BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress

Subject: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Charley Noble
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 08:21 PM

Not to be an alarmist but this new story certainly raises the spectra of the McCarthy/HUAC subversive witch-hunts of the late 1940's and 1950's.

On Friday's (October 17, U.S. Representative Michele Bachmann (R) of Minnesota told Chris Matthews of MSNBC that the media should investigate members of Congress for their anti-American views:

"What I would say is that the news media should do a penetrating expose and take a look. I wish they would. I wish the American media would take a great look at the views of the people in Congress and find out, are they pro-America or anti-America? I think the American people would love to see an expose like that."

When asked about Sen. Barack Obama's views in particular she said, "Absolutely, I'm very concerned that he may have anti-American views."

Here's a link to this interesting interview and some follow-up stories: Click here for report

Her Democratic opponent with the unlikely name of Elwyn Tinkleberg, has subsequently received over a million dollars from contributions from around the country.

So it goes!
Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 08:51 PM

I remember an anecdote that was circulated around 1940: The officer at the enlistment office asked the young applicant "Are you a member of any organization attempting to overthrow the government of the United States?"

"Yes Sir. I'm a Republican"

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: bobad
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 09:10 PM

I'm curious as to what constitutes an anti-American view.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Charley Noble
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 09:14 PM

Bobad-

If you have to ask...

Then you've made the list!

Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Alice
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 09:29 PM

Bachmann really cooked her goose with that remark. Immediately after saying it on Friday on Matthews' show, the support of her Democratic opponent took off like a rocket. I watched her saying it on Friday and then the rerun of it again today. She looked totally clueless about how off-the-wall it sounded. He gave her a chance to temper the remarks when she started in on the anti-American thing, and she just kept digging herself in deeper.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: john f weldon
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 09:29 PM

Ha! I saw that interview. Americans are very odd.

Several years ago, I was crossing the border to present my films. I had several 35-mm movie films in my suitcase. The border guard asked, in these very words....

"Are these films pornographic, and/or do they advocate the overthrow of the American Government?"

I thought about it for few seconds, then said "no", and they let me across.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: john f weldon
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 09:32 PM

By the way, in the same interview, Pat Buchanan made her seem almost sane by comparison.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 09:35 PM

That's Tinklenberg, which sounds slightly less silly than Tinkleberg.

Michelle Bachmann is an idiot. She has a lot in common with Joe McCarthy. She knows even less about anti-Americanism than McCarthy knew about Communists in government. She can't even define it.

She comes from what was considered a "safe" Republican district. Now, because of the way she's been running her mouth, it's up for grabs. I'm delighted.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Donuel
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 09:40 PM

NO INVESTIGATION REQUIRED YOU CAN TELL BY THE COLOR OF THEIR...


http://www.chicagotribune.com/media/cartoon/2008-10/42990355.jpg



In all candor I watched Chris Matthews set the Congresswoman up to say what she did. It means that she probably thinks she came up with a good idea but was not prepared to go their in the first place.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Rapparee
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 09:46 PM

The Chicago Tribune has endorsed Obama.

When you stick your foot into your mouth the best thing to do is to shut up.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Donuel
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 09:54 PM

you can still talk with your mouth full like Charles Barkley running for Governor... ya might catch athlete's mouth however.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: GUEST,number 6
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 09:58 PM

That crap has been going on for years.

biLL

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Alice
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 09:58 PM

Bachmann, unfortunately, is an example of what the Republicans call their base. Last year, when I was working in Cody, WY, which is Dick Cheney territory, a woman told me that all the "liberals" in Washington should be lined up in front of a firing squad and shot for treason.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: katlaughing
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 10:54 PM

Olbermann or Maddow, can't remember which, tonight, talked about this woman and how that is one more way they are trying to play the "race card." If you are for McCain, you are pro-American, if not you are anti-American and that goes for everyone who is for Obama, esp. city-dwellers, i.e. African Americans...ya know Scary Sarah stresses that it's the little towns who are pro-America. I can't wait to send her back to Alaska.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Peace
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 11:14 PM

