Obama campaign released a list of major female backers--some there from the start of his campaign, but more important, names of women prominent in the Clinton presidential campaign and some visible females who are just now making a public endorsement. Obama spoke to the group Monday in a conference call, first reported in the Huffington Post.

On Tuesday, Ellie Smeal of the Feminist Majority and Kim Gandy of NOW--the National Organization for Women-- hold a press conference at the National Press Club to make their endorsement of Obama public. These Democratic-allied groups had been in the Clinton camp.

On Wednesday, Michelle Obama and Lilly Ledbetter, a leader in the battle of equal pay for equal work, take part in a roundtable in Richmond, Va. and headline a Virginia Women for Obama voter registration rally.

At 8 p.m. eastern on Wednesday, Joe Biden and Clinton will be part of a video forum hosted by Women for Obama.


Biden and Clinton will, according to a note sent to backers, 
"will discuss a range of issues important to women, from Equal Pay for Equal Work to reproductive health, from expanding the Family Medical Leave Act to giving tax cuts to strengthen the middle class. But they also want to know what's important to you. 

Be part of the conversation on women's issues with Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden."

..."Women for Obama" and the Democratic National Committee on Oct. 10 and 11 in Chicago are holding a two-day fund-raising conference in the city featuring the who's who of Obama's policy and political world.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 11:54 AM

RE; Camille Paglia's article (and I quote):
"It is premature to predict how the Palin saga will go. I may not agree a jot with her about basic principles, but I have immensely enjoyed Palin's boffo performances at her debut. A feminism that cannot admire the bravura under high pressure of the first woman governor of a frontier state isn't worth a warm bucket of spit."

It's pretty clear in which direction Ms. Paglia's valuation of style vs. substance tips. Ah, if Clint Eastwood had ovaries....

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 12:10 PM

In Why Doesn't Obama Lie?" SLate discusses the frequency, magnitude, and persistivity of lying in the two major camps. They conclude Obama lies, but much less than the McCain camp, and corrects falsehoods when pointed out much more readily.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 12:52 PM

A discussion of Palin's inclination to lie about things by Eugene Robinsom in the WaPo.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 03:37 PM

Gov. Sarah Palin "knows more about energy than probably anyone in the United States of America." --John McCain, ABC interview, Sept. 11, 2008.

"My job has been to oversee nearly 20 percent of the U.S. domestic supply of oil and gas." --Gov. Sarah Palin, Campaign event in Golden, Colorado, Sept. 15, 2008.

The woman touted by John McCain as the most knowledgable person in America on energy issues has been having a lot of trouble getting her basic energy statistics straight. Last week, Sarah Palin told Charlie Gibson of ABC News that her state, Alaska, produced "nearly 20 percent of the U.S. domestic supply of energy." Yesterday, she told a campaign rally in Golden, Colorado, that she had been responsible for overseeing "nearly 20 percent of the U.S. domestic supply of oil and gas." Both claims are way off.

The Facts
While Alaska is a leading producer of crude oil, it produces relatively little natural gas, hardly any coal, and no nuclear power. Its share of oil production has been declining sharply, and now ranks lower than Texas and Louisiana. As the following table shows, Alaska is the ninth largest energy supplier in the United States, accounting for a modest 3.5 percent share of the nation's total energy production.

State Total production Percent of U.S. Total
Texas 10,829 Trillion Btu 15.6
Wyoming 9,154 13.1
Louisiana 6,760 9.7
West Virginia 4,061 5.8
California 3,198 4.6
Kentucky 3,097 4.5
New Mexico 2,752 3.9
Pennsylvania 2,694 3.8
Alaska 2,417 3.5

SOURCE: Energy Information Administration

After the non-partisan Factcheck.org pointed out Palin's error in her interview with Gibson, the Alaska governor revised her claim somewhat, limiting it to oil and gas. But data compiled by the Energy Information Administration contradict her claim that she oversees "nearly 20 percent" of oil and gas production in the country. According to authoritative EIA data, Alaska accounted for just 7.4 percent of total U.S. oil and gas production in 2005.

