BS: Whither Scotland, Northern Ireland?

Subject: RE: BS: Whither Scotland, Northern Ireland?
From: akenaton
Date: 26 Jun 16 - 04:20 PM

There will NOT be another Independence referendum any time soon Mr McGrath.....and I am as committed to Scottish Independence as I was to the UK's exit from the EU.

Unfortunately the young people of this country are not one homogeneous unit.....most of the remainers are from well off families with a wish to travel the world in their "gap years" and in time join the ranks of the high earning achievers;
In the large cities of Scotland, proper jobs are scarce, many young folk are without future or hope, many are trapped into addiction and criminality.
In countries of the Eurozone youth unemployment is running at 50%, and establishment parties are ineffectual

The young people are ruled by the media and a false childlike ideology...just like we were all these years ago,

Even they, will grow up some day.

Subject: RE: BS: Whither Scotland, Northern Ireland?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 26 Jun 16 - 02:38 PM

I assume that, whatever his views on the EU, aken won't be voting against independence in a second referendum, and nor will other independence minded voters.

As I pointed out many people excluded from voting on the EU will be able to vote in such a referendum, most of whom are likely to vote for staying in the EU. And even if the economic experts do warn that breaking up the UK might be bad for Scotland, the EU referendum suggests that what the economic experts say doesn't necessarily count for too much with angry voters.. A lot of Scots will be indignant at having their choice overuled - and it was a far higher proportion voted to stay in Scotland than voted to go in England.

Subject: RE: BS: Whither Scotland, Northern Ireland?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 26 Jun 16 - 10:21 AM

"The SNP have made a serious mistake in hitching their wagon to the EU"
Yep - can always rely on Good Ol' Britain to look after them - that's why the Conservatives have so many MPs there.
Scotland needs Europe grants to survive especially as the British ship is sinking as fast as it is.
As the Brexits appealed to the basic xenophobia of those worried about their jobs, you mean?
You appear to be a prime example of this
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Whither Scotland, Northern Ireland?
From: mkebenn
Date: 26 Jun 16 - 09:10 AM

Do the more than 3 million supporters for a petition for another vote on separation mean anything beyond "buyer's remorse" or is the issue, as Ake said, done? Mike

Subject: RE: BS: Whither Scotland, Northern Ireland?
From: Thompson
Date: 26 Jun 16 - 08:31 AM

akenaton writes:
The SNP have made a serious mistake in hitching their wagon to the EU

Surely joining a group of states with a common trading area and a common approach to law and practice isn't hitching your wagon to it? Being a member of the EU gives you trading partners.

Britain is due to take on the rotating presidency of the EU, which is ironic; other countries are singing "If you wanna go, go now, go now, go now", hoping to avoid a long limbo period that will be damaging to everyone.

Subject: RE: BS: Whither Scotland, Northern Ireland?
From: Raggytash
Date: 26 Jun 16 - 08:22 AM

The next General Election in the UK can be no later than May 2020, one could be called earlier but does not need to be if the incumbent government does not wish it.

Subject: RE: BS: Whither Scotland, Northern Ireland?
From: Andrez
Date: 26 Jun 16 - 07:48 AM

Out of curiousity, if it takes 2 years to follow the EU exit protocol, when is the next UK general election due in the normal course of things? Is there one due in the next two years before expiry of the exit protocol time? If so when might that be approximately?

Cheers,

Andrez

Subject: RE: BS: Whither Scotland, Northern Ireland?
From: akenaton
Date: 25 Jun 16 - 06:29 PM

The EU referendum has been won....end of story.
Miss Sturgeon has been HWHOP, she wanted a Remain victory so that she would not have to go for a second Indy Ref which will be almost impossible to win given present economic circumstances.

Also those who voted NO to independence are unlikely change their vote to stay in the EU.

Subject: RE: BS: Whither Scotland, Northern Ireland?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 25 Jun 16 - 05:23 PM

Well the proportion vote to stay in the EU in Scotland was much higher than the proportion to leave in the UK as a whole, or in England and Wales.

It would have been perfectly possible to make a decision to leave conditional on all four parts of the UK voting for that. That's what the SNP and Plaid Cymru called for.

In a new referendum there'll be two differences to the EU referendum, both of which would help favour a vote to stayiing in the EU as an independant country - immigrants from the EU will be able to vote, and so will 16 and 17 year olds, as in the last independence referendum.

Subject: RE: BS: Whither Scotland, Northern Ireland?
From: akenaton
Date: 25 Jun 16 - 04:34 PM

The SNP have made a serious mistake in hitching their wagon to the EU

The two issues, Independence and EU membership have become conflated and in reality they are incompatible.

Sturgeon is left in a terrible position, having to push for a referendum that she does not want, over an issue that most of her supporters in the country don't care about.
She pushed her Party supporters into voting Remain to bolster the UK vote and ensure that the Indy Ref issue would not have to be addressed, but "the best laid plans o' mice an' Nicola, gang aft agley"

I am an SNP supporter to gain Independence, but they will need to stop playing politics and their pathetic rights agenda and appeal more to the gut instincts of the Scottish people, or their perceived success at the ballot box will turn out to be yet another false dawn.

Subject: RE: BS: Whither Scotland, Northern Ireland?
From: Thompson
Date: 25 Jun 16 - 03:15 PM

I'd imagine that the Irish passports are desired by people who may want to work and/or live in Europe.

Subject: RE: BS: Whither Scotland, Northern Ireland?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 25 Jun 16 - 02:55 PM

Scotland has moved towards another referendum in Independence and Northern Ireland is considering a border referendum.
Both voted overwhelmingly to stay in the E.U. - Northern Ireland in particular will lose out heavily when Britain leaves - their industry depends heavily on E.U. grants.
It was announced a few hours ago that the Irish Post Offices have reported a record number of requests for application forms for Republic of Ireland passports.
Haven't seen hordes of refugees pouring over the border or people smuggling yet - early days!!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Whither Scotland, Northern Ireland?
From: Thompson
Date: 25 Jun 16 - 02:42 PM

Ireland (Republic) exports a lot to Europe. What's Scotland's main export market? Northern Ireland's?

Subject: BS: Wither Scotland, Northern Ireland?
From: mkebenn
Date: 25 Jun 16 - 08:54 AM

Being across the pond and rather distracted with our own shit, would the aforementioned be better of or even viable w/o the UK and still in the EU? And would North unite with Ireland? Mike