not bad for an englishman

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Wilfried Schaum
Date: 30 Sep 08 - 09:13 AM

And the first prize of this competition goes to:

Perhaps the appropriate response would have been to congratulate her on her fluent English. Paul Burke
Well said! Martin Ryan

In this man's humble opinion this is the funniest contribution so far. [Opened the browser today for the first time after a fortnight of tedious defragmentation of my hard disc, and got a lot of laughter just in the first thread I opened.]

Sing and enjoy
Wilfried

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: MartinRyan
Date: 30 Sep 08 - 09:02 AM

I'm sure she didn't think she was being racist... ;>)

Regards

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: GUEST,beachcomber
Date: 30 Sep 08 - 08:30 AM

I'm quite surprised that this thread , being used in such a way as to give licence to many rascist remarks, has not been deleted ?

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 30 Sep 08 - 06:12 AM

The correct response should have been ' yes and your English is not bad for a foreigner '

eric

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Santa
Date: 30 Sep 08 - 06:05 AM

My local river, at one time, was a base for Roman warships protecting the locals from Irish slavers. We shouldn't stop at 800 years if we want to find reason for conflict between the English (or British, as it was at the time) and the Irish. However, one of those taken to be slaves in a later century became the patron saint of Ireland: we may not all be saints but he managed to forgive rather more than most of us have had to put up with.

Now, to more serious matters - what is the difference between a Mick and a Paddy? When is it right to use one rather than the other? (Or equally wrong, OK......)

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: MartinRyan
Date: 30 Sep 08 - 05:01 AM

Paul

Well said!

Mind you... A few days ago I was walking out from the picturesque village of Clarinbridge, here in Galway. The traffic was badly backed up because there was a community market in the town on a lovely sunny day (one of the few we've had this year!). Anyway, a woman stuck in the traffic wound down her car window and, in an Irish accent, addressed me thus: "Excuse me. Do you speak English?"! Now, I was wearing a rather fetching Breton-style jumper at the time - but I'd no beret, never mind onions around my neck! I replied "Jeez, I hope so - me mother'd be fierce disappointed otherwise!".

Regards

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Paul Burke
Date: 30 Sep 08 - 04:50 AM

Perhaps the appropriate response would have been to congratulate her on her fluent English.

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 30 Sep 08 - 04:49 AM

John from Kemsing

There is no such thing as an Irish or English or Scottish "race".

Just in the same way as there is no Black race in America or no Arab race in Palestine? I think you may know exactly what I mean and are just playing with words but just in case, I suggest you tell the next Scotsman, Irishman or Welshman you meet that they are all the same as the English!

Jim

What delicate, thin-skinned little flowers some of you appear to be.

Why do you say that and to whom are you referring? It is not a question of who takes offence it is a question of where do you draw the line. I'll rephrase my question, for the third time, which one of the following statements is likely to cause offence -

The Irish are bad singers
Black people are bad singers
Jews are bad singers
The English are bad singers

Surely it must be all of them or none. Which do you believe it is?

Cheers

Dave

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: The Sandman
Date: 30 Sep 08 - 04:46 AM

wld,
I said nothing to the woman concerned.
but I thought it worth discussing on this forum.
many people here in Ireland are going to have to change their insular attitudes,the country is changing very fast,a need to examine ingrained prejudices is important,if Ireland is to live with many nationalities in its island.
even though I believe some offence was intended I am not offended,I have had this sort of stuff before,like dont think you can come here and show us how to sing,and thats f##### tan money etc.,a minority[but a recent poll showed 60 percent want tighter controls on immigration]and Fine Gael recently outlined a scheme to repatriate immigrants.
as a matter of fact,I am very happy in Ireland,and find the majority of people friendly kind and couteous.
I dont even bother to read Jim Carrolls contributions.

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Mr Red
Date: 30 Sep 08 - 03:44 AM

Oh come on, lets face it - as Theodore Sturgeon put it nine tenths of everything is crud so nine tenths of nine tenths is probably pretty bad and nine tenths of the dregs must be dire.

And I don't think the Sci Fi author was limiting it to the inanimate. The "troubles" came from somewhere.

Some people carry baggage that is so heavy they want you to carry some.

As the late Dave Hawes (FC & Festival organiser) put it - "You must realise that some people suffer from a very low self-esteem" and the person we both knew who we were talking about is now a manageable person in my company, instead of a right pain in the arse. He is no different - I am.