It is not even correct for Palin to claim that her state is responsible for "nearly 20 percent" of U.S. oil production. Oil production has fallen sharply in Alaska during her governorship. The state's share of total U.S. oil production fell from 18 percent in 2005 to 13 percent this year, according to the EIA.

The McCain-Palin campaign did not respond to a request for an explanation.

The Pinocchio Test
The Republican vice presidential nominee continues to peddle bogus statistics three days after the original error was pointed out by independent fact-checkers. Four Pinocchios.

(WaPOs "FactChecker"

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 04:54 PM

Who will win the 2008 U.S. presidential election? Ends: 11/04/08 @ 12:00 PM PST
sign up to begin trading in this market...
show real-time results of this market on your blog or website

TIP: Current value = probability prediction will occur, e.g. $10 = 10% chance prediction will occur.
PREDICTIONS CURRENT VALUE TODAY
Barack Obama $65.02 $1.89
John McCain $34.97 $-1.82


THis is a sort of betting pool or "trading pool" run by CNN.

It strikes me as odd that it is consistently in favor of Obama by distinct margins even thought he polls so widely touted have rollercoastered so heavily.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 04:59 PM

That's because it's run by CNN.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 05:49 PM

Nope. It's entirely determined by its subscribers.

(You can be funny without being a schlmiel, Rig!! :D)


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 06:47 PM

With staffers like these: CSMonitor - Jimmy Orr - "McCain staffers attempt to derail McCain's campaign".

Excerpt (Fiorina is co-chair of McCain's presidential campaign):

Then in a weird attempt to clarify what she meant, Fiorina in a separate interview said that John McCain wasn't qualified to run a corporation either.

Then she clarified the clarification.

"I don't think Barack Obama could run a major corporation," she said. "I don't think Joe Biden could. But it is not the same as being the president or vice president of the United States. It is a fallacy to suggest that the country is like a company, so of course, to run a business, you have to have a lifetime of experience in business, but that's not what Sarah Palin, John McCain, Barack Obama or Joe Biden are doing."

WTF!? None of them are qualified? Talk about your loose cannons!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 07:03 PM

What with American elections coming up very soon, Weebl and Bob have
decided to step up to the political plate with this very subtle bit of
satire. Animated by new boy Zekey who is from the US which means he's
probably on some sort of list for helping make this.

Click

MORE PIE!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 07:14 PM

"(You can be funny without being a schlmiel, Rig!! :D)"


                      A schlmiel?

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 08:33 PM

Sorry, I mistyped. I meant schlemiel.

A loser or a fool; A person who is clumsy or who hurts others emotionally
en.wiktionary.org/wiki/schlemiel


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 10:03 PM

Well, I certainly never intended to hurt anybody emotionally.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 12:30 AM

NYT - McCain Seen as Less Likely to Bring Change Poll Finds

By ROBIN TONER and ADAM NAGOURNEY
Published: September 17, 2008

WASHINGTON — Despite an intense effort to distance himself from the way his party has done business in Washington, Senator John McCain is seen by voters as far less likely to bring change to Washington than Senator Barack Obama. He is widely viewed as a "typical Republican" who would continue or expand President Bush's policies, according to the latest New York Times/CBS News poll.

Polls taken after the Republican convention suggested that Mr. McCain had enjoyed a surge of support — particularly among white women after his selection of Gov. Sarah Palin of Alaska as his running mate — but the latest poll indicates "the Palin effect" was, at least so far, a limited burst of interest. The contest appeared to be roughly where it was before the two conventions and before the vice-presidential selections: Mr. Obama had the support of 48 percent of registered voters, compared with 43 percent for Mr. McCain, a difference within the poll's margin of sampling error, and statistically unchanged from the tally in the last New York Times/CBS News poll, in mid-August.

