BS: advice needed for computer purchase

Subject: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Donuel
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 09:59 AM

After a fatal error message the souped up graphics computer I pieced together is dead. fatal error 0x0 etc.

I want to get the last computer of my life and would prefer some sort of ultimate Mac or a totally secure desktop, but I do not have enough information or insight to know what I should get.

So what kind of affordable computer ($2K - $3K more or less) can I get that will not cause anxiety, migraines, rage or premature death?

I don't need to run Renderman or model hydrodynamics or model the liquid iron uranium core of Earth and its magnetic fluctuations and drag on the crust, but I would like a very powerful and fast graphics card and some next generation capabilities.

What should I get?
Where should I go?
New or used?
Holographic display interface?
Touch screen?
OS? Mac, Windows, both?
lap top + desk top enhancements?

As you see by my questions, I am technologicly out of touch but would like my last puter to be a satisfying one.

help me obi one kenobe.

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: GUEST,number 6
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 10:08 AM

One thing I will say is that you certainly don't have to spend $2k-$3k for a good computer.

I will also add that Macs are somewhat over rated and too expensive.


biLL

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: GUEST,number 6
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 10:18 AM

I'm sure many here on the Cat may contest my suggestions here .... but I would say go for a Dell or Gateway.

The reason I suggest these 2 brands are from my own experience and from known experiences from others who own both.

Basically the internal components on all pc brands are the same.

But with that being said, shop around and of course listen to what others have to say.

biLL

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 10:50 AM

I would say if a computer comes with Microsoft Works installed don't touch it with a bargepole - the supplier doesn't know what he's doing!

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: katlaughing
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 10:52 AM

We've bought Dell refurbished which usually means someone just sent back one they bought for whatever reason. We've been quite happy with the ones we'd bought. When a group of us got one for Art Thieme it was Dell. I don't know about the technical details, but I would recommend a Dell, fwiw. I am sure there are several others who will come in and give much more knowledgeable and thorough advice.

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Bill D
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 11:31 AM

Donuel...just go to MicroCenter on Rockville Pike...(by Trader Joe's), and wave your checkbook...

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: EBarnacle
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 02:04 PM

For the past year, lady Hillary and I have been doing most of our work on our laptops. They are more convenient and are portable. The only concessions we make to security other than Avast antivirus is that we do not keep our passwords on the computer. While this requires that we sign in to all of our significant web sites, it also keeps us fairly safe. There are plenty of peripherals available and both speed and hard drive capacity is on a par with desktop units.

Our setup is: three laptops [one in each room], a central desktop to act as the central unit for our printers, scanner and central disk burner, three printers: HP Photosmart, HP color laser and HP black and white laser printer. Our rationale is that for really high quality color printing, we use the photosmart; for high quality black and white, the b/w laser and for general color, the color laser. The negative side of the color laser is that when you print anything, even in black and white, you use color toner. This runs the price way up unnecessarily.

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 02:07 PM

Get a Macbook.

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: bobad
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 02:18 PM

If you have or are getting a Hi Definition (HD) monitor make sure you get a HDCP (Hi Def Compliant) video card - this is the future of internet video.

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Amos
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 02:26 PM

A MacBook Pro will probably fill your needs. You can get them with a fast graphics card and large amounts of RAM. You can connect it to an external monitor for working with large Photoshop, etc., displays, and you can add an external hard drive to make for large amounts of storage and backups of everything.



A

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Ebbie
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 02:30 PM

"The negative side of the color laser is that when you print anything, even in black and white, you use color toner. " EBarnacle

If you set the printer on 'Black and White', is that still true? That's what I do when I don't want a smidgen of color coming through.

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: olddude
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 02:45 PM

Donuel
   ok desk top or notebook,    for a notebook, you can get a very powerful wide screen Toshiba for 600 dollars with Windows 7 on it ... I have one, Love it with the HD 17 inch screen and it has 500 meg hard drive , 4 gig ram yada yada ..

Desktop,anymore they are all the same, get the best buy you can at walmart .. no kidding .. everybody uses the same stuff inside anymore. Use to be Dell had a better box than say a Gateway or HP ... Now I just go with whatever is on sale ...