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 30 Sep 08 - 03:21 AM

"In the view of many Irish people, the English are roughly what the kids of SS officers must be when they visit Israel."
Sorry WLD - utter shit. This sums up for me all the dangerous nonsense that this sort of crap gives rise to - How much time have you spent over here - is this really what you feel happens here - if so, why bother coming?
It really is a perfect example of the dangers of taking this crap seriously - it's the equivalent of the man in the John Bull outfit with his sandwich board 'protecting the pound'.
Sure, there are a few nationalist nutters everywhere - take a peep at the last night of the Proms next time they are on - but "many Irish people"...... come on!!!!
If the Cap'n feels the remark was said maliciously he has not made his point very well; he is entitled to take offence; he is not entitled to generalise on behalf of the rest of us, nor is WLD or anybody else. What an insecure world some people seem to live in.
How far do you take this paranoid nonsense?
Not so long ago the Cap'n used the term 'blow-in'; a phrase that is used in banter around regularly here - for those who don't know, it means an outsider who has come to live in the area. Taken seriously it can be highly insulting and hurtful for us 'blow-ins'. Should I take offence at the Cap'n's use of it?
It seems to me that there is a desperate need for a few sense of humour transplants around here.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 05:59 PM

Whilst I sympathise and an empathise with much of what you are saying. You are onto think ear for nowt. Its not the way to bury our differences. the best thing is to say nowt.

In the view of many Irish people, the English are roughly what the kids of SS officers must be when they visit Israel.

Whilst you are not personally responsible for any atrocities. you are not in a good place in history to be reprimanding the Irish for racism.

If you are of the same generation roughly as myself, you heard your relations in the years after the war say, the only good German is a dead one and stuff like that. the time frame is about the same.

You wouldn't have to throw a stick very far on the mudcat site to hit someone who thought Thatcher's handling of the Irish situation was sheer brilliance.

If you are English, this really is a no win, keep your trap shut situation. hard to see how anything we can say will make it better.

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: The Sandman
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 05:14 PM

there is a difference here,between when you know someone reasonably well as Paul knows his wife,or when jim is amongst traveller friends.
whereas if I came up to a complete stranger and said you sing very well for a knacker,thats different.
yes I do believe some offence was intended,and it is not the first time I have encountered it in Ireland,it was said in a patronising offensive way.
but to put it in perspective,perhaps three times in 18 years,probably one per cent of the overall comments.
I have also had the tan comment and said unpleasantly,when I inadvertently pulled out sterling,whereas by contrast when I pulled out euros in England,I was politely told that they couldnt be accepted.
I have not taken offence although I believe offence was intended,because I know there are racists everywhere,there is one on this very forum.
I thought the incident was worthy of discussion,because it has become evident to me,that there are people in Ireland,who think it is only the Irish that have any music.,and who still have a mighty chip on their shoulders about the English.
This attitude is ignorant,considering a sizeable proportion of the reels are scottish,the hornpipes Scottish and even English.
the fact of the matter is no one should walk up to a complete stranger,and say your not bad for a woman,traveller,englishman,japanese.knacker or whatever ]
with respect, I was there.
I turned round and repeated,it to a fellow musician WHO IS irish,her reaction was the same as mine.

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 04:11 PM

What delicate, thin-skinned little flowers some of you appear to be.
Racial stereotyping my arse - give us a break.
I have been listening to similar comments about Liverpudlians, Mancunians, Londoners (from both sides of the Thames), Brummies, Northerners, Southerners, - you name it... all of my life; should we wrap ourselves in cotton-wool to the extent that all of these are no go area as well?
I agree totally with Paul's comment, with the rider that I would maybe take offence if I believed that offence was intended - does the Cap'n believe this to be the case?
Yes Cap'n, it was possible for us to joke about 'tinkers' and 'knackers' with Travellers, just as it was for them to joke about 'gorgies' and 'buffers' with us - can never remember either giving or taking offence - but perhaps the Travellers we knew were made of sterner stuff than the hothouse flowers we seem to have here.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: GUEST,John from Kemsing
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 03:59 PM

Dave Polshaw,
             I do believe you are way off the beam when you consider banter or even offensive remarks between people from different countries in the British Isles as "racism". There is no such thing as an Irish or English or Scottish "race". We are better described as nations that have developed due to political and geographical circumstances but we are all still mostly, at the moment, Caucasians of the British Isles.

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Banjiman
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 03:54 PM

Dave, agreed, you need to be careful......but I repeat that I would not have been offended in Dick's shoes.

Living in a mixed household (Scottish/ English) we spend a lot of time playing with our national stereotypes and taking the mickey.... no one gets offended.

I can't take the type of banter that Dick is talking about too seriously......not when there is serious racism out there (limiting peoples life chances, propogating violence, wars etc). This is what we should be tackling, not worrying about pretty innocuous remarks probably meant as a joke.