The poll showed that Mr. McCain had some enduring strengths, including a substantial advantage over Mr. Obama as a potential commander in chief. It found that for the first time, 50 percent of those surveyed in the Times/CBS News poll said they considered that the troop buildup in Iraq, a policy that Mr. McCain championed from the start, had made things better there.

The poll also underlined the extent to which Mr. McCain's convention, and his selection of Ms. Palin, had excited Republican base voters about his candidacy, which is no small thing in a contest that continues to be so tight: 47 percent of Mr. McCain's supporters described themselves as enthused about the Republican Party's presidential ticket, almost twice what it was before the conventions. As often happens at this time of year, partisans are coalescing around their party's nominees and independents are increasingly the battleground.

But the Times/CBS News poll suggested that Ms. Palin's selection has, to date, helped Mr. McCain only among Republican base voters; there was no evidence of significantly increased support for him among women in general. White women were evenly divided between Mr. McCain and Mr. Obama; before the conventions, Mr. McCain led Mr. Obama among white women, 44 percent to 37 percent.

By contrast, at this point in the 2004 campaign, President Bush was leading Senator John Kerry of Massachusetts, the Democratic challenger, by 56 percent to 37 percent among white women.

Among other groups, Mr. Obama had a slight edge among independents, and a 16-percentage-point lead among voters ages 18 to 44. Mr. McCain was leading by 17 points among white men and by the same margin among voters 65 and over. Before the convention, voters 65 and older were closely divided. In the latest poll, middle-age voters, 45 to 64, were almost evenly divided between the two.

The latest Times/CBS News nationwide telephone poll was taken Friday through Tuesday with 1,133 adults, including 1,004 registered voters. The margin of sampling error is plus or minus three percentage points for all respondents and for registered voters.

The poll was taken during a period of extraordinary turmoil on Wall Street. By overwhelming numbers, Americans said the economy was the top issue affecting their vote decision, and they continued to express deep pessimism about the nation's economic future. They continued to express greater confidence in Mr. Obama's ability to manage the economy, even as Mr. McCain has aggressively sought to raise doubts about it.

This poll found evidence of concern about Ms. Palin's qualifications to be president, particularly compared with Senator Joseph R. Biden Jr. of Delaware, Mr. Obama's running mate. More than 6 in 10 said they would be concerned if Mr. McCain could not finish his term and Ms. Palin had to take over. In contrast, two-thirds of voters surveyed said Mr. Biden would be qualified to take over for Mr. Obama, a figure that cut across party lines.

And 75 percent said they thought Mr. McCain had picked Ms. Palin more to help him win the election than because he thought that she was well qualified to be president; by contrast, 31 percent said they thought that Mr. Obama had picked Mr. Biden more to help him win the election, while 57 percent said it was because he thought Mr. Biden was well qualified for the job.

This poll was taken right after Ms. Palin sat down for a series of high-profile interviews with Charles Gibson on ABC News.

Over the last two weeks, Mr. McCain has increasingly tried to distance himself from his party and President Bush, running as an outsider against Washington. The poll suggested the urgency of Mr. McCain's task: The percentage of Americans who disapprove of the way Mr. Bush is conducting his job, 68 percent, was as high as it has been for any sitting president in the history of New York Times polling. And 81 percent said the country was heading in the wrong direction.

The poll found that 46 percent of voters thought Mr. McCain would continue Mr. Bush's policies, while 22 percent said he would be more conservative than Mr. Bush. (About one-quarter said a McCain presidency would be less conservative than Mr. Bush's.) At a time when Mr. McCain has tried to appeal to independent voters by separating himself from his party, notably with his convention speech, 57 percent of all voters said they viewed him as a typical Republican, compared with 40 percent who said he was a different kind of Republican.

