BS: Language Pet Peeves

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Senoufou
Date: 09 Jul 22 - 03:03 AM

Hee hee Doug, I was thoroughly ashamed of myself. Maybe it was 'karma'. When I was a primary schoolteacher, if a pupil made a spelling mistake I often made them write the word down correctly perhaps twenty times.
Now that my husband and I don't live together, we communicate in French via e mails. My laptop doesn't seem to accept this, and every single word I type is underlined in red. It makes the text look as if it's covered in blood! Also, my keyboard doesn't 'do' accents such as acute, grave, cedilla etc. It looks like the composition of a 'bottom-group' first-year pupil to me!

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: BobL
Date: 09 Jul 22 - 03:49 AM

Would an AZERTY keyboard help?

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Senoufou
Date: 09 Jul 22 - 04:07 AM

Sorry Bob, I don't know what that is. I'm the biggest idiot where Internet technology is concerned!

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 09 Jul 22 - 04:19 AM

AZERTY. You could probably tell your computer that your existing keyboard has an AZERTY layout but I think you would need to be able to touch type with that layout to use it.

Your email program may well allow you to add a French dictionary for spelling checks.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 09 Jul 22 - 04:43 AM

Sen,
Try typing it in Microsoft Word, if you have it, then copy and paste into your email. The proofing language can be selected and accents are easily entered using keyboard shortcuts. I could send you the list of keyboard shortcuts by PM if that would help.

DC

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Senoufou
Date: 09 Jul 22 - 05:02 AM

You're all very kind, but it's all I can manage to turn the blooming laptop on! Funnily enough, my errant husband, who is very techno-savvy, types without using accents, and his French isn't as good as mine (boast). But as his first language is Malinke, I use that as well. (My Malinke vocabulary is rather limited, but I manage.)
I'm far too pedantic, without starting on other languages as well.
Thank you all for your offers of technological help, but it would be like trying to teach a dog to quote Shakespeare!

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: meself
Date: 10 Jul 22 - 01:11 AM

In what I believe the TV newspeople call "the crawl" - that moving strip of text at the bottom of your screen on some news shows - an item today on one of our (Canadian) national broadcasters began as follows: "61% of Canadians think Canada is on the wrong track, as opposed to the right one, when it comes to ...." I, for one, appreciated that clarification!

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Mrrzy
Date: 11 Jul 22 - 06:02 PM

Still snickering over Steve Dhaw and his secret yank.

"Woman dies after drowning." No, woman drowns.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Jul 22 - 06:14 PM

I often read stuff such as "he married his wife in 1982...". So he married her twice then...just to make sure...?

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 12 Jul 22 - 07:43 AM

Right, then, a fresh peeve: the use of "best ever" when what is meant is "best yet", notably in the context of the first James Webb telescope picture. The expression "best ever" is two-sided, and suggests there'll never be another one at least as good, let alone even better, in due course.

I accuse NASA, in the press release, with an advertising meme.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 12 Jul 22 - 08:58 AM

You've clearly never eaten an M&S Best Ever prawn sandwich...

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Lighter
Date: 12 Jul 22 - 10:23 AM

Don't confuse "best ever known" with "eternally best."

Oxford recognizes no less than eight numbered senses of the word "ever."

Fascinating.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 12 Jul 22 - 01:15 PM

.... On reflection, perhaps someone conflated "best yet" with "first ever"; quite possibly me. I've got chronically mischievous ears, which are an everlasting source of amusement and material for a punslinger (and hell on wheels to anybody else in range).

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Mrrzy
Date: 14 Jul 22 - 07:43 AM

And firsts aren't firsts till there is a second.

Right now we have a Pope Francis. When there is a second one, this one will become Francis I.

As Encyclopedia Brown pointed out, it wasn't the first battle of Bull Run till there was a second one.

What you have, until there is a second, is an Only.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: meself
Date: 14 Jul 22 - 11:59 AM

How about "The First Annual ..."? And, perhaps, not quite as black-and-white, but news reports are always telling us about 'historic' events that happened five minutes ago or are about to happen - seems a little unfair not to let History decide what is historic ....

"until there is a second, is an Only" - That thought always crosses my mind when there is a report of "the first woman to be appointed ... ", etc. ... but I think we've lost that one.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Lighter
Date: 14 Jul 22 - 02:10 PM

So "the only woman to be appointed" doesn't imply anything about the future, but the "first woman..." does?

By the reasoning in previous posts, "only" should imply there'll never be another.

Just as "first" allegedly implies there will be another.

