BS: Understanding the other political side

Subject: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: beardedbruce
Date: 24 Jun 19 - 05:52 PM

"Americans often lament the rise of “extreme partisanship,” but this is a poor description of political reality: Far from increasing, Americans’ attachment to their political parties has considerably weakened over the past years. Liberals no longer strongly identify with the Democratic Party and conservatives no longer strongly identify with the Republican Party.

What is corroding American politics is, specifically, negative partisanship: Although most liberals feel conflicted about the Democratic Party, they really hate the Republican Party. And even though most conservatives feel conflicted about the Republican Party, they really hate the Democratic Party.

America’s political divisions are driven by hatred of an out-group rather than love of the in-group. The question is: Why?"


https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/06/republicans-and-democrats-dont-understand-each-other/592324/?utm_medium=offsit

"Perhaps because institutions of higher learning tend to be dominated by liberals, Republicans who have gone to college are not more likely to caricature their ideological adversaries than those who dropped out of high school. But among Democrats, education seems to make the problem much worse. Democrats who have a high-school degree suffer from a greater perception gap than those who don’t. Democrats who went to college harbor greater misunderstandings than those who didn’t. And those with a postgrad degree have a way more skewed view of Republicans than anybody else."

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 24 Jun 19 - 08:33 PM

sounds a bit like - the other side is too dim to share my wonderful insights.

that's pretty much where we are at in England too.

Its easier to see the speck of sawdust in someone else's eye than the plank in your own. I think Bob Dylan said that.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: robomatic
Date: 24 Jun 19 - 08:41 PM

I had a lot higher opinions of Republicans before they cheated in the '00 election,before Mitch McConnell went over permanently to the dark side "Our purpose is to deny Obama a second term" flouting what was good for the country, then cheating again to deny Obama his right to appoint a middle of the road justice to the Supreme Court, and that yellow stained Speaker, Boner or something, bragging about shafting Hillary, and many other Republicans adding cowardice to their evil ways and first fighting then endorsing a man with deep personality issues to be the 'leader' of the free world, which he, therefore WE (USA) no longer is and are.

That now goes by default to Merkel.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: beardedbruce
Date: 24 Jun 19 - 08:45 PM

Did you read the article before your rant?

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 24 Jun 19 - 09:01 PM

Well who'd have thunk that education makes people thicker, but only if you happen to be a Democrat...and that never following the news helps you to understand people better...

I can only conclude from all this that Trump was elected exclusively by extremely well-educated people who avidly keep up with world affairs...

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Mossback
Date: 24 Jun 19 - 09:09 PM

Typical Bruce, Steve- better not to waste your time methinks.

However,its really quite easy to understand the current Republican party.

‘Brain dead’: Conservative writer explains how the right wing abandoned its principles

Alex Henderson        January 4, 2019

Jennifer Rubin has spent a considerable amount of time attacking President Donald Trump and his followers. But the friendly tone Rubin has had with Rachel Maddow, Joy Reid and other MSNBC liberals doesn’t erase the fact that she is a conservative, and Rubin’s most recent Post column asserts that there is still “intellectual energy” and “depth” among those on the right who haven’t succumbed to Trumpism.

As she makes clear, the Trumpist version the party is completely devoid of these attributes, giving her piece the title, “The right need not be brain-dead.” The conservative movement of 2019, Rubin laments, is “dominated by bootlicking from state TV, climate change denial, ‘blood and soil’ nationalism and economic illiteracy.” ....

Watching smart people fruitlessly insist on arguing evidence and facts with conservatives who clearly have no respect for either got under my skin. "Triggering the libs" has become the single most important goal of the modern American right.

All it requires is a shameless willingness to say obviously false things, and then watch your opponents -- still romantically attached to the idea of reasoned debate -- grow increasingly desperate in insisting that objective reality should inform one's opinions.

The maxim to live by is that you can't reason someone out of a belief they didn't reason themselves into. Evidence, facts and rational argument are all pretty useless when you're dealing with a person who rejects the value of all those things.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 24 Jun 19 - 09:11 PM

We're in serious danger of getting the same thing here.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: beardedbruce
Date: 24 Jun 19 - 09:12 PM

No, one can only conclude that the people electing Trump found the Democratic candidate to be even worse than Trump.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 24 Jun 19 - 09:18 PM

Well if you're right you have the stupidest electorate on earth.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: beardedbruce
Date: 24 Jun 19 - 09:24 PM

Obviously- after all, the claim is that a greater number voted for Hillary. THAT proves your statement, doesn't it?

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: beardedbruce
Date: 24 Jun 19 - 09:27 PM

Trump is merely a shady businessman, who shoots his mouth off.