Although nearly half of voters also described Mr. Obama as a typical Democrat, the party's brand is not as diminished as the Republicans'; the Democratic Party had a favorability rating of 50 percent in August, compared with 37 percent for the Republicans, a fairly consistent trend in the Times/CBS News Poll since 2006, and part of the general political landscape that many analysts believe favors the Democrats.

In one of the sharpest differences highlighted in the poll, 37 percent said that Mr. McCain would bring real change to Washington, up from 28 percent before the two parties' conventions. But 65 percent of those polled said that Mr. Obama would bring real change to Washington.

Despite weeks of fierce Republican attacks, Mr. Obama has maintained an edge on several key measures of presidential leadership, including economic stewardship. Sixty percent of voters said they were confident in his ability to make the right decisions on the economy, compared with 53 percent who felt that way about Mr. McCain. Sixty percent also said he understood the needs and problems "of people like yourself," compared with 48 percent who said that of Mr. McCain.

More than twice as many said an Obama presidency would improve the image of the United States around the world, 55 percent, compared with those who believed a McCain presidency would do so. Mr. Obama also gets high marks for "sharing the values most Americans try to live by," despite concerted Republican efforts to portray him as elite and out of touch with average voters. Sixty-six percent said Mr. Obama shared their values, compared with 61 percent who said that about Mr. McCain.

Mr. McCain, however, was maintaining some core advantages, particularly on preparedness to be president and ability to serve as commander in chief. Forty-eight percent said Mr. Obama was prepared enough to be president, compared with 71 percent who rated Mr. McCain as adequately prepared.

Fifty-two percent said it was "very likely" that Mr. McCain would be an effective commander in chief, twice as many as felt that way about Mr. Obama.

The two men received similar rankings when voters were asked about what had long been perceived as a McCain strength: the ability to make the right decisions about the war in Iraq. Fifty-two percent said they were "very" or "somewhat" confident in Mr. Obama's ability on this front; 56 percent said they felt that way about Mr. McCain.

In general, Ms. Palin was viewed more favorably (40 percent) than unfavorably (30 percent). She was particularly popular among fellow Republicans, conservatives and white voters who describe themselves as evangelical Christians, which explains her energizing effect on the Republican base. Nearly 70 percent of Mr. McCain's supporters said they were enthusiastic about the selection of Ms. Palin; 27 percent of Mr. Obama's supporters said they were enthusiastic about the selection of Mr. Biden.

When asked who they thought would win in November, 45 percent said Mr. Obama and 38 percent said Mr. McCain.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 02:18 AM

hey kat,

Imagine Sarah Palin using a free Yahoo email account to conduct official Alaskan government business including her remarks about her training to be VP.
Now imagine someone hacked this fascile email account.

and then put it on the web.

Yahoooooooooooo


jeez, what an imagination, its getting late

.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 11:40 AM

Poll Date Sample McCain (R) Obama (D)                Spread
RCP Average 09/10 - 09/1745.3 47.0             Obama +1.7
Rasmussen Tracking 09/15 - 09/17 3000 LV 48 48          Tie
CBS News/NY Times 09/12 - 09/16 LV 44 49                Obama +5
Quinnipiac 09/11 - 09/16 987 LV 45 49                        Obama +4
Battleground Tracking* 09/10 - 09/17 800 LV 47 45       McCain +2
Gallup Tracking 09/14 - 09/16 2787 RV 45 47             Obama +2
Hotline/FD Tracking 09/14 - 09/16 909 RV 42 45          Obama +3
Reuters/Zogby 09/11 - 09/13 1008 LV 45 47                Obama +2
Newsweek 09/10 - 09/11 1038 RV 46 46                     Tie

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 11:49 AM

I know, Donuel, effing amazing, isn't it? What an idjit!

