BS: Right wing Relatives

Subject: : Right wing Relatives
From: Elmore
Date: 02 Aug 12 - 09:09 PM

My youngest stepson (age 42 ) and his wife and 4 beautiful kids dropped in from Denver today. I'm not allowed to argue with him , despite the fact that he spouts right wing b.s. the minute he walks in the door. We only see them once or twice a year. I have learned to keep my mouth shut, but it's such a drag. I'm not seeking advice, just wondering if anybody out there has the same problem.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Rapparee
Date: 02 Aug 12 - 09:48 PM

Oh yeah. Cousins, even my brother for a while. Now my brother and I agree: toss them ALL out, regardless of party affiliation. Put in strict term limits (he imposed them on himself when he did politics!).

Problem is, EVERYTHING becomes grist for the mill. Your neighbor's aunt's hairdresser's best friend's brother-in-law's puppy is run over and it's all the fault of the the Liberals. The Conservatives are responsible for the drought in the Midwest. And the Moderates of both parties caused the killings in Syria and the collapse of the Euro.

You can't even talk about the weather anymore. As Utah Phillips said, we assign blame in our own best interests.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 02 Aug 12 - 10:05 PM

Don't quite understand what you mean by "not allowed to argue with him".

Why? Who says? Not allowed by whom? With what authority?

~M~

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: YorkshireYankee
Date: 02 Aug 12 - 10:21 PM

As Utah Phillips said, we assign blame in our own best interests.

Brilliant! Might be a good quote to post at the top of the BS section...

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Ebbie
Date: 02 Aug 12 - 10:24 PM

I don't know just how right-wing some of my relatives are. That's because they fear my mouth. *g* Although I expect they do plenty of talking about me and my views amongst themselves.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: meself
Date: 02 Aug 12 - 11:32 PM

Elmore you've got it backwards - it's supposed to be the son who has to bite his tongue while the old man delivers the right-wing diatribe - and the son tells himself, well, the old man had a hard life, he grew up in different times, he doesn't get out much, they've changed his meds, etc.   - least that's how it was in our house. Can't imagine how I would do it if I couldn't make up all those excuses for the party in question. Ah well, I guess that's the cost of true love later in life ....

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Janie
Date: 02 Aug 12 - 11:56 PM

Same issue in my family, Elmore.

My little family-of-origin is surrounded by a sea of conservative to reactionary right-wing aunts, uncles and cousins. For us, it is not a question of not being allowed, it is awareness of the futility, and our own decision to refuse to engage in futile arguments with the true right wingers. We love them and they love us. We all have a strong sense of family obligation, and my most right wing uncle is also absolutely awesome at showing up when family needs some one to show up - and he ain't looking for glory. Just doing what he believes is his obligation for family and also for love of my mother.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 12:04 AM

You may not be allowed to argue. But I don't see why you can't put up a sign along the lines of "No horse shit zone" With a picture of O'Reiley with one of those "Ghost Busters" circles around him.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: artbrooks
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 12:23 AM

I remember my brother saying that he wasn't sure about Mr. McCain until he picked Ms. Palin as a running mate - than he was ok. We don't talk much.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Ebbie
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 01:07 AM

My niece glowed: Oh, we just love her!

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Amergin
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 01:26 AM

Lot of relatives back home are uber right wing...all they watch is Faux News....so when you go visit you're inundated with bullshit.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Megan L
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 03:26 AM

In our house no topic of conversation was out of bounds if people talked quietly and respeced others views. However anyone who became agressive either in word or deed quickly discovered that 5foot 2 did not mean small and fragile as mum escorted them outside where they had to stay till they could behave.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 03:34 AM

How can you love a fascist, relative or not? Surely the most you can do is tolerate them out of duty. At least that's the way I see some of the right wingers in my family (but they are all from my late wife's side).

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 04:16 AM

There seems to be a general rule or law emerging from this discussion, i.e. people with left wing views tend to be more respectful of other people's feelings than people with right wing views. Says it all really!

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 04:42 AM

Shimrod ~ Your last post seems to me directly to contradict Richard's which immediately precedes it! Talk of self-satisfied self-righteous lefty wankers...!

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 04:52 AM

You stick to your sex life, MtheGM and I'll stick to mine.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 05:54 AM

"Talk of self-satisfied self-righteous lefty wankers ...!"

Yes, MtheGM, that does seem to be a characteristic of many left wingers. But then are many, self-proclaimed, left wingers really left wing? Look at British Labour Party supporters, for example, who kept their mouths shut whilst their leadership instituted right wing policies and collaborated in illegal wars. They still managed to remain smug and self-righteous though!

