BS: 'It'... who has it?

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: olddude
Date: 29 Jul 11 - 11:24 AM

OMG, OMG , Spaw, thank you I needed that laugh

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: catspaw49
Date: 29 Jul 11 - 11:20 AM

"John Wright had 'it' a brilliant sage presence."

He did? Geeziz, how bad is that? Christalmighty, the last thing I'd want is to be wandering around smelling like a Turkey Dinner or something. Even if he smells like sausage gravy who the hell would want folks to be coming up and wiping your body with biscuits? I figure he must be some kind of pervert or somethin'.


Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: A Wandering Minstrel
Date: 29 Jul 11 - 07:54 AM

You've either got,
(or you have not)
that certain thing
that makes them cling
But if the boys don't seem to fall for you
There's just no hope at all for you
You'll never hit,
(Give up and quit!)
if you have not got IT!

(Bennie and the Girls - The Desert Song)

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: I don't know
Date: 29 Jul 11 - 05:29 AM

John Wright had 'it' a brilliant sage presence.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Smedley
Date: 29 Jul 11 - 05:29 AM

Kenneth Tynan (the British theatre critic & general 'commentator') used to write about "high-definition performance", and this comes pretty close to the IT we're talking about here. He listed, among many others, Dietrich, Noel Coward, Muhammad Ali, Eric Morecambe....

Some good suggestions made here (though I boggled at a few - Richard Branson???). I'd throw in a few more:

Mariza
Estrella Morente
Martin Luther King
Martina Navratilova (playing tennis, sadly a bit dull off the court)
David Bowie
John Lydon
Eric Cantona
Ken Dodd
Margaret Thatcher (and I sooooooo wish she hadn't, but she did)

And returning to the start of the thread, Amy W undoubtedly had it.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 29 Jul 11 - 05:15 AM

It is funny how people see things differently about Harleys etc. I know someone who describes it as riding an armchair therefore not for real biking, but it still turns heads nevertheless. Bill D I see what you mean about the Vincent Black Shadow it was a beautiful bike. As I see it people with the It factor are still mentioned long after they are gone. Audrey Hepburn had It as far as I was concerned, more so in later years when she did a lot of humanitarian work.

The reason I think Jagger/Lennon and some of the others lost it in the 70s was because of the excesses of their hedonistic lifestyles they became as artificial as everyone else.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: catspaw49
Date: 28 Jul 11 - 08:39 PM

I knew a guy who really had IT but he took some penicillin shots and was able to get rid of IT.............Shitfire, I know I don't want it but seems that some of you do so don't forget if you change your mind to see a Doc...................


Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 28 Jul 11 - 08:31 PM

In 1927, when Clara Bow established her nickname as The "It" Girl, I'm pretty sure "it" meant sex appeal—but you couldn't say "sex" openly in those days, so they called it "it." Sex was something only doctors wrote about, and their books were sold under-the-counter in plain brown wrappers, and even so, the language involved a lot of circumlocution.

Around the same time, Mae West wrote and starred in a play called "Sex" and it was closed down for obscenity.

I don't think there was ever meant to be any mystery about what "it" was.

Today you should be able to say anything you want in plain language, at least if you're trying to explain why you like a certain performer.

Of course you might not know the correct words, but that's one good reason to read criticism.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Bill D
Date: 28 Jul 11 - 12:30 PM

Harleys? Bonnevilles?

I think the Vincent_Black_Shadow had 'it'.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Donuel
Date: 28 Jul 11 - 11:56 AM

Producers are always in search of the IT girl. When the it fades, they exit.

We all need it, for life as we know it, to exist.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: olddude
Date: 28 Jul 11 - 10:10 AM

Got it once, but a shot of Penicillin cured it

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: kendall
Date: 28 Jul 11 - 08:31 AM

Did you know that Harley Davidson is building a new computer? It will be released as soon as they figure a way to make it leak oil.

And make a lot of unnecessary noise.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 28 Jul 11 - 08:18 AM

I've never heard Keith Richard sound as if he knew which planet he was on much less the time of day or what he was talking about.

But it's an interesting point about Harley Davidsons and (while I disagree about their having "it", Bonnies). The Harley is a sort of tractor with two wheels. The Bonnie is one of the bikes that went furthest to create the credo of unreliable British bikes. Yet some parties to this argument persist in defining "it" by reference to technical ability.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 28 Jul 11 - 05:32 AM

Keith Richards has It, he shouldn't but he has. He sounds sometimes like he should have died a long time ago but when he plays or talks indepth about other musicians he really knows what he is talking about.

Does it have to be just people? In my book Harley Davisons have it and Bonnevilles have it too especially in black and chrome.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 28 Jul 11 - 04:42 AM

I think Jagger had it in the 60s, but had lost it by the 70s. I've never heard of quite a number of those on Ms Cornish's list. I often thought that Virna Lisi had more "it" than Sophia Loren - as long as she was not required to act. Also Capucine, and she could act too.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Janie
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 07:24 PM

Are you talking about stage presence? If so, Mick Jagger (at least in the late 70's) definitely had "it", live. But I never thought his "it" projected very well through the TV or movie screen.