Paul

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 03:48 PM

Often enough when the joke is about stereotypes concerning your own "race".

Most stereotypes have some truth in them, including the flattering ones. The trouble is when "some truth" gets treated as if was a lot more than "some".

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: The Sandman
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 03:48 PM

I went into my butchers this morning,he asked me how I was,so I replied not bad for an Englishman,he gave me an old fashioned look.
when I told him the story,he thought the remark was out of order.
   anyway from now on, anyone asks me how I am,I shall reply not bad for an Englishman.

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 03:15 PM

Whitewash again, Jim. You are avoiding the question. When is it acceptable to use racial stereotyping to get a laugh?

Cheers

Dave

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 03:13 PM

You did indeed, Paul. My apologies.

Makes it even more important that people don't use such phrases though doesn't it. Can we be ceratin what the listeners reaction is all the time? Or even who is listening? Can I ask again then. When are such phrases acceptable?

Dave

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 03:10 PM

I really think some of you have gone way over the top on this one.
We have lived here for ten years and have been visiting the area for nearly forty.
We came here right through the worst of the troubles, saw the black flags hanging out in the street when the hunger strikers were dying, and spent time at Mullabawn with that huge monstrosity of a watchtower looming over the town and the British helicopters monitoring the activities of the householders with their surveillance equipment. Never once throughout that time have we ever felt anything other than welcome.
What the Cap'n described was banter - pure and simple.
Personally, I regard such comments (and the freedom I have to make them myself) as an acknowledgment that we are part of the community and would be extremely unhappy if we were left out of it.
I can imagine that if I felt in any way insecure and less than welcome living here I might take offence at what was said - as it is, I feel completely at home.
Who knows, maybe things are different in his part of the world, but I'm afraid the phrase 'fart in a thunderstorm' keeps creeping into my mind!
Must go - have a session to attend in town
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Banjiman
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 02:52 PM

Dave, I was careful what I said.... I said when the person IS not offended....not when you hope they won't be offended. Big difference.

Paul

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 02:35 PM

Bernard Manning used to aim his jokes at people he hoped would not be offended. He often got it wrong. I would say, over and over, if it can offend, someone will take offence at it.

I am not saying that I find it offensive or that offensive material should be banned or any such. That is not the point. Just saying that people should realise that comments that may offend should not be treated lightly.

Cheers

Dave

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Banjiman
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 02:21 PM

If the person who it is aimed at is not offended maybe?

As an English person (note the political correctness!) I would not have been offended by the comment made to Dick if it were aimed at me.....I would laugh.

However I wouldn't use the other phrases you list (way) above..... unless I knew the other wouldn't be offended, i.e. I knew the person extremely well.

Choose your own position on this one really.....

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 02:12 PM

BTW - In case anyone had not figured it out the following conclusions can be drawn from the statements I made

1 - Irishmen cannot play concertina
2 - Black men cannot play rock guitar
3 - A Jew cannot play the violin and
4 - Englismen cannot sing.

Every single one of them is not only incorrect but is racial stereotyping with the purpose of getting a cheap laugh.

Can someone tell me please when that is EVER acceptable?

Cheers

Dave

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 02:00 PM

Jim

It's the kind of remark that can be heard at our local session virtually every week - from all sides

If I ever turn up at a session and they start to make racist comments I will leave. May make some people think I am either intollerant or oversensitive but I am neither. I just will not put up with racism in any form.

The list you gave surely depends on the circumstances in which the remark is made.

No it doesn't. Each of those comments contains potential to hurt someone.

Remember the Black and White minstrel show? It may have been 'just a bit of fun' for us white middle classes but it was extremely offensive to many blacks.

Where do we draw the line? Easy. NO racism is acceptable however it is meant.

Cheers

Dave

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Stu
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 12:38 PM

Spot on Dave.

"Do you tell thick Englishman jokes to get your own back?"

The bodhran player from Danu does on the DVD 'One Night Stand'. It reminded me of the lyric in 'Nothing but the Same Old Story'. Ho well, what goes around comes around and what we hate we become (cliché-tastic). I wondered about what it would have been like to be in the audience in Dublin that night, because if I'd been to see an English band and they made an Irish joke I'd be pretty disappointed.

"If you want to take the remark seriously you could put it down to us "t'ick Paddies" getting our own back for the 800-years worth of crap we've had thrown at us."

