BS: Re. The Separation Of Sudan

Subject: BS: Re. The Separation Of Sudan
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 08 Jan 11 - 07:37 AM

I hope and pray the separation of Sudan goes peacefully, and that similar occurs in the Holy Lands For Peace.

Subject: RE: BS: Re. The Separation Of Sudan
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 08 Jan 11 - 02:21 PM

Separation would be a first step. Divisions among the groups in the south are a complication.

Subject: RE: BS: Re. The Separation Of Sudan
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 09 Jan 11 - 04:58 AM

So they'll need positive nationalism - accepting some regional diversity; and, perhaps, some help from the U.N., yes?

Subject: RE: BS: Re. The Separation Of Sudan
From: Charley Noble
Date: 09 Jan 11 - 10:45 AM

There is little doubt that the Southern Sudanese will vote overwhelming for independence. Hopefully the agreement for continued sharing of oil revenues with the North will mitigate further Northern intervention and violence.

I do wonder what the name of the new country will be. I don't think they'll want to be known as the Southern Sudan.

Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Re. The Separation Of Sudan
From: Charley Noble
Date: 09 Jan 11 - 10:56 AM

Here's a link to what the different parts of the Southern Sudan are called now: click here for map and discussion

I note that there will be two more referenda in 2011 to determine if three other small adjacent areas will opt to join the South or remain with the North.

Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Re. The Separation Of Sudan
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 09 Jan 11 - 03:09 PM

There also is some question as to whether the south can remain together, Several groups there that don't mesh well.
I guess that only time will tell, to use the cliche.

Animist and Muslim religions in the majority, Christians in the minority, accordind to the Wikipedia article linked by Charley.

Subject: RE: BS: Re. The Separation Of Sudan
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 09 Jan 11 - 03:47 PM

Events of the past twenty years or so lead me to believe that the multi-religio/ethnic nation-state will become a thing of the past.

I do not see a consolidation into a one or two world earth; I see a division back to what is essentially tribalism. For instance the sundering of nations in central and eastern Europe along ethnic and religious group ties has already occurred. Africa has the problem of Sudan (this thread), Eritrea and other problem areas...e.g. I'm not sure the Tutsi/Hutu problem is fully resolved. In Iraq, Druze, and Assyrians would welcome separation from the general Moslem populace. Some Druze would like to incorporate parts of Turkey and Syria, wherein reside large numbers of their fellow Druze. Of course, we've discussed the Israel/Palestine problem ad nauseum.

Political pundits speak of the USA as a nation divided, and some think Mexico is yearning to reclaim the southwest United States. Indian tribes are considered sovereign nations immune from much Federal, State and local control of the area surrounding them.

Quebec periodically rattles the sabre of secession from English speaking Canada.

While the list is not complete, nor is tribalism likely to reach its apex in my lifetime (what's left of it), I believe it to be a real possibility.

Subject: RE: BS: Re. The Separation Of Sudan
From: pdq
Date: 09 Jan 11 - 04:28 PM

Perhaps the southern portion of Sudan should be annexed by Ethiopia.

It has most of Sudan's oil and Ethiopia could use the money.

The resulting state should also try to get a serious port since both are landlocked, although the eastern part of Ethiopia is actually not that far from the sea. Perhaps purchase the port and a corridor to it?

Subject: RE: BS: Re. The Separation Of Sudan
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 09 Jan 11 - 05:40 PM

China and Malaysia have the major interest in Sudanese oil reserves. China would have the money to purchase port access (Djbouti?), But adding southern Sudan to Ethiopia would be adding ethnic problems that Ethiopia could well do without.

China, with its recent multibillion dollar investments in the Alberta tar sands, may be looking in another direstion.

Subject: RE: BS: Re. The Separation Of Sudan
From: Charley Noble
Date: 09 Jan 11 - 08:46 PM

pdq-

"Perhaps the southern portion of Sudan should be annexed by Ethiopia."

Not a great idea as you probably already know.

Ethiopia does not need another war and that's exactly what they'd get if they tried to annex the Southern Sudan. The current Ethiopian government would not be tempted by such an adventure, given how badly they got mauled in Somalia.

Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Re. The Separation Of Sudan
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 12:15 PM

...but I wonder if these events are leading more Christian and Muslim Ethiopians to consider separation..?

Subject: RE: BS: Re. The Separation Of Sudan
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 01:25 PM

Ethiopia
Christians 63%
Muslims 34%

Christians in the majority, why would they separate?
Relations with Muslims generally good despite past civil wars and despite agitators. Economy growing.

Subject: RE: BS: Re. The Separation Of Sudan
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 06:29 PM

Fighting has erupted in Abyei province, which has oil reserves.
An item in the Canadian press on whether it will remain part of Sudan or joins an independent south; to be decided in negotiations that are stalled.
President Al-Bashir warns that war might break out if tribes in the region unilaterally declare their province a part of the south.

Reported by Aljazeera yesterday.

Subject: RE: BS: Re. The Separation Of Sudan
From: Charley Noble
Date: 10 Jan 11 - 07:13 PM

Unlike many other tension spots in the world the Southern Sudan is under a whole lot of international scrutiny. It would be nice to believe that will tip the balance to a peaceful outcome after the voting.

I'd love to discuss Ethiopia more but that is best done on a separate thread. Ethiopia is not a major player in what happens in the Southern Sudan but it has been a haven for refugees in the past.

Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: Re. The Separation Of Sudan
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 11 Jan 11 - 07:17 AM

"Why?", Q, as above, "For Peace" (WAV).