BS: Dorset has its own flag

Subject: BS: Dorset has it's own flag
From: Terry McDonald
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 01:52 PM

Today it has been announced that the good people of Dorset have chosen the St Wite's Cross as their county's flag. To see it, go to flagfordorset.org.uk

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has it's own flag
From: Terry McDonald
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 01:53 PM

oops, sorry about the apostrophe!

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has it's own flag
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 02:31 PM

And here's a blue clicky

Kitty

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has it's own flag
From: Terry McDonald
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 03:09 PM

Thanks Kitty - I've not mastered that art......yet.

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has it's own flag
From: Scooby Doo
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 03:33 PM

Are we going back to the dark ages ,Lewes has there own coinage and Dorset has its its own emblem whats next?.


Scooby.

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: Terry McDonald
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 04:02 PM

Every US State, every Canadian province, every French region etc etc has its own flag so your point is?

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 04:15 PM

Bit sorry that it doesn't have the Dorset Dragons on it - with the motto "Who's afear'd" but happy that it isn't the County Council three red lions who were a bit girly.

I shall add it to my collection.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: Micca
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 05:04 PM

liz, Dragons??? weren't they Wyverns?

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 07:38 PM

The site says it's the endorsed flag of Devon, but doesn't state by whom.
It also says it is publcally voted for by 54% (54% of what?)
Is this possibly some flag maker looking to make some quick money from the gullible public?

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: Sorcha
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 07:52 PM

Hell, my TOWN has it's own flag. Don't see what any flap is about.

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 08:07 PM

Interesting to note that of 300+ 'hits' on Google for "St Wite"+Flag they all seem to relate to the proposed flag for Dorset. No historic link to a flag for St Wite.

Or am I just a born sceptic?

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: Terry McDonald
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 03:38 AM

Dorset County Council, after some initial resistance to the idea of a flag for the county (it has its own Council flag), held a competition and short listed four designs. People were asked to vote by sending in a ballot form (available from libraries etc) or on-line. You had to live in Dorset to vote. Almost 4,000 people voted and the St Wite's Cross received 54%. The other three designs received 22%,21% and 3%.

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: GUEST,LTS pretending to work
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 03:54 AM

Dorset has dragons, Wessex has Wyverns... the difference is in the number of limbs and the initial letter acts as a mnemonic as to which goes where.

St Wite was a local Dorset saint, she's not well known anywhere else. She probably lived before flags were a common thing outside of the royal court, I can't google her from work so I can't remember her dates.

Nigel - your geography is as bad as mine, but even I know which county I'm talking about!

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: Micca
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 04:28 AM

My mistake Liz, I should have realized, with your long association with dragons!!!!(I thought Dorset was most of Wessex anyway!!)

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: GUEST,DorsetFlag
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 04:31 AM

Terry McDonald has outlined exactly what the situation is in Dorset. I wrote 'endorsed' as only the Queen herself can make a flag official.

The flag is not 'St Wite's' Cross - ie, it is not modelled after some cross she had, it is in fact called 'The Dorset Cross' and recognises her as a Dorset Saint. Please read the website, before making assumption.

This whole dragon situation:

Wessex always had dragons, two and four-legged. In Anglo-Saxon times, there would have been no distinction between Wyvern and Dragon - it would have been a Wyrm. Traditionally - it has become the Wessex Wyvern, but Dragon just as much suits. www.englishdragon.org.uk

Dorset at NO point had dragons, but rather used the 3 lions of England Passant Guardant in the arms of Dorset County Council.

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: Paul Burke
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 04:37 AM

There's been a rash of Derbyshire flags since they were designed and selected (by radio listeners as far as I can make out) a couple of years ago. It's a wishy- washy design without a history. This is waht they said about it:

The blue is one of the traditional colours of Derbyshire and represents our rivers and reservoirs too, the cross marks the fact that Derbyshire is at the centre of the country and it's green because we are a lush county.

The rose is in gold to symbolise our quality and avoid confusion with Lancashire and Yorkshire.

A lush county indeed, especially at weekends. They could have added black for the coal, and grey for the mud. I would have thought a duck (as in "ey up me duck") would have been appropriate, particularly for the County Cricket club.

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 05:33 AM

Its horrible - change it! it looks like the thing tey used to hang out for yellow fever - place of quarantine.

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: Mr Red
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 07:57 AM

Devon have had one for some time.

Would Staffordshire have a not flag ? (I think that works better pnoetically).

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: GUEST,LTS pretending to work
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 08:12 AM

DorsetFlag - go and look at the coat of arms for the COUNTY... 2 dragons (4 legs, 2 wings, total 6 limbs each) supporting the arms and the motto 'Who's Afear'd'. The 3 nancy lions are the arms of the County COUNCIL - a different body entirely. Try and have a look at the side of a Dorset based St John's Ambulance - the dragon used to be displayed there. Even Wikipediment knows the difference between a county and a county council.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: Terry McDonald
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 08:50 AM

There was also the problem that the county's two largest towns, Poole and Bournemouth, are unitary authorities and therefore not run by the County Council. They are, however, still part of the historic and geographic county of Dorset, hence the need for a flag for all of us.

re WLD's comment - yes, there are some who say that but the 'yellow' is actually 'gold' and, I suspect, like anything new, it will soon be an accepted part of the 'cultural scenery.' Folkies seem to like it - there were plenty on display at both the Wimborne and Wessex (Weymouth) Folk festivals earlier in the year!