That's all right then. Haven't we moved on from all this shite? Not everyone in England thinks those 800 years were really our finest hour. What a truly fucked-up bunch of small-minded little Islanders we all are. I'm off to Ireland next year to pick up new bouzouki - here's hoping I don't bump into the racists. Nothing but happy memories of all my visits so far, so I'm looking forward to it, but I might avoid playing my bouzouki until I get back here, where English can play the Irish music they love so much without fear of comment . . .

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Brian Peters
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 12:38 PM

I think this is more to do with the fact that many other nationalities, particularly our nearest neighbours, perceive the English as being an uncultured people with no regard for our own musical traditions. If someone said this to me I'd take it as a compliment, subject to the tone in which it was said.

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: GUEST,John from Kemsing
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 12:35 PM

Cap`n,
       I trust all the responses put your mind at rest that you were being appreciated and congratulated on your performance; a bigger concern is "Who are the loony, politically confused, over-paid, redundant public servants, in need of counselling who decide that every other nationality may be used to describe the status of the respondent on forms, applications and census details except "ENGLISH". One despairs!

p.s. What does one have to do to get your text on here in italics?

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 12:31 PM

Dave,
It's the kind of remark that can be heard at our local session virtually every week - from all sides - I'm sure Dick has lived in Ireland long enough to be aware of that.
The list you gave surely depends on the circumstances in which the remark is made.
If he had overheard it being made behind his back he might have a reason to react like 'Outraged from Ballydehob'; as it is, as far as I'm concerned 'political correctness gone mad or what???'
There was a time when the political situation was such that the remark might well have caused offence - Nowadays there are enough Brits who have settled here in Ireland to make it unnecessary to tip-toe around each other - if not - I'm back to London on the next Ryanair flight.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 12:03 PM

Jim

If you want to take the remark seriously you could put it down to us "t'ick Paddies" getting our own back for the 800-years worth of crap we've had thrown at us.

I'm half Polish. I have never tried to get my own back by telling American jokes. Do you tell thick Englishman jokes to get your own back? Stop it with the whitewash.

Seeing as lots of people seem to be missing the point let me ask a few questions.

Is it OK to say that Noel Hill plays concertina OK for an Irishman?
Is it OK to say Jimi Hendrix was a good guitarist for a black man?
Is it OK to say Yehudi Menuhin plays a mean fiddle for a Jew?
Is it OK to say Dick Miles is a good singer for an Englishman?

Think about it.

Cheers

Dave

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Zen
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 08:54 AM

There are ignorant people everywhere. If she wasn't having a joke then I would just brush it off. As an Irishman with an English accent (I was brought up in London) I've had this occasionally from both sides but it says more about the odd individual than the very great majority of English and Irish people generally.

Zen

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: MartinRyan
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 08:03 AM

Ireland has recently had its first case of a complaint of racist treatment of an English worker in the workplace, upheld.

Regards

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: The Sandman
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 07:58 AM

I am not offended,I am merely pointing out the illogicality,of it being ok to say this to an Englishman,but not to an Irishman.
Jim Carroll,would be the first to condemn[and rightly so],if I turned round to a traveller,and said not bad singing for a traveller,or used the term many Irish people use for travellers ,not bad for a knacker.
now, do you get my point.
Some Irish people need to examine,their attitude to travellers,Englishmen,and groups different to themselves[be it nationality or lifestyle e g travellers].

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: GUEST,plastic cod'ead in the library
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 07:54 AM

I was busking in Galway once and some fella called me a black and tan and said I shouldn't be singing Irish songs if I was an Englishman. I informed him I was actually singing Weel may the keelrow at the time!
"Oh" said he.
"Yes" said I, "I'm singing English songs"

"OK" said he pausing..."Well you shouldnt be singing them here should ya!"

he was a bit mad like

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Mr Red
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 07:33 AM

Now long before the "Irish" (aka Polac etc) joke became fashionable we Blackcountry folk used to tell them about Enoch and Eli who were Blackcountrymen through and through but had no specific geographical affiliations.

And Enoch dain't get the thick end of it allers.
So we wus perlitical korrecked fust. OK?

Mind you in common with the many nearby villages in the UK, Darlaston used to refer to Willenhall in terms of "putting the pig on the wall to see the band go by" - so we wus being ironikul, yea?

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 07:31 AM

could have been worse

could have said, bad even for an Englishman.

I sort of agree with Dick on this one though. theres a statute of limitations on the crimes of the British Empire - and anyway he wasn't personally responsible for Rourkes Drift, Drogheda, the suppression of the Indian Mutiny and Frank Carson's act.

Having said that. i always used to teach my guitar students. Its not a six out of ten instrument. Piano players get six out of ten and they pass an exam and get a cetificate. Make a mistake as a guitarist and everyone will say you're shit. Goes with the territory.

