BS: The world's worst metaphor?

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: GUEST,Musket sans belief
Date: 09 Jul 13 - 08:47 AM

I am sure 99% of the best brains, best mates and best everything else for that matter have professed a faith, Christianity amongst them.

This isn't about faith though, it's about wearing it as a fashion mallet to club others.

Jerk. We are happy with ourselves. We post as Musket, you refer to Mather. I am running out of characters on the keyboard, so bear with me here. Musket laughs at you and Mather thinks you are a c

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: GUEST,Tod Cholmondley-Haverning -Brown
Date: 09 Jul 13 - 09:33 AM

As a past master of

Berkley Hunt

and similar metaphors

Can u let me know wher we can obtain this cat in a box thingy so that we may pursue its contents using my redundant pack of hounds or somethin?

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 09 Jul 13 - 01:18 PM

And I pity both Mather and Musket for believing they can be to different people at once.

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 10 Jul 13 - 10:05 AM

Penelope Rutledge is an inveterate opponent of the Berkeley Hunt, as she is opposed to any form of cruelty to animals. Her husband (soon to be ex-husband?) Winston Wellington-Jones is a strong proponent of fox hunting and other such idle pursuits of upper class twits and inconceivably wealthy bastards in the UK. This has led to much friction between the pair and may presage not the Rapture...but the Rupture...of their marital ties.

In fact, they are getting along worse than Jack and Musket these days. Each one pities the other, regards the other's views with utter contempt, and hopes that some convenient "act of God" will occur, such as a very large tree falling on their spouse at an opportune moment.

But the real question is...why just be 2 people when you can be 10 or 20 different people? Why limit the possibilities to only 1 version of yourself? Bob Dylan gets this. So does David Bowie. Most people don't.

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: GUEST,Musket sans Clapton
Date: 10 Jul 13 - 10:20 AM

You haven't seen the others of us. Am I sat in the office preparing a board report or propping the bar up in the pub? We can do both whilst walking the good professor, restringing the guitar and having a crap.

Never lonely.

People who can differentiate between reality and cyber shit are not to be pitied.   You yourself claim to appreciate science yet use medieval translations of stories as your moral guide.   I am not as clever as you and try to reflect reality at all levels.   I can however appreciate Mudcat as being a different place to my office which is a different place to the pub which is a different place to home.

"You can be a gambler who never drew a hand
You can be a sailor who never left dry land
You can be Lord Jesus, all the world will understand
Down where the drunkards roll."

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 10 Jul 13 - 11:09 AM

"use medieval translations of stories as your moral guide"

Say what??? Are you referring to the Bible?

Okay, first of all...sure I appreciate science. It's perfectly straightforward, it's obviously practical, and it's useful...why would I not appreciate it?

But I do not necessarily take everything in the Bible as my moral guide. Definitely not! The Bible is a big collection of writings by many different men in ancient times (but no women, unfortunately...I'm sure their views would have been worth hearing). It's been translated, re-translated, and edited with political intent by various people in different factions in the Church. It is not an infallible guide by any means, but it IS a very interesting collection of ancient viewpoints on God, humanity, life, morality, etc.

There is much in the Bible that I do not necessarily agree with...specially taken on the literal level. There is much in the Bible that I do agree with, much of it in the form of parable or allegory. It depends on the passage, and on its interpretation (which can vary widely). When reading through it, as when reading through Shakespeare or anything else, I try to take in what good is there, understand it as best I can, and find whatever there is of value in it.

This is how I approach life in general, and it's how I approach books, including the Bible.

One has to figure out morality for oneself through one's own best judgement and through practical experience. I don't expect the Bible to do that for me, but I do appreciate the rich cultural and philosophical information that can be found in various parts of the Bible...and I feel the same about the Baghavad Gita (Hindu scriptures), Buddhist writings, Taoist writings, and various other books from world religions. They all have something quite useful to say. None of them should be taken as infallible...or as the final and complete word on everything.