Hillary was a traitor, who put her preferences above
the safety of the United States while serving in a high level Federal position.
"Classified information is material that a government body deems to be sensitive information that must be protected. Access is
restricted by law or regulation to particular groups of people with the necessary security clearance and need to know, and
intentionally mishandling of the material can incur criminal penalties. A formal security clearance is required to view or handle
classified documents or to access classified data. The clearance process requires a satisfactory background investigation.
Documents and other information must be properly marked by the author with one of several (hierarchical) levels of sensitivity—e.g.
restricted, confidential, secret and top secret. The choice of level is based on an impact assessment; governments have their own
criteria, which include how to determine the classification of an information asset, and rules on how to protect information
classified at each level."

Top Secret is the highest level of classified information. Information is further compartmented so that specific access using
a code word after top secret is a legal way to hide collective and important information. Such material would cause
"exceptionally grave damage" to national security if made publicly available.

Secret material would cause "serious damage" to national security if it were publicly available.

Yet she says "What does it matter?"

That is a kick in the gut to everyone who has ever had a clearance, and protected the information held as expected .

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: beardedbruce
Date: 24 Jun 19 - 09:34 PM

Security for Idiots and Democratic Politicians

When a piece of information is crucial and can cause serious damage to the national security can be considered classified information. Based on the severity of the damage, classified information can be categorized as top secret (if leaked can cause highest level of damage), secret and confidential (will not cause significant damage if confidential information get leaked).

You may have to hand classified information if you are working with intelligence agency or come across classified information for your professional reason. If you have vague idea of how to handle classified information, remember and follow the following general guidelines when you handle classified documents.

If you are an approve custodian of classified information, you need to remember that it is your duty to protect the confidentiality of the information. You must safeguard this information or documents all the times. If this information get lost, disclosed or get compromised for any reason from you, you will be held accountable for it and may be persecuted according to the law of your local or state laws.
Normally, when you join a job that requires you to handle with classified information, your supervisor or security office will brief you about their rules for handling sensitive documents. If you are not briefed for any reason or if you have doubt about anything, consult with your immediate supervisor for guidance.
If you are a custodian of classified documents, you need to make sure that it is kept in a proper security container that is approved by the authority. When you are leaving office you need to ensure that all classified material is secured as per organizational security guidelines.
When you find that classified document is unattended such as in someone’s desk, you need to ensure it security. You must inform about it to the security personals or the custodian the information. Do not leave the information in unattended state. You can either carry the information with you or hand it over to the proper person, or you can lock it in a safe place and then inform it to the authority.
If you are working with classified material, do not carry it to your home. You must avoid working with classified document at home
When you need to dispose classified information, do not dispose it in any waste basket. You can either shred or burn it so that information becomes irretrievable.
You may have to send email for business reason or have to post information in the job board for recruitment. Before posting anything online or sending email make sure that your content does not have any classified information. If your organization has a policy for use of Internet, follow it and become absolute sure about which information is considered unclassified according to your organization’s policy.
When you make a draft make sure if it conations any classified information. If your draft contains any sensitive information, you must destroy it properly when you no longer need it.
When handling any hard disk and other storage devices, make sure they do not contain any classified data unless they are supposed to do so.
You should pay similar attention and care when handling any foreign documents that you may need for your project or any other endeavor.
If you have to transmit sensitive document from one location to another location, make sure you receive a receipt from the recipients and preserver it in the sender’s office.
Some classified documents may be subject to special security measures and controls because the normal security measures are not sufficient to protect the information. Therefore, when you handle classified information, make sure if it is subject to any special type of controls. If it needs to be handled with special control you need to follow the exact procedures that ensure you handle it with extra security measures.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: beardedbruce
Date: 24 Jun 19 - 09:36 PM

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/798

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: beardedbruce
Date: 24 Jun 19 - 09:41 PM

https://www.factcheck.org/2016/07/clintons-handling-of-classified-information/

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Mossback
Date: 24 Jun 19 - 10:07 PM

Security Bruce is throwing another tantrum and talking to himself again. Ignore him, and hopefully he'll run out of hot air.

To review:

Evidence, facts and rational argument are all pretty useless when you're dealing with a person who rejects the value of all those things.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 24 Jun 19 - 10:15 PM

I'll just mention it's hard enough understanding your own side a lot of the time.
Even more confusing if sometimes you're not even certain which side you're on any more,
or if you even ever were on a side...?????

Perplexing or what...!!!???

Sides are a bit shit really when you think about it...

Centre.. all together in the middle.. hmmmm.. sounds good..
but that doesn't really work either, does it...

What with the far right claiming to be the real centre,
the true voice of normality,
whilst accusing the liberals and left of being the intolerant fascists...???