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 06:00 AM

Shim - Your post of 0416 seems to contradict what seems to be your position elsewhere - esp in this last one. Did you confuse the sides, or am I missing something?

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: GUEST,petecockermouth
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 06:08 AM

you can be in the uk labour party and have left views but many thousands of us have given up on them since the betrayal of progressive ideas by new labour and the disgrace of blair following bush into an illegal and devastating war in iraq. i still like to think of labour as capable of change and putting up a bit of a stand against the vicious cruelty of free market economics - but i'm not very hopeful. they are sort of a family i used to know who have lost their way and purpose. we socialists cling to the promise of say occupy or chavez and anti-monetarist protests but it is up to all members of our family to reject this neo fascist economic doctrine and start working for the interests of all the 99%

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 06:11 AM

No, MtheGM, there is no contradiction because I don't consider myself to be a rigid idealogue. I tend to oppose right wing views because, at their root, they seem to me to be based on greed and selfishness. On the other hand I think that the left has failed - particularly in the UK. It (the left) has become a gross caricature of its former self and those who purport to lead it are, I believe, pink on the outside and deep, dark blue on the inside ... whilst still managing to remain smug etc.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 06:26 AM

Yes, I see, Shim. Thanks for the clarification. Not a million miles from the confusion I tend to labour [no pun!] under myself.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Will Fly
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 07:22 AM

I had to put up with a bigoted father from the day I was old enough to reason until the time I left home, when I was 21. The man was entitled to his own opinions, of course, as I was to mine, but it was impossible to reason or argue with him without being told to shut up. He just hated to be contradicted so, eventually, I ignored him - and have continued to do so to this very day.

He hated wops, wogs, eyeteyes, niggers, catholics, fenians, yids, etc. etc. Naturally, he never went to church unless compelled to. It always tickles me that, having done a great deal of research into the family, to find out that one set of his grandparents was from Co. Kildare, catholics and as Irish as me hat!

As for "leftie wankers", Michael, I'm with Shimrod. I would consider myself, on the whole, a liberal socialist and a humanist but not a Socialist with a capital S. I've never voted Conservative, but hated Blair as much as I hate Cameron and Milliband! To my mind, the greatest obstacle to progress in this country is the dogmatism of party politics - but what's the alternative?

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: GUEST,kendall
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 07:46 AM

Part of being a Liberal is the ability to allow others to have a different opinion on politics.
However, when one of them takes advantage of all the left wing programs, Social security, Medicare, minimum wage, overtime, etc. and still runs his mouth spitting venom about "America haters", I find that reason, facts and logic are lost on these poor victims of acute tunnel vision. They can not hear for the noise in their heads.

I have relatives and friends who think Faux noise is fair and balanced in spite of the evidence to the contrary. I tell them, "No amount of belief can create a fact."

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Deckman
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 08:04 AM

I run into this problem occasionally, but the older I get, the less tolerant of BS I get. About a year ago, I found a very simple answer that has worked very well for me:

The first ultra right wing political comments that come out of anyone's (yes ... ANYONE'S) mouth, I simply open the front door and tell them (politely) to leave. They always do, and usually quite humbly.

One of the added benifits of this simple solution is that I now have fewer visits from very annoying relatives. And yes, I also sleep much better! bob(deckman)nelson

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 08:36 AM

Birds with only one wing, can't fly.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: The Sandman
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 08:50 AM

- but what's the alternative?
, WELL WE SEEM TO BE GOVERNED BY EUROPE so cut the number of MPs,also cut their wages, and spend a little more and have a few more ambulances

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: SINSULL
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 08:53 AM

Very wise, Grasshopper.


When my son was about 9 we had a visit from an aunt who spouted vileness on every racial group imaginable. During a lull in the conversation, my son asked "Why is she allowed to say things like that in our house?"
I just smiled proudly at him. She shut up.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: GUEST,TIA
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 08:58 AM

Yup. My Mother- and Father-in-Law live by Faux News. Insist that it is the only news that "shows both sides".
But they are pushing 90 and it upsets the wife if I challenge them on their utter horseshit.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Owen Woodson
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 09:34 AM

MGM. "self-satisfied self-righteous lefty wankers...!"

Do please tell. Are those of the opposite political persuasion "self-satisfied self-righteous right handed wankers..."?

I raise the point entirely out of curiosity as to whether this is the self satisfied, self abusing MtheGM we know of old, whether he is of the right handed persuasion, and whether he is liable to change hands when he learns how to count up to 99?

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 09:43 AM

None such have posted.
I do have some Lefty relatives who I tolerate politely, and I am not even Right Wing.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: kendall
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 09:51 AM

I find that it's more effective to ask questions, such as, Do you approve of Social security? Medicare? minimum wage? child labor laws? women's suffrage? They usually say YES, and I reply, "THANK THE DEMOCRATS" The republicans have fought them all, tooth and claw for over 70 years.

