flouride in mains water

Subject: flouride in mains water
From: The Sandman
Date: 06 Jan 14 - 03:49 PM

WHY , IS THIS BEING PUT IN MAINS WATER?

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 06 Jan 14 - 04:04 PM

If you mean fluoride! it's because it's good for the teeth , strengthens the enamel and helps prevent decay (and therefore helps prevent the need for dental treatment). At least, that's what they told us when it was first introduced (back in the '60s, IIRC).

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: GUEST,Rev Bayes
Date: 06 Jan 14 - 04:16 PM

The comma makes me think that GSS is dressed in a top hat and tails, holding a glass of brandy and declaiming Shakespearean style.

No fluoride in beer.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Bill D
Date: 06 Jan 14 - 04:21 PM

I don't know a song by than name....WHY , IS THIS BEING PUT IN the top section?

What is so difficult about paying attention to the categories?

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: The Sandman
Date: 06 Jan 14 - 04:53 PM

did any of you know it was used by the nazis in the water supply of POWS to keep them placid, shades of stepford wives, how convenient put a tranquiliser in the water supply ,keep the electorate quiet.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Little Robyn
Date: 06 Jan 14 - 05:01 PM

In many countries fluoride occurs naturally in ground water but in NZ there isn't iodine or fluorine in the ground so it has been added - iodised salt and fluoride in the water. Before this was done there were health problems that were less frequent in countries our migrants had left and so it was rectified.
Robyn

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: GUEST,Peter
Date: 06 Jan 14 - 05:06 PM

I think GSS is confusing flouride and bromide

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Old Grey Wolf
Date: 06 Jan 14 - 05:18 PM

I was taught about fluoride during my training as a homoeopath and could unload quite a lot of info' about it here. There is a great deal of information about flouride on the net. Why has fluoride been raised on this music site?

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: The Sandman
Date: 06 Jan 14 - 05:25 PM

I pressed the below the line button and it obviously did not work. Iamnot confusing anyting check it out research it, in the meantime here is another of fluorides little benefi FLUORIDATION AND BONE CANCER                                     home ¦contact us ¦


Fluoride has been recognised as mutagenic for many years.1,2,3 In the U.S., a comparison between the ten largest fluoridated cities and the ten largest non-fluoridated cities showed that, while cancer rates had been similar initially, after 20 years the fluoridated cities had 10 percent more cancer deaths than the non-fluoridated ones.4 The U.S. National Cancer Institute checked these figures and confirmed their validity in 1976. In Poland, scientists at the Pomeranian Medical Academy reported that as little as 0.6 parts per million produced chromosomal damage to human white blood cells.5

Following these results, Dr. Dean Burk, the Chief Chemist Emeritus of the U.S. National Cancer Institute, stated: "In point of fact, fluoride causes more human cancer death, and causes it faster, than any other chemical".6

Dr. Perry Cohn of the New Jersey Department of Health discovered an epidemiological correlation between osteosarcoma (one of the principal cancers of childhood) and fluoridation.7 He surveyed its incidence in seven counties of New Jersey relative to water fluoridation. He found that, as demonstrated in Table I, in the fluoridated areas, the incidence of osteosarcoma in boys under the age of 10 was 4.6 times higher than in the unfluoridated areas, 3.5 times higher in the 10 to 19 age group and over twice as high in the 20 to 49 age group.

Table 1

Fluoride and osteosarcoma in young males
Seven Counties, New Jersey, 1979-1987
Age                  Cases         Population         Rate/100,000
0-9         Fluoridated         2         48,129         4.6
Unfluoridated         1         102,123         1.0
10-19         Fluoridated         10         62,990         17.6
Unfluoridated         7         151,384         5.1
20-49         Fluoridated         5         141,429         3.9
Unfluoridated         5         348,570         1.5
Municipalities, NJ, 1979-1987
Age                  Cases         Population         Rate/100,000
0-9         Fluoridated         2         38,654         5.7
Unfluoridated         1         46,708         2.3
10-19         Fluoridated         10         50,297         20.0
Unfluoridated          2          67,678         3.2
20-49         Fluoridated         4         115,367         3.8
Unfluoridated         2         153,713         1.4
Cohn PD. A brief report on the association of drinking water fluoridation and the incidence of osteosarcoma among young males. N J Dept of Health, Trenton, New Jersey. Nov 8, 1992.