The world's gone bonkers...

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: robomatic
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 12:15 AM

BB:

I don't know about you, but I enjoyed the rant if I do say so myself. I could probably embellish on it, but hey...Now I'm gonna stick with the article, which I think had a deep grasp of the superficial.

I know many conservatives, and since I'm in Alaska, I have to navel gaze to sample the liberals...

There is a lot of BS that people who follow Twitter and the unanalyzed un-Snope checked articles might believe. I just heard of a recent case where a snapchat was aimed at young people which was a photograph of a text therefore had passed through any check software which didn't perceive the text. It was a poorly spelled article which claimed that Hilary was assassinating FBI folks. This is but a sample of the outright challenge being made to rational discourse, specifically to undermine democracy.

I have read some good Atlantic articles. This is a short shrift from a contributor and I wasn't impressed.

Among the conservatives I know, LGBTQ and interracial relationships are old hat. Among the liberals I know, there is a core of common sense.

The Atlantic article you reference just rehashes the old misperception meme which is true enough, but does not address the high strangeness we are truly in making every attempt to maximize political torsion.

In times like this I go to my old psychological bedrock reference, Star Trek (TOS). There was an episode where some incorporeal aliens gained access to both Federation and Klingon personnel and fed on the hatred it could evoke between them by what we call 'stirring the pot'. At last they were driven off and the Feds and Klings could go on hating each other normally.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: meself
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 12:54 AM

One party supports the separation of children from parents, their warehousing, and their subsequent neglect. The other party opposes same. Fine people on both sides.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: robomatic
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 02:28 AM

I have to modify my recent post. I meant Instagram being used as a means of disinformation. Reference story here. Note that when "IRA" is mentioned in that article it refers to an innocuous sounding "Internet Research Agency" but it's a Russian hacking group, according to the article.

Hillary was not a perfect candidate, but prior to the election she'd been identified as the most likely Democratic candidate for 2016 and savagely attacked with anything that might 'stick to the wall.' The Benghazi fantasies flew far and wide and never really made much sense, but they were unrelenting. As for email. It was just email.

On the other hand, the story of how her campaign manager John Podesta got his email account penetrated with a fairly stupid ploy is pretty outrageous. Falling for that and not getting wise to it rapidly is a dumb low-level fail.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Mr Red
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 04:01 AM

people electing Trump found the Democratic candidate to be even worse than Trump

Looking from the relative distance of the UK, what did for Hilary was the revelation of her e-mails. Which was from the interference of Russia. And Twitler still claims he never asked Russia. He didn't have to ask, he has minions and Russia would be only too glad to oblige.

And anyone who thinks Fakebook is not a conduit for manipulation, should look to its history. Obama used it to summon the faithful, the Arab Spring. And Russia are past masters at cyber crime and propaganda, and have a vested interest in the result. Make the connection!
There is evidence of refugees earning $1000 a month producing Fake Fakebook accounts and propagating whatever they were told to. Certainly one going public just post the UK referendum, revealing he was not alone.

Other anti-social media are available.

There are psychological techniques to propaganda that you would miss. Like showing horrific pictures is likely to move people towards the right, and it only needs a small percentage to be swayed in a first past the post type election. Large bold typeface, coloured background we know it is shouting but do we spot that or read the message?

These tricks are not about the other side that will refuse to "understand". It is just a nudge in the middle distance of the political landscape.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: beardedbruce
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 09:40 AM

"Evidence, facts and rational argument are all pretty useless when you're dealing with a person who rejects the value of all those things."

And most of the liberals here have rejected ALL facts that they do not apriori agree with.(SRS rule)


Let me see..

Hillary lies to FBI- Nothing happens
Republicans lie to FBI- Jail Time

Hillary intentionally mishandles classified information- Nothing happens
ANYONE ELSE who even unintentionally violates the rules for handling classified information - Jail time


Obama says that Hillary is innocent- Nothing said about it
Truump says his aides were innocent- Liberals say that is interference with the investigation



As a former AISSR and COMSEC Custodian at the Secret level, I do NOT think that the NSA would consider that "As for email. It was just email."


As long as EITHER side is unwilling to LISTEN to the other side, there can be NO resolution of the problems that this country has.


Mossback and his ilk are providing more support for Trump than Trump is capable of getting on his own.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Mrrzy
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 09:53 AM

Hillary was the best-qualified candidate in decades. But no penis, so, bad and evil were the only arguments against her. Worked, too.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 09:53 AM

"Hillary lies to FBI- Nothing happens
Republicans lie to FBI- Jail Time"

Trump lies to everybody all the time - will probably be re-elected.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Mossback
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 09:57 AM

Hillary was a traitor, who put her preferences above
the safety of the United States...