Many many Republicans will have the opportunity to discuss anit-Americanism while they're doing time together.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Amos
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 11:16 PM

This is just jingoist mob-whipping insanity, foaming at the mouth. Sarah and Bachmann are jingoistic, provincial bigots who espouse anger and hatred as a way of life and rabble-rousing as a skill-set, button pushing as a substitute for thought and heavy-handed, hamfisted dictatorial authoritarian judgement instead of dialogue between thinking beings. It is to spit.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 11:45 PM

Saw a billboard today with a big picture of an American flag and the words "God, Guns and Guts!"

I had an overwhelming desire to shoot it and smear deer guts on it. I think God would approve.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: katlaughing
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 11:52 PM

Palin was here in Western Colorado, tonight. This response, from one woman who was there with her mother and her own daughter, just about made me gag: "She's a mom, she likes the outdoors, she's has a career, she's a business woman. She's everything an American woman should be these days," Malissa Squires said.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: GUEST,number 6
Date: 20 Oct 08 - 11:57 PM

"I had an overwhelming desire to shoot it and smear deer guts on it. I think God would approve. "

I don't think God, George, Mohammad or whomever would approve.

If you smeared deer guts on it ... you would just be as wacky as the ones who endorse that billboard.

Is this what I'm beginning to see ... two extreme sides completely polarized by fanaticism ... I can appreciate the anger, but try to retain some sanity, keep the peace.

biLL

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 12:22 AM

Surely you mean "God, Guns, and Nuts"

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 12:25 AM

No, the problem isn't "two extreme sides completely polarized by fanatiscm". The problem is that some people take this stuff so seriously that they SEE "two extreme sides completely polarized by fanatiscm" where most people would see an attempt at a joke. Not the greatest attempt in the world, perhaps, but certainly not intended seriously.

I think I'll stay out of political threads. It appears that political discussion has a negative impact on people's senses of humor.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: katlaughing
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 01:01 AM

Well, I guess there are probably those of us who would like to take the "fun" out of "fundamental!":-)

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 07:22 AM

I think we should take the fundament out of fundamental - they are arseholes aren't they?

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Bobert
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 07:31 AM

Open mouth, insert foot...

Bye, bye, Bachmann...

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: GUEST,number 6
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 08:06 AM

I apologize for taking Bee-dubya's post out it's humorous context.

Being a resident of the country north of the U.S. border I should say their are many of us up here watching this carnival election in utmost appall and bewilderment. Much of this can most likely be a result of the news media, but then I come here to the cat and read through these many, many election threads and I am amazed. It does appear there is somewhat fanaticism and polarization of it's people.

I dunno ... but sit back and really think about what is happening. I'm trying to.

biLL

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: kendall
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 08:17 AM

Someone should post an address where we could send a donation to Mr. Tinklenberg.

Her pitiful rant might be funny if it wasn't so serious.
I lived through the McCarthy era, and there was nothing funny about it. That rum soaked bastard ruined many lives with his imagination. He turned good people into sheep who were too yellow to object. Burl Ives trashed Pete Seeger. That was unforgivable. Pete left the Communist party in, I believe, 1943. He served in the Army during WW2. What did Burl Ives or Spangler Arlington Baugh (Robert Taylor) ever do for the country?

Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Charley Noble
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 08:55 AM

Oh, it was only $700,000 that came in within three days as contributions to Tinklenberg, not a million as I posted above. Let's make it a cool million!

Cheerily,
Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Rapparee
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 09:01 AM

Place foot in mouth. Bite down HARD. Pick foot up and try to walk away without limping or screaming.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Big Mick
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 10:13 AM

Donuel on Oct. 20 at 9:40 PM said:
In all candor I watched Chris Matthews set the Congresswoman up to say what she did.