When you are an entertainer - part of the job is that you put your head above the parapet and open youself to criticism. Still its a braver and better thing to try and be than some snotty little excuse for humanity who tries to discomfort you with an untoward remark after you've put in the best performance you can.

hang in there, and bollocks to 'em!

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: MartinRyan
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 07:21 AM

Many years ago, I was at a conference in the North of England during the height of the IRA terrorist campaign. One (mild) symptom of English reaction was the proliferation of "Irish jokes" (and Yes - I do know they've been around a long time!). Anyway, one of the ever polite conference attendees asked me what Irish people did about "these dreadful "Irish" jokes". "They tell them about Kerrymen!" sez I. "And what do the Kerrymen do?" said one. "They put them in books and sell them to Englishmen!", said I.

Now that's slaggin'!

Regards

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 07:06 AM

"It would have been very firmly a case of English racism,"
If you want to take the remark seriously you could put it down to us "t'ick Paddies" getting our own back for the 800-years worth of crap we've had thrown at us.
On the other hand - you could, as Martin suggests, take it as it was almost certainly meant - a bit of 'slaggin'"
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Banjiman
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 07:05 AM

Dick,

You can choose to be offended if you like.....or you can choose to just to laugh it off. It really is up to you.

I think the latter is probably more constructive though.

Paul

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: gnu
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 06:15 AM

Whenever someone said I was not a bad "whatever", I took it as a compliment.

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: GUEST,Betsy at Work
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 06:09 AM

(Was the gig in Ireland, or does that make any difference?)
"...a woman approached me and said I was not a bad singer for an Englishman ".
Your riposte should have been "I'm not bad between the sheets either - fancy getting your kit off?".

If it was in Ireland, let it drop, there's no mileage in this for an English singer, who
(I understand ) does a fair amount of bookings over there.
I can't believe there was any harm meant, it's just backhanded compliment as someone I think has already said.

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 04:52 AM

Exactly, Dick. As I said earlier, if anyone had said that I don't think there would have been one apologist. It would have been very firmly a case of English racism, imperialism or hatred. The sayer of said line would have been rounded upon firmly by many people here and I suspect the thread would have either degenrated into one about 'Bastard Brits' or it would have been closed. I am not going to venture to say why this is.

BTW - For anyone that doesn't know - I was born and bred in England but I am of mixed parentage. Which I guess makes me a true Englishman:-)

Cheers

Dave

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: The Sandman
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 04:38 AM

some of these comments are illogical.
the fact is no one goes up to Christy Moore,or any other irish singer,and says not bad for an Irishman.

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: julian morbihan
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 04:27 AM

We now live in southern Brittany and perform with Breton group. We regularly get surprised comments because we are English!

We take them all as compliments. The nicest I received, from a memeber of another dance group, is that I am "un grand breton de Grande Bretagne" :-)

Salut

Julian

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: MartinRyan
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 03:34 AM

For "making a joke", read "slaggin'"! Ranging in level from gentle mockery to barbed, satirical put-down , it's endemic in Ireland. Probably best read as a backhanded compliment, as suggested earlier.

Regards

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 03:15 AM

I would say she was making a joke - it often happens in Ireland.
Sensitivity about remarks on your singing don't bode well for your entering competitions Cap'n!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Mr Red
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 03:15 AM

Cap'n Birdsong

People who want to thank you don't always prepare. It is genuine emotion.

I can remember a lady telling me (after) she hadn't heard my "Kinittershanty" for 6 years. Which from a professional (Folk Animatuer) was amusing and rewarding. We (Lucy was with me at the time) had only written it 3 years before! It told me that the song had a patina way beyond it's youth, which gave us a nice feeling. And I couldn't dis-abuse her.

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: melodeonboy
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 02:56 AM

'I had an Irish friend who told me that "You don't need an accent to sing a song"'

Mmmm.... How do you sing a song without an accent?

****************************************************************

"Or perhaps she was thinking that English people often seem to have a considerable resistance to letting the music they have in them get out. Which, I would say, seems to be unfortunately true."

Spot-on, that man!

Subject: RE: not bad for an englishman
From: Anne Lister
Date: 29 Sep 08 - 02:37 AM

I've frequently been told that I must be Irish, or that there must be Irish in my ancestry, because of my singing and songwriting.   I take these comments as huge compliments. Most bizarrely, having had the conversation to explain that there is in fact no trace of Irish in my family tree, I was told that in that case "in a past life you must have been Irish".
Probably a fair cop, guv ....
But Dick, the only reasonable response to your experience is to assume she just hadn't met many English people and still fewer who were in any way performers of music. It happens!

Anne