I say we can't tell the future and both words are equally (il)logical and (in)correct.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Senoufou
Date: 15 Jul 22 - 02:13 PM

I was doing a crossword this morning and one of the answers was 'dado'. It started me off giggling because I remembered a friend many years ago at a village bingo. All of us ladies were sat round a table, and during the interval, she announced loudly, "My husband has been putting up a DILDO rail in the hall!" There were shrieks of laughter all round, and someone had to explain to her what a dildo was.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Lighter
Date: 16 Jul 22 - 11:44 AM

This is so embarrassing, I hate to report it, but it just shows what can happen.

My grandmother was born in NYC in the 1880s. When she was in her 70's, she'd usually call the store to have groceries delivered.

When she talked to the butcher, she'd usually ask if the meat was "well hung."

This meant nothing to me as a child, but I was curious about what it meant.

She said that when she was a girl (around 1900) someone had told her that "You should always ask the butcher if his meat is well hung."

Decades later, I still cringe for her. I wish I could have croaked out a warning!

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: meself
Date: 16 Jul 22 - 06:23 PM

Oh, no! Now I'm thinking of things my grandparents would say that were double-entendres to the debauched generation of their grandchildren ... and wondering if they too were the victims of cruel pranks ... ! For that matter, I'd better review my own habitual turns-of-phrase ....

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: BobL
Date: 17 Jul 22 - 03:00 AM

My generation held that there were two hymns unsuitable for weddings, one being "Fight the Good Fight."
The other, now consigned to history, was an advent hymn based on the parable in Matthew 25 of the wise & foolish bridesmaids:
"Behold the Bridegroom cometh in the middle of the night..."

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: leeneia
Date: 28 Jul 22 - 04:36 PM

New topic. I just came across a YouTube video on the deaths of organized criminals, and the video proved to be a treasure trove of a particular peeve of mine - mealy-mouthed euphemisms that cover up the horror of crimes. Here's a list; I don't think I need to explain.

hit
hitman
rackets
took him for a drive
capo
lieutenant
enforcer
outfit
gunman
crime boss
took out
protection

============
To back up some, after an animal is butchered, it needs to be hung up for a while under refrigeration.

https://greatbritishmeat.com/blogs/butchers-blog/hanging-meat

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: meself
Date: 28 Jul 22 - 07:52 PM

I wouldn't call those "mealy-mouthed euphemisms" - some of them are just underworld slang, and some are just - well, what's a better term for "crime boss"? "Former president", maybe? Or for "gunman" - "Second Amendment Activist"?

However, it does bring to mind a peeve of mine: journalists using underworld or street slang in otherwise straight-ahead reporting; e.g., "The bust went down this morning ..." (yes, I heard that on TV news).

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Senoufou
Date: 29 Jul 22 - 02:54 AM

BobL you really made me laugh with those two hymns which aren't suitable for weddings! I nearly choked on my morning cup of tea! Haahaaahaaaaaaagh!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: meself
Date: 30 Jul 22 - 02:16 PM

On American news shows, which I've watched far too much of over the last six years or so, far-right Democrats like Manchin and Sinema are called 'moderate Democrats' - so what are Democrats like Biden: 'extremists'? 'radicals'? 'militants?

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Mrrzy
Date: 19 Sep 22 - 08:57 AM

Ok, the Queen's ceremony cannot culminate in something that is to be followed by something else.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 19 Sep 22 - 11:42 AM

And we've had quite a lot of "And now the coffin is lying at rest." Gosh, it must have been exhausting for the poor old coffin, lugging the Queen around for days and getting stared at!

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 19 Sep 22 - 11:57 AM

Quote from Liz Truss's Bible reading at THAT funeral: "If ye hath seen me, ye hath seen my Father also..."

Well I didn't know that his father was called Also! Makes sense, as Zarathustra's first and middle names were Also and Sprach. Also Sprach Zarathustra! I know this because I saw it on an album sleeve AND on the credits after 2001: A Space Odyssey!

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Mrrzy
Date: 22 Sep 22 - 08:32 PM

And it was a coffin. Not a casket. Apparently this matters.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 22 Sep 22 - 08:52 PM

Matters to to whom? As it was covered by the royal standard, not many people would know which one it was.

DC

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Senoufou
Date: 23 Sep 22 - 05:16 AM

After grinding my teeth at the words 'chester draws' on a website for mums, I've now just seen 'I need a rest bite' !!

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 23 Sep 22 - 06:18 AM

”And it was a coffin. Not a casket. Apparently this matters.”

Aaaahh, the old issue of ‘two nations divided by a common language’ rears its head once more! In the UK, where we tend to be less squeamish than the US about such things, the wooden box which contains the corpse is usually referred to as a ‘coffin’ - I don’t ever recollect hearing anyone here refer to it as a ‘casket’.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 23 Sep 22 - 06:47 AM

I'm very old-fashioned. I still call it a cist.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Senoufou
Date: 23 Sep 22 - 06:56 AM

"It's not the cough that carries you off. It's the coffin they carry you off in."