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Alice
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 12:03 PM

This might have been posted here already, but the state government in Alaska under Palin has routinely been using their personal email accounts to do state business because they decided their communication then could be kept secret. Communication that is public government business is by law a matter of public record and there are legal standards for retaining those records for a certain amount of time. This problem is not only an Alaska government problem. See this article:
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2008180084_palinemail15.html

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: beardedbruce
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 12:57 PM

Polls: McCain, Obama tied in 5 battleground states

Story Highlights
CNN/Time Magazine/Opinion Research Corp. polls released Wednesday

Poll shows the race for Florida and its 27 electoral votes,is tied

The race, according to the poll, is also tight in Ohio, which has 20 electoral votes

In Indiana, the survey puts McCain up by six points, 51 percent to 45 percent

   
WASHINGTON (CNN) -- New polls in five battleground states that could decide the presidency suggest the fight for the White House between Sens. John McCain and Barack Obama remains a dead heat.

A new poll out Wednesday shows a virtually tied race between John McCain and Barack Obama in key states.

The CNN/Time Magazine/Opinion Research Corp. polls out Wednesday indicate the race for Florida and its 27 electoral votes is tied.

Florida decided the 2000 election between then-Texas Gov. George W. Bush and then-Vice President Al Gore. Four years ago, President Bush won Florida by 5 points over Sen. John Kerry.

The new survey, conducted Sunday through Tuesday, indicates 48 percent of registered voters in Florida back Republican presidential candidate McCain for president and an equal amount support Obama, the Democratic candidate.

"Florida is a state that would be directly affected by offshore drilling, but voters in that state may be more affected by high gas prices," said CNN Polling Director Keating Holland. "Two-thirds of all Floridians favor increased offshore drilling for oil and gas." Watch how the candidates are doing in key states »

The poll shows a tight race for Ohio and its 20 electoral votes. The new survey suggests that 49 percent of registered voters in Ohio back Obama and 47 percent support McCain.

The small Obama advantage is well within the poll's sampling error, making the race a tie. President Bush's narrow victory in Ohio four years ago clinched his re-election.

A CNN poll of polls in Ohio, also out Wednesday, gives McCain a 3-point lead, 48-45 percent. The poll of polls is an average of the latest public opinion surveys in the state.

"In Ohio, higher-income voters have moved more toward McCain in the last few weeks, while lower-income voters have trended toward Obama," Holland said. "It looks like economic issues are increasingly dividing voters along income lines -- at least in Ohio -- in the classic pattern that we have seen in previous elections."

The poll suggests Obama is staying competitive in two red states that his campaign is trying to turn blue.

In North Carolina, which Bush won by 12 points in the last presidential election, the poll indicates that 47 percent of registered voters back Obama, 1 point behind McCain. But other polls in the state suggest McCain has a larger lead, and when averaged in a new CNN poll of polls out Wednesday, McCain has a 10-point lead.

In Indiana, the survey puts McCain up by 6 points, 51-45 percent. The lead is within the poll's sampling error. Indiana has not favored a Democrat in a presidential election since 1964, but the Obama campaign is putting a lot of time, effort and money into trying to be the first since then.

Wisconsin has voted for the Democrats in the last four presidential elections, but it was extremely close last time, with Kerry topping Bush by 1 point. It seems Wisconsin remains divided, with 50 percent of voters questioned in the poll backing Obama and 47 percent supporting McCain.

"Obama's strength is in the city of Milwaukee and along the Wisconsin-Illinois border, where he may have a home-field advantage," Holland said. "McCain does well in the rest of the state."

Third-party presidential candidates could affect the results in some of these states.

When included in the results, independent Ralph Nader, Libertarian Bob Barr and Green Party candidate Cynthia McKinney grab a total of 7 percent of the vote in Indiana, 6 percent in Florida and Ohio, and 5 percent in North Carolina, which could be enough to influence the outcome in those states.

So, where does the overall race for electoral votes stand?

Taking into account these polls, CNN estimates if the presidential election were held today, Obama would win 233 electoral votes and John McCain 189. There are 116 electoral votes up for grabs; 270 electoral votes are needed to win the White House.

The CNN Electoral Map takes into account a number of factors, including the most recent state polls, voting trends and campaign ad spending and events in the particular states.