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: GUEST,DorsetFlag
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 09:16 AM

LTS - there is no county arms. The arms of Dorset County Council are all that there are. The arms are supported by two Wessex golden dragons.

Don't believe me? Look here:

http://www.civicheraldry.co.uk/dorset.html

No need to be sarcastic.

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: bubblyrat
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 10:02 AM

I lived in Dorset for many years, and would love to have flown a Dorset flag at ,say,Sidmouth campsite,amongst all those Devon,Cornwall and Wales emblems. I think it's a GREAT idea,and good old Dorset, says I !!Now then, what can we come up with for Oxfordshire ?? (if there isn't one already ?).

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: Terry McDonald
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 10:21 AM

There seems not to be an Oxfordshire flag, although the English County Flags website shows one that flies over the County Council's Building. Wikipedia's 'List of British Flags' doesn't have one for Oxfordshire. (It's already included the Dorset flag and removed the word 'unofficial'that was there last week.) Your moment has come, Bubblyrat......

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 17 Sep 08 - 01:37 PM

Guest;DorsetFlag

I did read the website, particularly the bit which says:
"The Name

We call it the Dorset Cross. You may have seen us previously refer to it as St Wite's Cross. After listening to some feedback, we felt a more encompassing, secular name would be better for the flag and the people it represents."

Maybe you should read the site before correcting others!

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: GUEST,Nessie
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 05:26 AM

Now I want one for Hampshire too Liz - the County Coucil one, which only dates from 1992, "may not be used to represent the county". Mind you, most of my ancestors came from around Christchurch, which you lot nicked in 1974. Still, I'm sure us Hampshire Hogs could come up with one as symbolic as the Cornish/Devon flags now Dorset has set a precedent.
Vanessa

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: GUEST,DorsetFlag
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 06:00 AM

Nigel Parsons

Considering I'm the person who created that website - nothing I have said is incorrect. The official title is 'The Dorset Cross' - not St Wite's Cross.

Besides - that wasn't your original complaint was it? Sceptic, grumble grumble, money-making scheme, grumble grumble. Born Sceptic indeed.

Now cheer up ya old bugger.

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: GUEST,Stephen Coombs
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 06:09 AM

If you read the material at the Flag for Dorset websíte properly you will find that the name St. Wite's Cross is still in use together with that of the Dorset Cross. Dorset peoiple can fly the one flag and choose between its two names.

Why not a saint's name - St. George, St. Andrew, St. Piran in Cornwell and St. Petroc in Devon, so why not St. Wite in Dorset? See http://dorsetflag.blogspot.com/ and "St. Wite's Cross" at http://dorsetflag.webs.com/rollofhonour.htm

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 06:22 AM

GuestDorsetFlag,
You contradict yourself.
The site (which you state you created) gives the quote I gave above:
You may have seen us previously refer to it as St Wite's Cross. After listening to some feedback, we felt a more encompassing, secular name would be better for the flag and the people it represents.
This would mean (to most interpretations) that the name Dorset Flag is a new appelation for something previously/also known as the St Wites Flag.
This contradicts your earlier statement on this site:
The flag is not 'St Wite's' Cross - ie, it is not modelled after some cross she had, it is in fact called 'The Dorset Cross' and recognises her as a Dorset Saint. Please read the website, before making assumption.

So even if, as you claim nothing I have said is incorrect it is certainly misleading, and even appears self contradictory.

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: GUEST,Elliot Lurie
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 06:33 AM

I heartily agree that the people of Dorset should have our own flag. Here in Broadwindsor (Dorset) we already have our own little flag, green with the local coat of arms.

EL
XOX

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: Terry McDonald
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 12:23 PM

I described the flag as St Wite's Cross in my first post as I had a postcard in front of me calling it just that. Sorry - I hadn't realised the name had been amended. Anyway, I like it and hope that those counties without their own flag start lobbying for one!

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: Rasener
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 02:39 PM

Lincolnshire Flag for yellowbellies

http://images.google.co.uk/images?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4RNWN_enGB224GB224&q=Lincolnshire+flag&um=1&sa=X&oi=image_re

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 18 Sep 08 - 06:38 PM

From Dogdike to Threckingham, even as far as Louth....the indifference will be palpable, Les!

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Sep 08 - 05:39 AM

"You may have seen us previously refer to it as St Wite's Cross. After listening to some feedback, we felt a more encompassing, secular name would be better for the flag and the people it represents."

There is nothing here to suggest that the new name would replace the old one. The idea was simply to provide an alternative name that some people might prefer.

Dave White, Chris Brown and others have had a variety of reactions to naming the flag after a saint. Some people were put off by it, but pretty soon we got an opposite reaction - clearly some people were very much in favour of the name linking the flag to the local saint. From our point of view (I get into the picture because I originally thought up this combination of colours and the general design) both names are equally valid, you just take your pick. I don't suppose anyone in Cornwell minds whether you talk about St. Pirin's Cross ofr the Cornish Flag?

The point is, this is a flag for anyone who wants to use it. For some of us - but obviously not for everyone - St. Wite (and please do read the website information thoroughly, Nigel Parsons) is a potent symbol of Dorset history and of cultural survival through difficult times.

Subject: RE: BS: Dorset has its own flag
From: GUEST,Stephen Coombs
Date: 19 Sep 08 - 05:41 AM

Sorry, I didn't give my name when sending the message timed - wrongly - 05:39 AM. anyway, it's Stephen Coombs again.