Don, I must strongly disagree. What Matthews did was to stay with a line of questioning on something that the Congresswoman said herself. All too often these interviewers allow these folks to slip little phrases and code words into interviews designed to elicit a knee jerk response, such as "liberal, left wing, anti American", without fully exploring what they meant. I applaud him for not allowing that too happen. Years ago, Gingrich designed a plan that would play off the American trait of intellectual laziness. One of the by products in living in the land of plenty that was post WWII USA, is that we were so self absorbed that we want our issues/answers wrapped up nice and neat in little cliche's so we don't have to do the hard work of being a progressive, and constantly improving society which held promise for all. Gingrich tapped into the "greatest country in the world", "traditional family values", "judeo-christian ethic", ugly American tradition. The evolution of that is what has led to these robo calls, this Congresswoman, and Karl Rovian style tactics. These folks are so deluded that they cannot see that to be a real patriotic American really means to recognize that we are a pluralistic society which revels in the right to hold different views, to debate without being branded, to burn flags without being prosecuted, to disagree with the majority without fear of ostracization, and to carry your political views to the larger middle and see if they fly.

If there were really an investigation of Anti-Americanism in Congress, the intolerant Congresspersons who try to stifle all views but their own would be out on their ear. From my lips to God's ears............

All the best,

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 10:51 AM

See my post above for a link to Elwyn Tinklenberg's web site (or Google him, if you can remember how to spell it). You can donate there.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Charley Noble
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 01:44 PM

Here's the link again for those who would like to raise an even million for Tinklenberg: Click here for website

Cheerily,
Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 22 Oct 08 - 08:26 AM

Latest developments: http://www.twincities.com/ci_10780383

Tinklenberg has made his million.

Bachmann now says she "walked into a trap" when she responded to Chris Matthews' questions.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Oct 08 - 09:01 AM

Mick I of course agree with your overview.

Congresswoman Bachmann was not asked if she knew what HUAC was or who Joseph McCarthy was or what he did or what happened as a result of the HUAC investigations.

If Mathews had asked those questions I am sure she would not have known the answer to any of them. Chris probably knew that so he pressed for an expansion of her opinions of possibly accusing more people than just Barack Obama in Congress of anti Americanism.

Note Chris did not try to make her expand her 'opinion' to include working everyday citizens. Now THAT would have been a game changer.
Bringing the republican anti freedom purge down on everyday people would have opened up a lot of glazed eyes of the general public.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: kendall
Date: 22 Oct 08 - 09:37 AM

Trap my ass! The only trap was the one she was running and nothing but crap coming out of it!
I'll bet she doesn't have a clue who "Tail gunner Joe" was.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Ron Davies
Date: 22 Oct 08 - 09:48 AM

She's not the only one. Foot-in-mouth disease seems to be spreading among McCain supporters. A NC Congressman has said something similar--can't quite remember the details. First denied it, then said he misspoke. Of course-what else?

Perhaps someone can get the details. It was on "First Read" yesterday.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Oct 08 - 09:49 AM

That's my point, she doesn't know tail gunner Joe.

Bachmann initially only wanted Obama investigated by the press for being anti American. Chris Matthews asked questions persistently to make her expand her idea of investigations by the press to include members of Congress.
That leading question was off talking point
but she went for it anyway thinking that it sounded like a good idea.

I am only sorry that Chris did not make this cretin go one step further and ask for all citizens to be investigated for anti Americanism.

She is such an empty suit I bet she would have gone for it.
I think Chris felt as though he was shooting fish in a barrel and backed off when he could have gone in for an Edward R Murrow kill.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Oct 08 - 10:05 AM

Ron The Congressman was from N Carolina and denied he said 'we are the only real americans etc.'

the video surfaced yesterday and was shown by Keith Oberman last night.

Keith rhetoriclt asked "Congressman, how does it feel to be a bald faced liar?

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Charley Noble
Date: 22 Oct 08 - 10:40 AM

Thanks for the update on this story, and I hope it remains just a story and that such Republicans don't get the chance after November 4 to initiate a new set of "Un-American Activities" committees.

Bachmann was selected by the McCain Campaign Committee to appear on MSNBC as a surrogate for McCain or Palin. What a judgment call!