1. Klein W, et al. DNA repair and environmental substances. Zeitschrift fur Angewandte Bader-und Klimaheilkunde. 1977; 24 (3): 218-223.

2.Mohamed A, Chandler ME. Cytological effects of sodium fluoride on mice. Fluoride. 1982; 15 (3): 110-18.

3.Jagiello G, Lin J-S. Sodium fluoride as potential mutagen in mammalian eggs. Archive Environmental Health. 1974; 29: 230-5.

4.Yiamouyiannis JA, Burk D. Fluoridation of public water systems and the cancer death rate in humans. Presented at the 67th Annual Meeting of the American Society of Biologists and Chemists and the American Society of Experimental Biologists. June 1976.

5. Jachimczak D, Skotarczak B. The effect of fluorine and lead ions on the chromosomes of human leucocytes in vitro. Genetica Polonica. 1978; 19 (3): 353-7.

6. Yiamouyannis JA. Fluoride: The Aging Factor. Health Action Press, Delaware, Ohio. 1983.

7. Cohn PD. A brief report on the association of drinking water fluoridation and the incidence of osteosarcoma among young males. N J Dept of Health, Trenton, New Jersey. Nov 8, 1992.
FOR MORE INFORMATION:

FLUORIDE/CANCER
http://www.cadvision.com/fluoride/cancer.htm

BONE AND JOINT CANCERS
http://www.cadvision.com/fluoride/cancer2.htm#What is the NTP
(National Toxicology Program)

ts

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: The Sandman
Date: 06 Jan 14 - 05:41 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3dZPOJ4p1DMhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSZQ3ixu7a4

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: The Sandman
Date: 06 Jan 14 - 05:43 PM

fluoride action.com

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: bobad
Date: 06 Jan 14 - 05:45 PM

Lots of pseudoscience out there - beware.

For some real science on the subject of fluoridation: The Fluoride Controversy

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: The Sandman
Date: 06 Jan 14 - 06:06 PM

do not challenge anything, believe bobad he must be correct because he says so

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Rapparee
Date: 06 Jan 14 - 08:38 PM

Gosh, here in the States they're removing it from some cities' water because it's no longer needed. The fluoride in toothpaste and fluoride treatments at the dentists' offices have supplanted any need for it in the drinking water.

But if you don't want fluoridation you could move the Northern Ireland, where it isn't done.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Greg F.
Date: 06 Jan 14 - 09:09 PM

it was used by the nazis in the water supply of POWS to keep them placid

bullshit.

Lots of pseudoscience out there

The fluoride crazies go way beyond pseudoscience - its absolute nonsence. Schweik needs to join forces with the vaccination causes autism nutcases.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 06 Jan 14 - 09:10 PM

BELOW, THE, EFFING, LINE, AND, WITH, PUNCTUATION

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Don Firth
Date: 06 Jan 14 - 11:10 PM

Good Soldier, I'm afraid you're getting this particular bulletin about seventy years later than the rest of the world. When the idea of adding fluoride to drinking water to strengthen tooth enamel came along, all the conspiracy theorists in the world came crawling out from under the sink. All the same "chemtrails" and that sort of thing:   a diabolical government plot to soften your brain and make you easy to control. Guys like Songwronger and Sawzaw would have had a field day!!