I had three right wing friends who would not let up on the right wing horse shit until I told them, one more load and I block your emails.
Two of them never did respond.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Elmore
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 09:54 AM

Some people have asked why wasn't allowed to respond to my step son's b.s. arguments. Well, I'm passionate about my politics, and can be quite sarcastic in such a discussion. This has led to some harsh words directed to me my wonderful, LIBERAL wife. It's just not worth it, but trust me, this guy is a total pain.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Megan L
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 10:02 AM

Views around here are like swings and roundabouts everyone is so busy looking at thier own wee bit pie in the sky they cant see the useless monotenous turn of the endless round of same old same old.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: kendall
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 11:52 AM

Elmore, it is perfectly reasonable to insist that you and your company stay away from politics to keep the peace. If he insists on using his unfair advantage he's not much of a man.
He's lucky doe doesn't know me!

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Wesley S
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 12:22 PM

I had a friend that I used to argue with by e-mail until he sent me some nude photos of someone that looked like Barack Obama's mother. When I said that was a low blow his response was - you know the democrats would send something like that around if they had it { Eww - nude photos of John McCains mother? Please! }. I gave up and told him never to contact me again. He hasn't.

My brother in law and sister in law send me stuff that I refute with facts. But sure enough - they know that Scopes is just a shill for the liberals.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Bill D
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 12:41 PM

Scopes? I assume that's Snopes.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 01:20 PM

Is there a political party I can join where the members are happy?
Is there a political party I can join where they admit they may have been wrong; EVER?
Is there a political party I can join that doesn't blame absoluteoly everything that ever went wrong on the opposition:?
Is there a political party I can join which doesn't preach hatred of the other lot?
I find both main parties miserable grudging and unforgiving.
I find any party that complains about their members being ground down by the opposition, do exactly the same when they are in power.
In other words they's all a mean spirited, selfish, self serving, bunch of hypocrites.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Elmore
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 01:22 PM

Kendall, thanks for the advice. I'll keep it in mind.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Bobert
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 01:45 PM

Best thing to do is tell _______________, "Hey, we're family and we disagree on politics so lets just talk about other stuff" and stick to it... Sometimes, it takes a second or third reminder but it eventually works...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: kendall
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 01:47 PM

You don't have to be rude or loud. Just state firmly that you will no longer listen to his politics. If he persists, walk away.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Elmore
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 01:53 PM

God, I wish you could hear him. Not good for my blood pressure.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 02:09 PM

You have a right to tell him to cease and desist while under your roof.

Especially if his mom is gagging you.

Even better, make her tell him to stop. Fair is fair.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: olddude
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 02:28 PM

I got to the point now where I just say, the beautiful thing about America is the right to express your opinions and I completely respect them. I may not agree but that is my right also, People need to work together as we are losing out lately in this world economy .. It usually ends with a smile instead of a word fight

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Elmore
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 02:43 PM

Funny, I didn't start this thread for advice, but to express my frustration. However I got some excellent ideas. I love Mudcat.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 02:57 PM

Elmore I think people naturally think of themselves in the same position and think of, or in some cases remember their own reactions.

Olddude I am not exactly sure what you are saying. But I think I agree.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Bert
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 03:21 PM

Elmore, you get back at him on Facebook. If he's young he's most likely got an account.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 03:30 PM

It's a matter of common politeness to refrain from contentious conversation when visiting someone in their own home. My late brother-in-law provoked terrible arguments with my late father (who was right-wing and his son-in-law left-wing) It's ok to have an interesting discussion with each side listening to and respecting the other. But with politics and religion this rarely happens. It upsets the company and causes family feuds. This happened with us. Now they're both dead, I wonder if the fierce altercations continue in the next world! Someone needs to be very firm and insist it stops.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 03:55 PM

When he does this, completely ignore what he says, and maybe talk to the four beautiful kids about music and food and stuff like that.

I'd imagine he probably does it to get a rise out of you. The normal way people deal with these kind of differences is to avoid the subjects which stir things up unpleasantly, as part of normal courtesy.

That doesn't rule out lively discussions, which recognise the differences and explore them. The real trouble is when someone talks as if they assume you share views you detest.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: kendall
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 03:59 PM

When my ex and I got into an argument, one of us would say "Innit awful what they did to Marie Antoinette. That was our flag of truce.

Subject: RE: BS: Right wing Relatives
From: Will Fly
Date: 03 Aug 12 - 04:04 PM

There are good reasons why three topics - religion, politics and women - were traditionally banned from being discussed in the officers' mess...