In the poll, 907 registered voters in Florida, 890 registered voters in Indiana, 910 registered voters in North Carolina, 913 registered voters in Ohio and 950 registered votes in Wisconsin were questioned by telephone.

The sampling error is 3.5 percentage points in Florida, Indiana, and North Carolina and 3 percentage points in Ohio and Wisconsin.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 01:07 PM

Colorado is purple, but I think it is going to be blue come election day.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: beardedbruce
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 01:21 PM

And MD is blue, so it does not matter if I bother to even vote.

As I have stated, with the Democratic Party lock on the 4 MD counties that matter in national elections, ( large populations), the electronic voting machines with no tracability or accountability, and the local Democratic control of the election boards, MD's electorial votes are so solidly Democratic that Abe Lincoln would lose here. A few percent "overcount" in thses four counties will overwhelm even a landslide in the remaining counties.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 01:48 PM

That's a lot of innuendo, there, Bruce. ANything to substantiate your implications of corruption?


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: beardedbruce
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 02:06 PM

Only the same level as you have brought out about Florida and Ohio- ei, nothing that can be brought into a court.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 02:11 PM

I have rtelayed reports on the Ohio and Florida scandals of 2004 as they appeared in the popular press.

You appear to have made up your conjectures out of whiole cloth.

In other news, the Third Wing is still alive:

"Video:
Cynthia McKinney urges new 9/11 investigation http://www.ireport.com/docs/DOC-83498
Cynthia McKinney discusses major issues
http://www.youtube.com/user/RunCynthiaRun
http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=RunCynthiaRun
Press conference, Sept. 10 at the National Press Club in Washington, DC http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_5ivgS4asc
Ms. McKinney on the Democratic Party: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpYlQx2MLuw

WASHINGTON, DC — Green Party leaders expressed support for Green presidential nominee Cynthia McKinney's call for a new investigation of the 9/11 attacks and for public release of important evidence and files related to 9/11.

On Thursday afternoon, Ms. McKinney spoke at St. Marks Church in Manhattan at a 9/11 anniversary press conference promoting a New York City ballot initiative for a new investigation (http://www.nyc911initiative.org). Ms McKinney is speaking at other events related to 9/11 in the next few days (http://www.allthingscynthiamckinney.com/event).

Greens also supported a resolution passed by Veterans For Peace at the latter's annual meeting earlier this week in Minneapolis addressing Bush military policy in Afghanistan and Iraq and impeachment and prosecution of President Bush and Vice President Cheney for crimes, violations of the US Constitution, and abuses of power. The text of the resolution is appended below.

"A curtain of censorship hangs over several major national issues in this election," said John M. Wages, Jr., Green candidate for the US House of Representatives in Mississippi (District 1) (http://www.VoteJohnWages.com). "The related issues of unanswered 9/11 questions, illegality of the Iraq and Afghanistan occupations, and Congress's failure to impeach President Bush and Vice President Cheney deserve the kind of discussion that Democrats and Republicans are avoiding. The Green Party, Green candidates like Cynthia McKinney, and groups like Veterans For Peace are working hard to keep them in the public eye."

Ms. McKinney has supported calls by families of the 9/11 victims for a transparent investigation into what was called a "failure of intelligence," although it more closely resembled a failure of response, of standard operating procedures, and of government officials and agencies to respond, prepare for, and comprehend the source of these attacks. In 2002, Ms. McKinney questioned the Bush Administration's response to 9/11 and said that Bush officials may have had evidence that the attacks would take place. Although she was denounced in the media as a conspiracy theorist for her remarks, the 9/11 Commission confirmed McKinney's assertions. The Green Party has consistently supported calls for a new investigation (see http://www.gp.org/press/pr_2006_09_11.shtml and http://www.gp.org/press/pr_07_29_04b.html).