My dentist puts a fluoride solution on my teeth once a year, and recommends toothpaste with fluoride added. This, despite the fact that Seattle's water is quite soft and fluoride is added. It does occur in water naturally in some areas and it was noted decades ago that people in these areas generally had fewer cavities. So—

Don Firth

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 01:55 AM

Another bonnet-bee. Looks like he's been hitting the poteen again.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Bert
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 02:11 AM

Fluoride makes your teeth yellow and brittle.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 02:49 AM

http://www.ada.org/sections/advocacy/pdfs/fluoridation_statement_ten_authorities.pdf

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 03:28 AM

I gave my kids tablets on top of that added to our water.
We did not use fluoride toothpaste but they got a barely perceptible mottling on their teeth.
No cavities though.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Bert
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 06:07 AM

http://www.naturalnews.com/038217_fluoride_tap_water_side_effects.html#

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Bert
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 06:10 AM

Actually whether it is good for you or not is not the issue.

If you think that it is good, then feel free to consume as much as your heart desires.

Just don't force it on people who don't want it.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: The Sandman
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 07:57 AM

good point Bert, Do we not have a right to say what is put in our water.
if the water is owned by a private company, what is the legal right of the consumer to object or even in the event of ill health if proven by the addition of fluoride to water, to sue the private water company

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Noreen
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 08:02 AM

You could always draw your water from a spring.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 09:31 AM

It was the subject of much discussion before fluoridation of the UK water supply back in the '60s. Too long ago to remember much about it, but it was decided that the disadvantages were very much outweighed by the benefits.

I'd be very surprised if the subject isn't the subject of regular reviews between the water- supply companies and health authorities.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 11:03 AM

I find the whole notion of enforced mass medication of the populous for any reason - but especially for something so insignificant when compared to *real health problems* as fecking tooth enamel - both bizarre and nanny state-ish. If I want flouride I can buy products with it in, in fact getting a toothpaste without flouride in is virtually impossible anyway.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: The Sandman
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 11:22 AM

Noreen that is correct, if you live in the country, meanwhile city dwellers do not have an option, they are forced to have fluoride in water.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 11:24 AM

I too dislike having my intake of food and water modified and added to by the Nanny State. It's a bit insulting to assume I'm incapable of monitoring my own health. I wouldn't choose to drink fluoride in water, but it's put in before we get the choice. I also hate having 'low fat' stuff in my face at the supermarket. 'Low fat' spreads, milk, yoghurt, and that dreadful 'word' lite. I prefer full-fat dairy products, and surely I've the right to select them? But they're quite hard to find on the shelves. And in any case, 'they' seem to change their minds daily about what we should or shouldn't be eating or drinking. The latest is that real butter and full milk are in fact good for us! I'd like fluoride to be removed from our water, and for it to be left to us to buy toothpaste etc containing it if we so wish. I have all my teeth and I'm old. If children ate less sugar and sugary stuff, I expect hey wouldn't have so many caries!

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: selby
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 11:29 AM

Sat in the Dentists today in Yorkshire on the wall is a collage of how to get fluoride onto your teeth, as it is not in our water supply. I believed that all UK water had, had it added since the 60"s just shows how wrong you can be.
Keith

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Bill D
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 11:31 AM

from the link provided above:


"In March 1944, authorities in the Newburgh area of New York announced that the town's water would be fluoridated. On the day that fluoridation had been scheduled to begin, local health officials were startled to receive complaints about discolored saucepans, digestive troubles and cracked dentures. In fact, the fluoridation equipment had not been ready on time and no changes had been made to the water! But the public's imagination had already been primed. It seems that if you expect symptoms, you just may get them."

" Toxicity is always a question of dose! A mouthful of pure sodium fluoride will kill a rat, but the rodent would have to drink roughly a hundred liters of fluoridated tap water before suffering the same fate if the water had the usual fluoride concentration of 1 part per million."

The ONLY proven problem of fluoride is some discoloring of teeth when excessive amounts are used.


(As a child *I* lived in several areas with natural fluoride. I am almost 75 now, and though I have had cavities in later life, I have all but one of my teeth.)

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Bert
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 11:46 AM

It has been proven that broccoli is good for you. I suggest that all of our water supplies be broccolidated to reduce the risk of cancer.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 12:02 PM

Mwahhhaa, enforced mass medication through broccolidated water!