Christianity, by the way, might better be called "Paulianity", because the New Testament writings are fairly much dominated by the sections written by the apostle Paul...and I find myself often in disagreement with Paul's general attitude on things. He was a pretty odd duck. I have a feeling that if I had been alive at the time, Paul would probably have been in one school of thought about the religion, and I'd have been in another school entirely...one he would have regarded as "heretical". (there were many such divisions in the church throughout its history).

The primary thing I like about Christianity is whatever has survived from the actual teachings given by Jesus. I like Jesus' general viewpoint on things, and I like the way he conducted himself. How accurate a record we have of what he did and said is, of course, questionable...because the various people who wrote about him afterward all had their own political axes to grind and they put their own personal slant on their accounts of him. (They really couldn't help but do so, I expect.) They often used him for various political purposes that were important to them at the time, and this couldn't help but distort the record.

I think Jesus would be horrified by many of the practices and excesses of the church that was founded in his name...not to mention some of the other churches that have sprung from it.

You see, the Bible itself is not my moral guide in any exclusive or all-embracing sense. My moral guide is, first of all, my own common sense...and after that, any kind of useful inspiration I can draw and sift from out of a variety of other sources...among which are the sacred writings of most of the great religions of the world. I look everywhere for inspiration, not just to one single holy book.

If there is one single holy book, then the name for it is "life". That's what we are all experiencing, and it's real.

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: GUEST,Musket evolving slowly
Date: 10 Jul 13 - 12:24 PM

The description was generic, the Bible is by no means the exclusive Scripture used by those following a religion. The Q'ran, torah and sundry other texts are used as moral guides. Hence I didn't say Bible. Here in The UK, the majority of those who profess to read Scripture read Islamic or Hindu texts according to government figures.

The Bible was my reference though, ss I was answering Jerk's charge that you cannot be two people yet the other day he quite understandably noted his separation of his use of the Bible as a guide to his thoughts on science.   I don't ridicule him for that but can't help using it to point out the absurdity of what he perceives as my schizophrenia, to use the term wrongly.

I could of course have waffled less and just pointed out he is a bloody fool.   I could of course have not posted and allowed others to come to the same conclusion without my prompting.

Life is good. The sun is shining and I am firing up the bbq with a bottle of beer having just got home for the day.   Not a relevant comment for this thread but why should he be the only one to orbit different planets? (With apologies to Goofus)

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 10 Jul 13 - 02:05 PM

Little Hawk, If you seriously consider taking Musky seriously, refer you to his holy text, the Militant Atheist thread, where he said that he only comes to the Mudcat to take the piss.

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 10 Jul 13 - 10:25 PM

Well, it's not that I have a big need to take Musket seriously, Jack, in fact I enjoy a certain amount of non-serious banter with him. It's just that I do enjoy voicing my own thoughts when a subject comes up that really interests me...and explaining them...so as to better clarify them for myself as well as for anyone else who might be listening. I like to write. I also like to be understood, if at all possible, so that's why I explain my thoughts in some detail.

All of this helps me know myself better, and know better what my life is about.

****

I do think that any person can be 2 people...or many people. For instance, I can choose to be a vengeful person...or a person who simply doesn't care...or I can choose to be a forgiving person...and those 3 choices are always in front of me...as well as numerous other possible choices. We remake ourselves in every moment by what and who we decide to be, and profound change is always possible if we simply decide to change and put some serious effort into doing so.

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: GUEST,Musket evolving slowly
Date: 11 Jul 13 - 01:16 AM

Yeah but being one person would be to lower your guard. In cyberspace, that would never do.

The thread Jerk refers to has evolved into the Genesis of a new religion.   If stating the aims of a religious organisation is taking the piss, we are starting to get somewhere.

I often thought vicars must have their fingers crossed when asking re faithful to dig deep and don't forget gift aid. ...