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Donuel
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 02:59 PM

I have much to look at with your help already but I just saw this interactive interface that looks promising...
LOOK AT THIS!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tr_RgOTum3M



Bill, been there done that, but micro center is not cutting edge.
I didn't even see 3D systems there.

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: GUEST,MG
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 03:16 PM

MY main advice is never ever a Dell. I will not touch them unless I am forced. We got three at work for a major university and all three were toast and service was beyond horrible. I consider it one of my life's mission to keep people from buying Dell. mg

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: MikeL2
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 03:16 PM

hi

FWIW I am a big fan of Sony. I have lots of Sony stuff - TV's - DVD recorders -Camcorder - still cameras HD etc etc.

I also have a small network of a privately built desktop and 3 laptops with all the peripherals.

The laptops are Sony. I have bought them one by one with a year in between each. We are more than happy with the performance. We mainly do photographics and video work on them while the desktop has our business applications on it.

I know that Sony are not the cheapest by any means but we have found them solid reliable and sound.

I have just bought a Sony VPC-F12S1E/B which cost me a little over £1000. The others were less than half this figure, but this is a high spec machine and first impressions are great.

Buying a computer is a bit like buying a guitar. There is a good range of excellent models and the choice is bewildering. You have to choose what suits your own needs best.

Cheers

MikeL2

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Amos
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 03:19 PM

Hell, Donuel, that was 2007!! You could get an iPad for less than a grand, too, which has a lot of that built into it.

A

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Arthur_itus
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 04:06 PM

or you could get a Samsung Galaxy S mobile which does everything. Brilliant mobile and as good as the Iphone.

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Guy Wolff
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 04:57 PM

I love my mac book pro . It does the laundry and the dishes when it finishes up all my daily chores in the pottery .

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Ebbie
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 06:00 PM

Ah! Now I understand people's devotion to the Mac.

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 06:22 PM

"I want to get the last computer of my life"

You only have 5 years to live?

!!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Joe Offer
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 08:50 PM

I went to Staples last week and bought a very nice HP desktop computer with Windows 7 for $479, and then they gave me $50 trade-in for a junk computer. It will be used in at the Women's Center where I volunteer, and I expect it will work very well for about five years. I make higher demands on my computers at home, so I buy better computers and they last me only three years (and then have a second life in a worthy home).

To me, spending $500 every 3-5 years makes a lot more sense than spending much more for a top-of-the-line computer that won't really last much longer.

The only brand I've been thrilled with is Sony Vaio, although my five-year-old Toshiba laptop is still very good to me. But most of the major brands are pretty good. I wouldn't say "don't ever buy such-and-such," except for some of the cheaper brands.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 09:47 PM

I am sure Joe's buy will do the job. No point in buying a machine with bells and whistles that never will be used.

Most businesses use Windows. My daughter has a lovely Apple, but her husband does part of his business from home.
He uses a Dell with Windows and compatable business programs because otherwise he couldn't exchange data with many businesses he has to 'talk' with.
I have good sound programs and a full set of speakers and a lot of disc space, neither Joe nor my son-in-law would have any use for that.

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: olddude
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 10:00 PM

Donuel

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: olddude
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 10:01 PM

Donuel
do you want me to check and see if I can find you a junk? There maybe one over there that works ok ... I can check if you like

Dan

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Amos
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 10:36 PM

Q:

Couldn't exchange data???? Come up to the 21sr century, amigo!!


For one thing a modern mac will run Windows, any flavor you like, and in many case run it faster than a Wintel machine. For another thing, the major office applications are all cross-compatible anymore, especially the ones using XML structure. This whole notion is pretty much an urban legend. There may be some dedicated applications that won't play across the platforms but RTF, Word, Excel, Power POint files zip over and open up happily.