Now I like broccoli, but 'broccolidated water' (or the water any brassica is cooked in) pongs! Pew!

Only 10% of the UK is artificially fluoridated.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: bobad
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 12:17 PM

"It seems that if you expect symptoms, you just may get them."

This is known as the "nocebo" effect.

There is an elegant description of it in this short video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2hO4_UEe-4

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Charmion
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 12:36 PM

Fluoride in the water is one of several public health initiatives that people have become so familiar with that they don't appreciate their value. It's right up there with pasteurized milk == another benefit that foolish people like to decry.

I grew up in a village without "mains" water (as our overseas cousins put it), so our water came from a well. Very nice water, too, but it was liquid granite, so hard it would not produce soap suds without being chemically "softened". Unfortunately, the one mineral it apparently lacked was fluoride.

Fluoridated toothpaste came on the market in Ontario in 1962, when I was eight years old and my father was 43. In 1964, we moved to the city, where water was supplied from the Ottawa River and treated with fluoride.

My father, who had lost about half his teeth by his fortieth birthday, never lost another. My teeth were already studded with fillings, and I had several more over the next ten years. But after that, I had no more cavities, and now the only problems I have with my teeth arise from the deterioration of the old amalgam fillings, which eventually caused my back teeth to crack and break.

Young people I met at work, who had lived in fluoridated Ottawa all their lives, told me that they never had cavities, ever, despite the notoriously sugar-laden Canadian diet. They were deeply sympathetic of my repeated trips to the dentist to repair the ravages of old-style dental therapy.

Of course, back in the day, the amalgam filling was better than no tooth at all. Over the years, I have met several people who didn't have a tooth in their head by their 25th birthday -- folks who grew up in the country and never visited the dentist until adulthood. These folks considered me lucky to have a mouthful of healthy natural teeth -- as do I. Without fluoride, I would not have them.

Incidentally, dental caries and its bosom buddy gingivitis are damnably dangerous diseases, especially in people with weak immune systems. They are directly implicated in pericarditis, which is why a preventive course of antibiotics is prescribed for heart patients before they have dental work. Likewise, people waiting for heart surgery are checked for mouth infections -- cavities, abscesses and infected gums.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Don Firth
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 12:36 PM

If you shift to well water, you might want to have it checked to see what might be in it besides H20.

In some areas, asbestos has been found in well water. Seattle stopped using water from one particular local river because it contained small quantities of asbestos.

Most city water has chlorine added to it to kill bacteria. Would you object to this kind of "mass medication?"

Don Firth

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Bert
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 12:40 PM

But Charmion, broccoli is also SO good for you that I want to force it down your throat whether you want it or not.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 07 Jan 14 - 05:41 PM

Spring water pure? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA


ALL have mineral content, some are unusable for animals (including humans) and vegetables.

Around Odessa, Texas, the fluoride content is high in much of the well water. Brown or mottled teeth are the result, but almost no cavities.
The cattle and jackrabbits also have good strong teeth; haven't checked the grasshoppers.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Lighter
Date: 08 Jan 14 - 09:00 AM

This was a big deal in the US *fifty years ago*.

Those leading the charge against fluoridation at that time were the John Birch Society, an organization to the far, far right of the Tea Party. The Birchers believed that President Eisenhower was a Soviet agent.

You'd think that any scientific proof that fluoride was a danger would have been universally accepted by now - at least outside of the bottled water industry (whose products, BTW, often turn out to be less pristine than the tap water in big American cities like New York).

It didn't and it hasn't. Scientists and physicians are still confidently drinking the same tap water as the rest of us.

But in the past twenty years, profits to the bottled water industry have gone through the roof. And they will go higher.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Greg F.
Date: 08 Jan 14 - 10:26 AM

John Birch Society, an organization to the far, far right of the Tea Party

Would that it were so. Many of the Birchers' idiocies have been wholeheartedly adopted by the TeaPublicans.

e.g. have you forgotten that the Prez is a Muslim socialist who isn't an American citizen & is waging class warfare??