Still, I suppose dismissing me is easier than defending Jerk's rather preposterous stances. Fair play to him. I'd use it to get myself out of a hole too if I spoke bollocks (and wasn't trying to. )

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 11 Jul 13 - 01:38 AM

The world is full of new religions. They pop up like mushrooms. Every time a new political party starts up, for instance, you see the beginning of another religion. And sometimes there are writers like Ayn Rand who manage to create a new one all by themselves. Marx helped create a new religion which was soon called "Marxism", one of whose tenets was that religion is very, very bad ("the opiate of the masses")...;-)...and that it should be eliminated. His more fervent acolytes took him quite seriously, and they managed to kill millions of traditionally religious people while spreading their new faith across Russia, China, and various other parts of the world such as Cambodia, for example.

Marx, however, had not seen modern television! Or corporate mass marketing as it now exists. If he had, he'd have realized what a truly effective opiate of the masses really looks like when it's put into action. And he would have been afraid...with good reason.

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: GUEST,Musket sans Clapton
Date: 11 Jul 13 - 03:22 AM

Yes but ours is the true religion.

We have bingo, gnomes, mouth organs and an errant greyhound.

What's not to like?




I often point out that most of what religion offered medieval peasants is covered for the masses today with soap opera and ipads.

John Lennon got it right.

They keep you doped with religion, sex and tv
Till you think you're so clever and classless and free
But you're still fucking peasants as far as I can see.

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 11 Jul 13 - 10:14 AM

Yeah, Lennon sure nailed it in that verse.

Back to what you said...

"We have bingo, gnomes, mouth organs and an errant greyhound."

Christ! That is pretty enticing, allright. Hard to resist.

Where do I join up?

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: GUEST,Musket sans blood of the Messiah
Date: 11 Jul 13 - 10:46 AM

You have to be approached. Be prepared to roll your trouser leg up, bear your breast and swear to have your tongue cut out if you know or learn the true name of God before you become a chapter member.

Oh and if you know his name can you inform Dave, Steve or yours truly?   Cos we mislaid the piece of paper with it written on. I reckon we used the paper to write to Betty Swollox sacking her.

I assume it's a he. We want to be taken seriously as a really genuine religion and the misogyny clause seems to be important. As does seeing men who make good soufflés as second class citizens.

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 11 Jul 13 - 11:03 AM

Damn! We were so close, but you lost me on the "assume it's a he" part. I've always preferred the idea of God as a woman. In fact, I introduce one of my songs that way, saying, "This song could be about a woman...or it could be about God...but those are just 2 ways of saying the same thing."

At any rate...

This means a holy war, you cursed infidel! Prepare to be pillaged, sacked, and generally messed up beyond all recognition and in a most severe manner when we swarm over your shattered battlements and put you and your firstborn to the sword...but in a sacred fashion, you understand. No impropriety here!

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: GUEST,Musket evolving slowly
Date: 11 Jul 13 - 11:30 AM

My woman is god ish. I refine the term somewhat and refer to her as my responsible adult.   If writing soppy songs for her is adoration, then she is worshipped by me in the same way as Sheffield Wednesday, pickled eggs and my Triumph Stag.

She may not like the comparison. She may not like being referred to as my woman. Haha she never reads Mudcat. Keyboard sans responsibility. I heartily recommend it.

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 11 Jul 13 - 11:37 AM

She is wise not to read Mudcat. Think of all the time she saves for more useful activity. ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: GUEST,Musket procrastinating
Date: 11 Jul 13 - 11:41 AM

Yeah but who wants to be working all ruddy day? Flicking to Mudcat can be fun. Especially when you have no other social media outlet. I don't do Facebook etc. No reason, just can't be arsed.

Subject: RE: BS: The world's worst metaphor?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 11 Jul 13 - 11:46 AM

Same here. Can't be bothered with Facebook.

Now...I think I had best go and do several things I've been procrastinating on while I was having fun here.