"Tinklenberg"! That name certainly has a ring to it. But is it an American name?

Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Oct 08 - 03:07 PM

Charley

HHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAAA out loud

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Oct 08 - 04:38 PM

I would never call John or Sarah UnAmerican.

Incapable Americans perhaps.

maybe even Inamerican

but not unamerican

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Oct 08 - 05:04 PM

Congresswoman Michelle Bachmann has been left out to dry by the RNC

For her comments on the Matthews show she will be denied any ads paid for by the RNC for her reelection and no RNC funds to go to her campaign.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Donuel
Date: 22 Oct 08 - 05:17 PM

Whew, Chris single handedly just got a nut to be virtually kicked out of Congress.



wow

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Charley Noble
Date: 22 Oct 08 - 09:40 PM

Donuel-

You see, even the RNC evidently has some standards!

Loose lips sink ships, and political campaigns.

Cheerily,
Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Stringsinger
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 05:06 PM

I have been called UnAmerican and to use that term is an extreme pejorative that
demands protest of anyone who uses it.

Sarah Palin and Michelle Bachmann may not be unAmerican but they are bullies and
smear agents of the worst imaginable kind. They are McCarthy reincarnated.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Ron Davies
Date: 24 Oct 08 - 12:30 AM

The other foot-in-mouth victim is Rep Robin Hayes (R-NC). He first denied that he told a NC crowd that "liberals hate real Americans that work and accomplish and achieve and believe in God". Now, having been caught on audiotape saying it, his campaign has admitted it. But, of course, he "misspoke".

Source:   Politico:   21 Oct 2008

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 24 Oct 08 - 12:46 AM

Somehow I find the entire concept of ranting on about "Anti-Americans" indistinguishable from all the previous hysteria about "Commies, Pinkos and Fellow Travellers" and somehow bordering on Fascistic.

Since supposedly the whole POINT of "Americanism" is "FREEDOM OF THOUGHT" - decrying others for thinking differently to oneself is highly hypocritical and manipulative.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Ron Davies
Date: 24 Oct 08 - 12:50 AM

Bingo.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: DougR
Date: 24 Oct 08 - 12:58 AM

Kendall: send your $1.00 contribution to me. I'll see that Mr. Tinklebird gets the donation.

DougR
PO Box Republican
Scottsdale, AZ

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: DougR
Date: 24 Oct 08 - 01:10 AM

Sounds good to me! Shall we start with the two that were principal motivators of the current economic crisis in the U.S.? Chris Dodd and Barney Frank?

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: CarolC
Date: 24 Oct 08 - 03:23 AM

Alan Greenspan has admitted at a Congressional committee hearing that it was all his and the other "free marketers'" fault, and not the fault of Chris Dodd and Barney Frank.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Riginslinger
Date: 24 Oct 08 - 03:55 PM

Yeah, but Greenspan's credibility has been called into question!

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: kendall
Date: 24 Oct 08 - 08:43 PM

What about McCain's rant about Bush?

It's pretty clear to me what happened. Bush appointed Cox chairman of the SEC, the watchdog committee that is supposed to keep the crooks at bay. He failed. Whether he went to sleep or just looked away I don't know, but that is what happened.

Thanks Doug, but I'm sending as much as I can afford to my own democrats who are running for the house and senate.

Senator Collins is chirping about how she wrote the law that now demands that Iraq pay for it's own support via its oil revenues. Great...7 years too late!

She never held a hearing for years while Halliburton stole us blind, and still she is popular here. Go figure.

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Bill D
Date: 24 Oct 08 - 10:57 PM

"Greenspan's credibility has been called into question!"

ummm...you are just joking,,,right? you liked his credibility fine when he was supporting deregulation...

Subject: RE: BS: Investigate Anti-Americanism in Congress
From: Donuel
Date: 24 Oct 08 - 11:02 PM

I heard today that a bank was given bail out funds to finance their hostile takeover of another bank????

this is the plan to save us all?