Bill Clinton.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 06:41 PM

What about these people with the "I Found It" bumperstickers?

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: gnu
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 04:37 PM

Oh! "That". I had it but I lost it. I looked for it for a while but I gave up on it.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 04:37 PM

Garbo ~~ Dietrich ~~ Boris Karloff

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 03:23 PM

And yes, Virginia Tam has It too, most definitely! :0)

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 03:22 PM

Bruce Murdoch has It
Ron Bankley has It
Dan O'Connell has It
JT Oglesby has It
Tom Jones has It
John Jones has It
Chopper has It
Oliver Schroer had It
Duncan McFarlane has It
Johnny Depp has It
Russell Brand has It
Dougie MacLean has It
Patch Adams has It
Chief Oren Lyons has It
John Trudell has It
Splitting the Sky has It
Russell Means has It
Amy Winehouse had It
Shirley Bassey has It
Miranda Sykes has It
Martyn Joseph has It
Jens Stoltenberg has It
Marilyn Monroe had It
Gina Lollabrigida had It
Sophia Loren hasIt
Clark Gable had It
Errol Flynn had It
Danny Kaye had It
Deva Premal and Miten have It
Johnny Cash had It
Bruce Springsteen has It
Ghandi had It
The Dalai Lama has It
Deborah Harvey has It
Reg Meuross has It


The list is endless.....

It is the ability to stand above 'the rest' without even knowing you do. It is a Magic that fizzes out of an Individual, a Natural
Talent which holds others Utterly Spellbound........

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 03:08 PM

I can think of a few people here on mudcat who have "IT"

IT - Information Technology

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 03:00 PM

Well Tony Bennett thought Amy Winehouse had "it" http://www.thirdage.com/news/amy-winehouse-was-extraordinary-says-tony-bennett_0

"IT" is subject to perspective. I thought as did many other people that my daughter Andie had "IT" Some people think I have "IT".

Simon Cowell and the X Factor, Pop Idol, Everyones' Got Talent cronies think some have "IT" that I think are pure rubbish.

I can think of a few people here on mudcat who have "IT"

Next question.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: pdq
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 02:41 PM

Charlie Sheen has "it", but they put him on heavy antibiotics.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: gnu
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 02:16 PM

Tom has it. Ted Williams taught it to him. Mind you, being a HUGE man helps. At 1.75m, I can finesse a salmon fly quite a distance but Tom was a joy to watch. Not as good as Ted, but he certainly has it.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 02:04 PM

A lot of "it" is luck.

If someone else had been cast in "the graduate", we would have been spared a lot of miscast Dustin Hoffman performances.

Like wise, if Tom Selleck had been able to do Indiana Jones as he was originally cast there may have been a mustache on Air Force One.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Bill D
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 01:50 PM

'IT' may be a charismatic presence which exudes confidence and which gets LOTS of attention... but that doesn't mean 'everyone' will enjoy or approve of that particular charisma.
I have NO interest in the Lady Gaga type....or Amy Winehouse... no matter how they affect others. I did finally see videos of Elvis in stage performances, and I now understand why he entranced many... but I just don't care for that type of music...(well, except for a couple odd items)

I have known local friends or strict amateurs who had more 'it' than many pros. I have seen some pros who had much talent, but no 'it'...including a couple who were almost offensive in their attempt to make the performance about themselves instead of the music. (In my opinion, Elvis was usually about *Elvis*, rather than presenting a song.) Some wonderful performers make you feel the song(s) so well, that you DO identify them with with 'it', just because.... (our late friend, Barry Finn was a prime example... he TOOK you places without ever pushing 'Barry'.)

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Smokey.
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 01:39 PM

Mine's at the back of a drawer somewhere with my scruples and an unused ounce of common sense.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Amos
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 01:30 PM

I have "it", but I am not using it at present. If anyone wants to borrow "it" let me know. Chongo's "it" is a different thing alogether--a simian version acheived by dexterous leers and grace in flinging feces through bars. Chimp-it is very different from "it" in human circles. It includes, as well, artful drooling, well-turned chittering, and the ability to show one's lower teeth in a ferocious manner.

Do not be fooled by cheap imitations.


A

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 01:11 PM

Who has "it"?

Chongo, that's who.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: bobad
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 01:08 PM

Pierre Trudeau had it.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 12:53 PM

Well, I made a part list before.

I'd add Toots Hibbert, and Desmond Dekker, and Maddy Prior, and Annie Lennox, Wilko Johnson, Jo-Ann Kelly, and I'll probably come back and add some more later.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Smokey.
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 12:34 PM

Johnny Silvo.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: kendall
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 11:53 AM

I have it too. It's called a black leather jacket.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 11:50 AM

... and who agrees David Jason?