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Senoufou
Date: 23 Sep 22 - 10:58 AM

I've just been looking at that website again, and now some woman has written "I'm playing devil's avocado." That made me giggle.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 23 Sep 22 - 06:54 PM

"Will glass coffins ever catch on?"

"Remains to be seen..."

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 24 Sep 22 - 01:24 AM

The answer to the ‘coffin or casket’ conundrum seems to be explained here…

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: mayomick
Date: 21 Apr 23 - 07:32 AM

Dominic Raab's "bullying" of senior civil servants. Bullying transformed from something kids do or have done to them in the playground and applied nowadays to professional boxers, policemen   members of the armed forces etc. when suing for compensation . Sergeant Major X, for instance , complaining to the employment tribunal about how he was constantly bullied while going about his duties.(I'm not trying to defend Dominic Raab's intimidation of civil servants).

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Mrrzy
Date: 21 Apr 23 - 11:29 AM

And what ever happened to Bully for you?

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 21 Apr 23 - 12:58 PM

> Bullying transformed from something kids do or have done to them in
> the playground

Some playground bullies never grow up. Belittle it not: I've been on the receiving end in my working life.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Lighter
Date: 21 Apr 23 - 01:19 PM

We had a notable one as 45th president.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Donuel
Date: 21 Apr 23 - 10:39 PM

Sweet dreams are made of this
Who am I to disagree?
I travel the world and the seven seas
Everybody's looking for something

[Verse 1]
Some of them want to use you
Some of them want to get used by you
Some of them want to abuse you
Some of them want to be abused

[Chorus]
Sweet dreams are made of this
Who am I to disagree?
I travel the world and the seven seas
Everybody's looking for something

[Bridge]
(Hold your head up, keep your head up) movin' on
(Hold your head up) movin' on, (keep your head up) movin' on
(Hold your head up) movin' on, (keep your head up) movin' on
(Hold your head up) movin' on, (keep your head up)

Churlish bullies have an intent to cause harm. I know one frustrated by his inability to cause harm.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 22 Apr 23 - 03:35 AM

Your silly and sad obsession is what's causing you the most harm, old chap.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 22 Apr 23 - 05:09 AM

"Filmic." Just heard a radio pundit describing a piece of music thus. What a horribly pretentious word!

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: weerover
Date: 22 Apr 23 - 05:42 AM

"Filmic" is a word whose meaning (and sometimes nuances) are clear, and it does appear in Chambers Dictionary, which I consider a reasonable authority. I am a retired high school teacher of English and some neologisms (and non-words) make me squirm, but I think this one works.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 22 Apr 23 - 05:58 AM

The meaning of ‘Filmic’ is very easy to work out. It is defined also in M-W and the Cambridge Dictionary. Good enough for most people, I would imagine. Certainly good enough for me…

Merriam-Webster

Cambridge University Press

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 22 Apr 23 - 05:58 AM

What a horribly pretentious word!

I agree that "filmic" is an ugly word but why pretentious? Filmic simply means related to films whereas "cinematic" expresses the feeling of film as an art form. Surely this would be the more pretentious word.

DC

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 22 Apr 23 - 07:28 AM

Well we'll have to agree to differ on this one. Perhaps one day someone will tell me what music is filmic and what isn't. Rach 2 was used all through Brief Encounter but it wasn't written to go with a film. So is it filmic, and, if so, what makes it so? Mozart, Piano Concerto no 21, Elvira Madigan? Beethoven 9, Clockwork Orange? On the surface of it, the words meaning is clear, as you've both said. It's not the definition, it's the application. Now tell me what criteria are used to apply it to music...

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 22 Apr 23 - 07:33 AM

By the way, I never use "cinematic" either. I can agree on that one. Another daft word is "biopic." And I don't get "best picture" at the Oscars either. It's a film, or, far better, a movie. (I'm on your side there, yanks - Mrs Steve isn't!). And oop north, we'd go to the flicks, but we didn't say "I'm going to see a flick."

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: MaJoC the Filk
Date: 22 Apr 23 - 08:35 AM

Peeve Alert: "iconic". I take the view that something so described has been painted over so many times to refresh the colours that the original is completely obscured.

Subject: RE: BS: Language Pet Peeves
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 22 Apr 23 - 09:44 AM

Speaking of the Oscars, I note that they still use the outmoded and sexist word "actress." It's about we dragged ourselves into the 21st century and dropped all these "esses." Hostess, waitress, stewardess...yuk! And while we're at it, heroine!