A

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Joe Offer
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 10:38 PM

Well, Q, the computer I bought last week for $479 is about the same as the one I bought a year ago for $700 (last year's computer was Intel, this year's was AMD). Both have good sound, and both have 1-terabyte hard drives. I keep my music collection on the hard drive, and I get terrific sound through my 5.1 channel sound system.
I found it best to partition the hard drive (very easy with Windows 7). I keep my music and data on the second partition.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Amos
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 10:41 PM

"About 40 different Windows applications contain a critical flaw that can be used by attackers to hijack PCs and infect them with malware, says HD Moore, chief security officer at Rapid7 and creator of the open-source Metasploit penetration-testing toolkit. Gregg Keizer reports that the bug was patched by Apple in its iTunes software for Windows four months ago, but remains in more than three dozen other Windows programs, s. Moore did not reveal the names of the vulnerable applications or their makers, however. Each affected program will have to be patched separately. Moore first hinted at the widespread bug in a message on Twitter on Wednesday. 'The cat is out of the bag, this issue affects about 40 different apps, including the Windows shell,' he tweeted, then linked to an advisory published by Acros, a Slovenian security firm."

SlashDot

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Donuel
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 11:27 PM

Good advice and fascinating options all. Interesting printer info too.

A Mac book pro with extra screen HD or 3D (the 3D interactive does away with a key board and mouse ) and external storage,HD 3D video & graphic cards peripherals, a blueray R&W drive etc. sounds excellent and secure.

The wasted time and big money to hacking, malware and robo take overs amounts to home invasion. But alas we have no police, unless we pay someone we don't know for security that plays catch up at best.

If it lasts 5 years it will have lasted 3 more years than what we had.

old dude Dan,
that is a very kind offer but I easily despair at losing data and time.

A junk sounds exotic though;
sail away sail away
in a chinese junk out on the bay
sail away sail away
a Mac book pro might save the day.


PS
I think my 10 year old vistited some hacking sites so he could hack his Wii for some reason. The McAfee or Norton probably expired so the entire computer expired possibly from a kid who thrills at costing people $800 dollars of damage with several key strokes.
Whatever happened to flaming bag of dog poo? I bet billions are lost to hacking and malware, and the computer companies LOVE IT.

I repeat the computer companies love selling replacement computers due to computer invasions. They have little motivation to stop invasions.

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Amos
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 11:38 PM

My last Mac lsted well over five years. The one I use now is the last of the Power PC chipset models, serial number XB3510NENVB, from 2005, I think. A good five years and still trucking.


A

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Amos
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 11:40 PM

COrrection:

"Build Country:        - Your Mac was built in Sacramento, CA, USA.

Build Year:        - Your Mac was built in 2003.

Build Week        - Your Mac was built in week 51 of that year (December).

Production Nr.:        - Your Mac was number 762 to be built that week"

So it's nearly seven years old.


A

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: kendall
Date: 20 Aug 10 - 12:58 PM

*I will never own another PC. Vista sucks, and that's only one of the bugs.

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: olddude
Date: 20 Aug 10 - 01:04 PM

I like Linux for home use. Just does everything I need and I don't worry about viruses and such

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 20 Aug 10 - 02:30 PM

Amos, tell that to the businesses that my son-in-law has to deal with.
As I posted, my daughter has a Mac with all the bells and whistles, and Windows, and it will not handle some of the technical data programs used by petroleum businesses here.

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Amos
Date: 20 Aug 10 - 02:40 PM

I think I mentioned that some dedicated or custom applications built around earlier WIndows environments might not. I would be surprised to find anything you could run on Vista (which sucks) or Win 7 would not run just fine on the Intel Mac Windows emulator.

A

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: MikeL2
Date: 20 Aug 10 - 02:57 PM

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Joe Offer - PM
Date: 19 Aug 10 - 08:50 PM

hi joe

<" To me, spending $500 every 3-5 years makes a lot more sense than spending much more for a top-of-the-line computer that won't really last much longer. The only brand I've been thrilled with is Sony Vaio.>

I agree with you to some extent. As I said below we have 3 Sony Viao's now. I paid about £500 for the first two. We are very pleased with them both.
This time I went for a top performace machine with the latest i7 Intel processor and oodles of RAM and Hard Disk...plus all the High Definition Graphics because my hobby along with my wife is photography and videography.