And the Birchers are alive and well; check their website at www.jbs.org

Several of their headlines are:

"The Environmentalists' Myth of American Energy Shortages"

"The World Honors Nelson Mandela, a Communist Terrorist"

"Chile on Verge of Electing a Communist President "

"The Removal of God From Public Schools"

"Convince Congress to Defund ObamaCare"

Sure sounds like the Tea Party to me!

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: GUEST,Seaham Cemetry
Date: 08 Jan 14 - 10:41 AM

Since it was added to water here in The UK, children have needed less fillings and false teeth are becoming a thing of the past.

For those who moan about the nanny state, just remember that this is a country, like America, where children are force fed junk food, sweets, crisps and other life threatening shit. The least the government can do is look after their health where irresponsible chavs masquerading as parents fail.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Lighter
Date: 08 Jan 14 - 12:10 PM

Perhaps I should have left out the "far, far."

While many of the TP claim that Obama is a Muslim, none that I've heard of say he's a paid agent of Al Qaeda, which would be the equivalent of the charge against Ike.

They also thought Truman and Kennedy were dangerous Commies and Red agents.

Another big difference between the small JBS and the big TP is that the JBS was at that time rejected by conservatives ranging from Nixon to Goldwater. Its political influence was almost zero. It had no measurable youth appeal.

Nor can I recall anyone being elected to Congress while claiming JBS membership, though I do seem to remember a couple of Congressmen who may have echoed minor JBS points, like the one about fluoridation.

So, Greg, if you're saying that things are just as crazy today, I'd have to say you're wrong.

By and large, they're crazier.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Bert
Date: 08 Jan 14 - 01:05 PM

The Government puts fluoride, which is a poison, in the water and people rush to defend them.

When and ordinary person suggests putting broccoli, which is good for you, in the water then that suggestion is ignored.

I suspect that some of us have a deep seated desire to kowtow to those in positions of authority.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: The Sandman
Date: 08 Jan 14 - 01:10 PM

well said,Bert.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Don Firth
Date: 08 Jan 14 - 01:19 PM

Ye gods!!

We went through this silliness fifty years ago!

Many cities have been adding fluoride to their water since then and--Wonder of Wonders!!--the world has not come to an end.

But people in general have a lot fewer cavities than they did fifty years ago.

A non-issue.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: bobad
Date: 08 Jan 14 - 01:27 PM

"The Government puts fluoride, which is a poison, in the water..."

The dose makes the poison - even water, at a high enough dosage, is a poison.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Bert
Date: 08 Jan 14 - 02:19 PM

The anti-oxidants in broccoli help fight cancer and many other diseases.

I'm sure that the fluoride advocates will get some consolation when dying of cancer, because they will be able to say "But I have a perfect set of teeth".

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Greg F.
Date: 08 Jan 14 - 02:20 PM

Lighter: While many of the TP claim that Obama is a Muslim, none that I've heard of say he's a paid agent of Al Qaeda...

No that was Rep. Louie Gohmert (R-TX) back in October calling John McCain an agent of Al Qaeda.

But I'd call that pretty close........

By and large, they're crazier.

No argument there. That's the Republicans' cuts to education funding of the last 30 years coming home to roost.

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Greg F.
Date: 08 Jan 14 - 02:22 PM

the fluoride advocates will get some consolation when dying of cancer

Where'd you come up with that bullshit, Bert?

Subject: RE: flouride in mains water
From: Bert
Date: 08 Jan 14 - 03:05 PM

Well broccoli helps prevent cancer, fluoride helps prevent cavities. Just put two and two together Greg. We get one in our water supply but not the other, so the Government doesn't care if you die of cancer as long as you have good teeth.

Anyway, the issue is, that because something is good for you it is OK to add it to your water supply.

Well broccoli is good for you. I mean, never in human history has a mother said to her child, "Eat your fluoride or you don't get any dessert".

So why aren't the fluoride advocates demanding that broccoli be added to their water supply? Surely, the principle is the same.