The Green Party has long alleged that President Bush exploited public fear, anger, and confusion about 9/11 as an excuse to launch illegal invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq, which the administration justified with claims based on manipulated intelligence and numerous deceptions. The party endorsed impeachment of Mr. Bush in July, 2003, and Ms. McKinney, as US Representative from Georgia, introduced the first motion for impeachment in 2006.

..." (See this page for original).

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: beardedbruce
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 02:19 PM

"WASHINGTON, D.C. -- DC Statehood Green Party members responded to published claims that the mystery of lost Statehood Green and Republican primary votes has been solved, saying that explanations from the D.C. Board of Elections and Ethics (DCBOEE) raised new questions about the integrity of D.C. elections.

On October 23, the Statehood Green Party announced that former candidate Philip Blair, in routine review of votes after the September 25 primary election in Ward 5, discovered discrepances: only 89 votes recorded for 140 Statehood Green voters, with 51 votes apparently 'lost'; 40% of Republican votes also disappeared in the same Ward 5 primary (see "Voting irregularities discovered in Ward 5 primary election results in Washington, D.C." or )."

http://www.gp.org/press/states/dc/dc_2006_10_26.shtml

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 03:43 PM

Gee. WOnder what happened!


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: beardedbruce
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 03:47 PM

Well, losing 40% of the votes by the minority party is OK, in DC...

With electronic machines that the Dem. controlled state legislature would not allow to be replaced with machines that provided a hardcoy log, there is no way to verify the votes in MD.

Amazingly enough, the Dems ( who control the voting machines) seem to win most of the elections...

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 04:12 PM

Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, who was to star at two major California fundraisers and an Orange County rally for 15,000 next week, has canceled her two-day swing through the Golden State, campaign sources said.

The change is a shocker, because Palin's presence had electrified the GOP base in California. Party insiders were distributing 15,000 tickets to her Sept. 26 rally in Orange County -- and fundraisers reported an almost instantaneous sell-out of her two $1,000-a-head Sept. 25 fundraising events in Orange County and Santa Clara.

Both fundraisers had generated such high ticket sales that the OC Lincoln Club event was moved to the Orange County Performing Arts Center, and the Bay Area event was moved from the Woodside home of Tom Siebel to the huge Santa Clara Convention Center.


The change comes in the same week a new Field Poll showed that Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama still leads Republican presidential candidate John McCain in California by a whopping 16-point margin.

So Palin's pullout from her Western state swing is sure to ramp up chatter that the GOP ticket -- which has insisted it will compete here -- may be reassessing its Golden State presence. (Team McCain says it's just a scheduling issue.)

The Field poll had some troubling news for McCain-Palin here: The Alaska Gov's addition to the ticket, while strengthening the GOP base, hasn't advanced the ball for the Republican team among the 1 in 5 California voters who are independent or decline to state.

Field Poll director Mark DiCamillo noted this week that those independents and middle-of-the-roaders are the same critical voters who elected Arnold Schwarzenegger here -- and weigh heavily in the election nationwide. A New York Times poll released today, which shows Obama ahead by 5 points, appears to reflect the same trend.

Just last week, powerhouse Bay Area GOP fundraiser Kristen Hueter said Palin was a ''gangbusters'' fundraiser with folks snapping up tickets and coming from around the country for her Sept. 25 appearances.

---

Oh, Bruce!! You don't remember the crooked elections of 2000 and 2004? The disenfranchisement of thousands? JEb's crooked chads?

How easily we forget.

So how is it the Dems "control" the voting machines? In what region?

And how do you know it is not just the aura of incumbency?


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 04:21 PM

At rallies in the week following the convention, the McCain-Palin duo saw their best attendance and a newfound zeal, and the Republican ticket took the lead in national polls for the first time.

But polls show that the momentum has shifted once again.

Palin's favorable rating is at 40 percent, according to a CBS News/New York Times poll. That's down 4 points from last week. Her unfavorable rating is at 30 percent, rising 8 points in a week.