I know all the stories about Mac v PC and there are "experts" in both camps who will praise one and lash the other.

I don't know about in the US but here in the UK generally Mac costs more than PC for like-to-like facilities.

But like I said earlier you pays your money and you makes your choice.

I am happy with my new Viao and although I haven't explored and exploited all it's capablilities, so far it looks just what I wanted.

I did really want to go to Mac this time but when I did my sums and looked at the pros & cons I came out almost even on choice but went back to PC because I know it so well.

Cheers

MikeL2

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Donuel
Date: 23 Aug 10 - 08:39 PM

Can you imagine if you were able to exploit all the functions and capabilities of your computer. Its like the old saying that we use only 3 to 7% of our brain.

Like the ongoing Random Traces thread it would be great if fellow videographers and animators shared their exploits and failures on one thread here. I have seen some original work here but it comes in seperate bits and pieces.


I haven't bought a mac yet but will wait for some seasonal sales.


IS THERE ANYTHING I SHOULD SCAVAGE FROM THE DEAD COMPUTER BEYOND THE VIDEO GRAPHICS CARD ? to put in a different PC of course.

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 23 Aug 10 - 11:50 PM

The drives - optical, hard, floppy, maybe power supply - can always use it to run garden lighting, battery charger, etc - you need a slight external mod to make them start, but that's on the net ...

The case can make a good letter box ...

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 24 Aug 10 - 05:22 AM

For what it's worth, I've got a reasonably high spec. Advent PC which I bought in a sale from PC World (UK) about 18 months ago. It's fine except for a rather noisy fan - and I had to buy a wi-fi dongle thingy. I've also got a Toshiba laptop for when I want portabilty.

These two computers do everything that I want to do, and the only limits seem to be my technical capabilities.

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 24 Aug 10 - 05:39 AM

Oh the fans are useful for all sorts of things too ...

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: Stu
Date: 24 Aug 10 - 06:25 AM

" Vista (which sucks) or Win 7 would not run just fine on the Intel Mac Windows emulator."

Actually, you can a Mac run Windows natively not via an emulator if you install on a separate volume, so everything that runs on windows will run on a mac using the windows OS.

I use my mac for hi-end motion graphics, video and 3D and I've now had the same Mac for over five years and it still does what I need so it's a reliable option. The new iMacs are fantastic and the 27" i7 is a powerful machine and a triumph of industrial product design, and is worth a look if you don't need portability.

I've used PC's alongside macs over the years and I think it comes down to personal preference - the idea that one is superior to the other is largely rubbish (unless you take design into account . . . in which case no contest - mac wins) and although macs are expensive they actually deliver equivalent bang for buck. I want to get on with creating and doing so a mac suits that ethos, were I compulsive fiddler with settings or a gamer then a PC might be more my thing. In truth, there's not a lot to choose between the two in terms of working within the programs themselves.

Subject: RE: BS: advice needed for computer purchase
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 24 Aug 10 - 08:09 AM

Computers have become sufficiently "commoditized" that most makers (and sellers) rely almost entirely on quantity sales of "whatever is popular." It has become quite difficult to find a maker that offers customized hardware, or even much choice in common components beyond RAM and HD sizes.

One of the few places where it still is sometimes possible to find discussion of features you might want to consider for a really personal setup is in the DIY columns still occasionally published or posted by the "tech magazine" trades.

I haven't kept track of where the up to date builders are hanging out, but a possible starting place might be Extreme Tech. They've been posting "sample builds" for several years, and some of the articles probably are badly out of date; but with a bit of poking about you might find some good advice on what you can get if you know what to ask for. You may be able to use the site search tool to isolate the kind(s) of things you're interested in.

You might get lucky if you just Google "DIY Computers" too.

Once you know what you want in a new machine, you might even be able to get one of the better known sellers to "spec one" to what you want, instead of just pushing you to play the latest games and watch TV on your new toy.

(My last new computer was built to my spec by a trusted maker; but unfortunately I can't recommend them because they filed bankruptcy and disappeared about 5 years ago.)

John