BS: UNESCO, you're better off

Subject: BS: UNESCO, you're better off
From: Mrrzy
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 05:19 PM

I mean really, what have they done to offend him? Kneel at the wrong time?

Subject: RE: BS: UNESCO, you're better off
From: pdq
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 06:29 PM

Because Israel asked us to.

An explanation:

"The recent UNESCO resolutions concerning Jerusalem and Hebron are precisely what terror groups that deny Israel's right to exist, such as Hamas, have long been hoping to hear from the international community.

The first resolution denies that Israel is the sovereign power over Jerusalem, including the Western Wall, while the second one designates Hebron and the Jewish Tomb of the Patriarchs as an "Endangered Palestinian World Heritage Site."

The two UNESCO resolutions, in fact, back the position of Hamas and other Palestinians -- namely that Israel has no right to exist. These decisions provide Hamas and other terror groups with ammunition with which to destroy Israel, killing as many Jews as possible in the process.

Is it any wonder, then, that Hamas leaders were rubbing their hands with glee upon the announcement of the UNESCO resolutions? Hamas can now crow: 'We told you that the Jews are just retrofitting their claims for 3000 or 4000 years of history in this area; now even the international community endorses the idea that Jewish history in the region is a lie...' "

Subject: RE: BS: UNESCO, you're better off
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 06:43 PM

Delete, mods.

Subject: RE: BS: UNESCO, you're better off
From: bobad
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 08:23 PM

UNESCO has lost all credibility by supporting such history distorting resolutions like those that deny any Jewish or Christian ties to the Temple Mount and the Western Wall.

The Centre for Israel and Jewish Affairs, a Canada-based advocacy group, likened the UNESCO resolution to a story worthy of the satirical news website The Onion, and also highlighted what is said was disregard for Christian tradition.

“1,900 years before #UNESCO, Jews prayed facing & mourned the destruction of our Temple. Our memory is not determined by a UNESCO vote,” the CIJA tweeted. “To deny Temple Mount’s Jewish roots is to erase Christian Bible too. How many faiths did #UNESCO offend today?”

Subject: RE: BS: UNESCO, you're better off
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 09:00 PM

"How many faiths did #UNESCO offend today?"

In an ideal world... all of 'em..!!!!

So much so, they all ran home crying there eyes out to hide under their bed clothes..
never to be seen or heard of again...

Like I said... in an ideal world......

Subject: RE: BS: UNESCO, you're better off
From: bobad
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 09:25 PM

In an ideal world... all of 'em..!!!!

Excepting, of course, the one to which the majority of the resolution supporting countries adhere.

Subject: RE: BS: UNESCO, you're better off
From: Joe Offer
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 10:31 PM

OK, this isn't at all clear to me what's happening. Can somebody give an explanation and link to (relatively) unbiased reference sources.
I have sympathy for both Palestinians and Israelis, and I think they're stuck between a rock and a hard place. I sure wish some ultimately wise person would come up with a solution that would bring peace in Israel and Palestine.
So many of the sites in the area are sacred to three religions. Therefore, I think something must be done to set it all aside as a sacred place of peace for all.
-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: UNESCO, you're better off
From: meself
Date: 12 Oct 17 - 10:52 PM

Hey, Jared's got it covered - no worries!

Subject: RE: BS: UNESCO, you're better off
From: DMcG
Date: 13 Oct 17 - 02:35 AM

OK, this isn't at all clear to me what's happening.

I sympathise, Joe. What is happening is a mish-mash of forces and interests coming together in a way so that there is no simple story to tell. Some is about a debt that the US is building up. Some is about an isolationist view which thinks the idea that the US contributes to supporting world heritage sites outside the US is wrong as matter of principle. But in the main it was the recognition of Hebron as a world heritage site.

Slightly edited clip from The Guardian:

The UN’s world heritage body has recognised the old city of Hebron in the West Bank as a Palestinian world heritage site, sparking outrage from Israel.


Efforts by Israel failed to stop the UNESCO ruling on the city, which includes a holy site known to Muslims as the Ibrahimi mosque and Jews as the Tomb of the Patriarchs.

Twelve countries on the world heritage committee voted in favour of the Palestinian request to name Hebron a heritage site, while only three voted against it. Six countries abstained.


So the row is not really whether the site should be protected: calling it the Tomb of the Patriachs would probably have allowed that.   No, the row is over the fact that the Palestinian's requested it, and in granting it UNESCO recognised the existence of Palestine in a sense which Israel objects to. And in their eyes, that is anti-Israel bias.

Subject: RE: BS: UNESCO, you're better off
From: DMcG
Date: 13 Oct 17 - 03:00 AM

Incidentally, I rarely visit a country or town without looking up what UNESCO World Heritage sites might be nearby: not for me, lying on a beach. But while the sites are frequently impressive and on the grand scale - Toledo, Machu Picchu, Durham for example - they also have others that are small scale but have an important, perhaps dark, history. For example, Aapravasi Ghat.

That the town in question has a disputed or complex history is not unique amongst UNESCO sites.

Subject: RE: BS: UNESCO, you're better off
From: Iains
Date: 13 Oct 17 - 03:28 AM

Very worrying that when Israel says jump the US obeys.

Subject: RE: BS: UNESCO, you're better off
From: Mrrzy
Date: 13 Oct 17 - 09:15 AM

Yeah, I first heard it was the US, which was shocking, then that it was the US and Israel, which I found oddly comforting (hey, it wasn't just us), and now I am un-comforted. Sigh.

Subject: RE: BS: UNESCO, you're better off
From: bobad
Date: 13 Oct 17 - 10:16 AM

Actually the US pulled out of UNESCO in protest in 1985 and returned in 2003. Obama cut funding in 2011. The UK pulled out in 1986 and returned in 1997.

The problem with UNESCO - which is actually an organisation that is - in theory - good, is that it has long ago abandoned its mission. Instead it has turned into a political, racist, anti-Semitic bunch of thugs who don't care about preserving history at all, but rather eliminating Jewish history instead.

Subject: RE: BS: UNESCO, you're better off
From: DMcG
Date: 13 Oct 17 - 10:28 AM

All 1073 sites?

Subject: RE: BS: UNESCO, you're better off
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 13 Oct 17 - 12:39 PM

UNESCO is thereby greatly improved.

Subject: RE: BS: UNESCO, you're better off
From: Greg F.
Date: 13 Oct 17 - 05:10 PM

And in their eyes, that is anti-Israel bias.

In their eyes, REALITY has an anti-Israel bias.

Subject: RE: BS: UNESCO, you're better off
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 14 Oct 17 - 05:31 AM

On a current and related issue, an agreement has been reached passing control of Gaza from Hamas to the PA.
"In exchange, the Palestinian president, Mahmoud Abbas, and the PA are expected to lift crippling restrictions on electricity supply to Gaza that have made the lives of its 2 million residents miserable in recent months."

(Restrictions imposed by other Palestinians, not Israelis.)

"Previous efforts to reach a negotiated reconciliation between the two factions – such as in 2014 – have been announced before but have always faltered.
The current round of talks have focused on issues with broader areas of agreement between the two sides – leaving out the most contentious points, most significantly the future of Hamas’s 25,000-strong armed wing in Gaza."
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/oct/12/hamas-claims-deal-agreed-fatah-control-gaza-strip

Subject: RE: BS: UNESCO, you're better off
From: robomatic
Date: 14 Oct 17 - 12:04 PM

I think Bobad has got most of the facts right and I subscribe to the opinion that for some time UNESCO has been subject to strong anti-Israel forces, but in general I support the United Nations on the overall idea that "Yes, the game is rigged. But it's the only game in town."