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 11:46 AM

Of course, as MikeL and Jack say above, there are few who would appear on everybody's list. Would yours include Groucho, say?

& I agree with BWL that the time must be right [as with Churchill]; but without "It" it still won't work ~~ and some can adjust their "It" to the times, especially if they are not quite conscious of how they do "It", as I suspect might have been the case with M Monroe: tho have never been quite sure about that in her case ~~ was she really that artless, or the consummate professional complete with the art that conceals art? - one of the ways of "It"-ing, I suspect. Never been sure about her...

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Mrrzy
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 11:38 AM

My mom and I were just talking about It - some of her grandchildren certainly have It. Katharine Hepburn had It. Cary Grant had It. John Wayne had It. George Clooney has It, which is why mom dislikes him so.

People who have It don't usually leave anyone cold - they are intensely liked or disliked, I find...

Mom has It, too, but would argue that she doesn't. I think Kate Hepburn might have as well.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 11:37 AM

Perhaps the best public one-occasion example of "It" I have ever seen was Danny Kaye's theatre act. He just stood (or sat or even lay) there & talked & did a bit of scat-singing and just once roused himself enough to sing & mime Dem Dry Bones. That was all. If you saw it, you'll know what I mean. If not, I can't think of any way to describe or communicate the "It" of it...

Laurence Olivier as the one-man Chorus in the Old Vic's first English production of Anouilh's Antigone, in white tie & tails but with the most matter-of-fact delivery chatting intimately to the audience about the nature of Greek Tragedy, ran it close...

I saw them within a few weeks of one another in 1948-49.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 11:20 AM

I think it's more a matter of the person being right for the times. Society's attitudes, interests and aspirations are continually changing. As has often been said about musical success, it's as much about being in the right place at the right time and being noticed by the right people as it is about talent.

Marilyn Monroe's persona was a reflection of broadening but still somewhat prudish sexual attitudes of the 1950s. Titillation was acceptable but flagrant sexuality a la Lady Gaga wasn't. If Marilyn were to come on the scene today, she'd be a minor starlet, not a superstar.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 11:11 AM

And in 1940 we needed someone who had 'It' to the same extent as the old bugger over there with the silly little moustache but the ∞∞∞ of 'It'. Fortunately he was there ~~ whatever one thinks of Churchill's political activities, I am not sure the war would have gone as it did without his "It"; & Montgomery's too ~~ apparently a horrible C-in-C to be on the staff of, but with whatever the 'It' is that a Commander needs to keep the troops going ~~ Compare Robert Graves' poem on Nelson's funeral:-

'And, Sir, the secret of his victories?'
'By his unServicelike, familiar ways, Sir,
He made the whole Fleet love him, damn his eyes!'

And it clearly wasn't just the dramatic & authorial talent with Noel Coward.

~M~

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: Will Fly
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 11:01 AM

I've had it for years - the doctors say that there's nothing anyone can do about it...

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 10:52 AM

It isn't only performers or people on a stage, though, mind. John Lennon was a performer; Rabbi Lionel Blue isn't [tho I see from the current Cambridge Arts Theatre programme that he is now doing a sort of 'Evening With...'; which, as he is well over 80 & a longtime cancer sufferer, is pretty game of the old boy ~~ oh, we Old Hendonians, you know, Eliza!]. But they both qualify in my book.

Sir Walter Ralegh was a courtier & explorer, John Brown was Queen Victoria's ghillie; Will Somers was Henry VIII's jester; Mmes de Pompadour & Dubarry were French Kings' mistress & Nell Gwynn & Alice Keppel English ones' ~ but history records all of these as having had ~~ whatever It may be...

~M~

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 10:47 AM

I think the It factor is when someone's presence hits you right between the eyes. Not necessarily a raving beauty or talent but that extra special oomph. Amy Winehouse is completely different, she could have had It but unfortunately she was too self destructive.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 10:19 AM

I would say Tommy Cooper had 'it'. He didn't even have to speak, he was just funny in himself.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 10:18 AM

I believe that 'it' is not mysterious. It's a combination of stage presence and enjoying being up there. Some people are born to be the center of attention, and some people are not.

It's different from talent. A person can be talented and retiring. Or the opposite. My uncle once told me that he had seen Elvis Presley on stage. His singing never impressed my uncle, but when he saw the man on stage, he WAS impressed. Elvis Presley loved being on stage, and he put on a great act.

That's It.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: MikeL2
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 10:16 AM

hi Michael

I agree with your definition and most of the people you mentioned......but Amy Whitehouse.....not in my book.

Regards

Mike

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 09:50 AM

Not sure how 'It' differs from talent?

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: gnu
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 09:50 AM

I've got it and you can't have it back.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 09:45 AM

Whoever was/is the first of their kind who made an impact on the world in entertainment, politics, sport and even medicine. I find it hard to think of anyone who merits the It factor today.

Subject: RE: BS: 'It'... who has it?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 27 Jul 11 - 09:15 AM

The original It Girl