The poll was conducted September 12-16 and has a sampling error of plus or minus 3 percentage points.

Former Bush adviser Karl Rove predicted Wednesday that Palin's star power would wear off.

"Nothing lasts for 60-some-odd days," Rove told The Associated Press. "Will she be the center of attention in the remaining 48 days? No, but she came on in a very powerful way and has given a sense of urgency to the McCain campaign that's pretty remarkable."

But this week, the Democrats recaptured the headlines, and Obama regained his lead in the national polls.

CNN's latest poll of polls, out Thursday afternoon, shows him ahead of McCain by 3 points, 47 percent to 44 percent.

The poll of polls consists of six recent surveys: CBS/NYT (September 12-16), Quinnipiac (September 11-16), IPSOS-McClatchy (September 11-15), Gallup (September 15-17), Diageo/Hotline (September 14-16) and American Research Group (September 13-15). It does not have a sampling error.

After a week in which McCain put Obama on the defensive over allegations of playing the gender card, the economic crisis has given Obama an opportunity to go on the offense. Most Americans see Obama as more capable than John McCain when it comes to handling the economy, polls show.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 04:52 PM

There's a kind of fun op/ed piece at the NYTs which pokes some gentle fun at Democrats: HERE.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: katlaughing
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 07:53 PM

From Voice of America:

"If we are focusing on economic issues, which has never been John McCain's strength and where Americans are looking for change, and where the CBS poll suggests one other problem for McCain, which is that a majority of Americans see him as a typical Republican, not as an agent of change. The change gap remains extremely strong, then Obama has a very significant amount of traction [i.e., has the potential to gain supporters]," said Norman Ornstein, a political analyst at the American Enterprise Institute in Washington.

Polls have long shown that voters consider the economy the number one issue in this year's election, a factor that should favor the Democrats.

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Riginslinger
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 09:58 PM

It should. I wonder why it doesn't?

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: Amos
Date: 19 Sep 08 - 01:25 AM

But it does, Rig. The polls have flipped in the last 3-4 days.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 19 Sep 08 - 08:29 AM

Australia always follows US - diplomat

...
"McCain has said that he'll try and throw Russia out of the G8 organisation because of what they did in Georgia, they're going to stand up to the rise of the Chinese military, they're going to stay in Iraq until victory, whatever that means, so in foreign policy it will be a kind of revived, muscular version of Bush foreign policy," he said.

"If Obama's elected ... in foreign policy he will bring back in the Clinton professionals, who are less confrontational, stress diplomacy, stress working with multi-lateral institutions."
...

Subject: RE: BS: Notes on the Presidential Campaign
From: beardedbruce
Date: 19 Sep 08 - 11:24 AM

"A media consensus has formed that John McCain is telling whoppers to win the presidency. Influential commentator Mark Halperin, for example, says, "Lies are more central to the McCain campaign than to the Obama campaign."

Halperin said the same thing in 2004--the Republican candidate was more dishonest than the Democratic one, his lies more "central to his efforts to win"--and he was wrong then.

He's wrong, too. Exhibit A in the media's case against McCain as a man who will say anything to win is his ad on Obama's support of sex education for kindergartners--but McCain is right.

Sure, McCain has sometimes stretched the truth, putting himself in the best light and Obama in the worst. But Obama is now running an ad taking Rush Limbaugh's words out of context and, ludicrously, suggesting that McCain and Limbaugh are close political allies on immigration. Obama has previously distorted McCain's comments about maintaining a military presence in Iraq to suggest, falsely, that McCain wants 100 years of war, and seized on snippets of McCain comments to suggest that he thinks all is well with the economy.

If one were in a partisan frame of mind, one might even say that Obama's self-portrayal as someone interested in reaching across the aisle to accomplish things is a lie. I don't expect reporters to say that. But when they say that McCain is campaigning dirtier than Obama, a partisan cast of mind is exactly what they're revealing."