A Traitor? Jesus wept.

The e-mails episode was thoroughly investigated by the FBI which determined there was no criminal wrong-doing.

Of course if one thinks the FBI is 'the enemy of the people' and has no use for the rule of law or 'innocent until proven guilty' as Poor Persecuted Benghazi Bruce apparently does, then all bets are off.

To review:

....you can't reason someone out of a belief they didn't reason themselves into. Evidence, facts and rational argument are all pretty useless when you're dealing with a person who rejects the value of all those things.


As a former AISSR and COMSEC Custodian at the Secret level...

WOW Can't begin to tell you how impressed we all are. And of course that makes you infallible. What A Guy!

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: beardedbruce
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 11:20 AM

"Hillary was the best-qualified candidate in decades."

Almost as qualified as Nixon- except he HAD been VP. ASk someone about her being the head of the American Red Cross, and how that went...

Condeleeza Rice would have made a great president, but of course was not a rich Democrat, so she could never run.

https://news.yahoo.com/civil-war-coming-democratic-party-100010457.html

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 11:24 AM

I had to sign the official secrets act..
For a job that involved pushing amputees around in wheelchairs,
and taking them to the toilet.

I'm certainly not at liberty to divulge how I had to accomodate the needs of men who'd lost both arms..

That's how seriously we Brits take secrecy..

oops.. I shouldn't have disclosed that much...

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: beardedbruce
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 11:30 AM

Oh, shouldn't that be
'innocent until proven Republican'?

Since that is what those here have been putting forward.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 11:34 AM

I'm sure you must have some sensible republicans - many most probably.
If I lived in the USA I'd have no problems interacting with them as a friend.
Unless they proved too hostile to knowing me because I'm a not only a bit of a lefty,
but also a limey....

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: gillymor
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 11:36 AM

I once extracted a secret decoder ring from a box of cereal. Proud day for me in my young life.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: beardedbruce
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 12:00 PM

Try again:

"WOW Can't begin to tell you how impressed we all are. And of course that makes you infallible. What A Guy!"

No, it means that I have had security training that you seem incapable of understanding.


"Of course if one thinks the FBI is 'the enemy of the people' and has no use for the rule of law or 'innocent until proven guilty'"

Which is what YOU have done:

We now know from the FBI investigation that:

More than 2,000 of the 30,490 emails Clinton turned over to the State Department contained classified information, including 110 emails in 52 email chains that contained classified information at the time they were sent or received. (Most emails were retroactively deemed to contain classified information by the U.S. agencies from which the information originated.)
Some of the emails containing classified information “bore markings indicating the presence of classified information,” contrary to Clinton’s claims that none was marked classified. Comey did not provide a specific number.
“[S]everal thousand work-related emails” were not turned over to the State Department in 2014, but were recovered by the FBI. Comey said “three of those were classified at the time they were sent or received.”
At his July 5 press conference, Comey announced his office will not recommend that charges be brought against Clinton or her staff. But the FBI director said Clinton and her staff “were extremely careless in their handling of very sensitive, highly classified information.”

“Only a very small number of the emails containing classified information bore markings indicating the presence of classified information,” Comey said. “But even if information is not marked ‘classified’ in an email, participants who know or should know that the subject matter is classified are still obligated to protect it.”



I will note that
" Poor Persecuted Benghazi Bruce apparently does, then all bets are off." is ok, but to mention the illustrious Mossback is reason to have a post deleted.

Thank you for demonstrating the Liberal View that Free Sperech is only allowed when the Mudelves agree with it.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 12:07 PM

I think that anyone who complains out loud that their post has been deleted should be deleted. There's too much of it going on here at the moment. Get a life is my advice. It's not your gig.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: beardedbruce
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 12:23 PM

Thank you for demonstrating the Liberal View that Free Speech is only allowed when the Liberal Authorities agree with it.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: beardedbruce
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 12:25 PM

"Comey announced his office will not recommend that charges be brought against Clinton or her staff. But the FBI director said Clinton and her staff “were extremely careless in their handling of very sensitive, highly classified information."

Sounds a lot like Mueller, but of course you Liberals have all stated that means that Trump should be impeached.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Mossback
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 12:32 PM

Ya know, Secret Agent Bruce, if you actually believed in 'free speech' or even knew what it was, you wouldn't piss and moan so much when someone exercises THEIRS to call you out on the absolute bullshit you post.

And now I'm done with this godforsaken thread.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Ebbie
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 12:42 PM

bearded bruce, you say: "Yet she says "What does it matter?"

You have just been outed- as if there had been any doubt- as dishonest. As you must very well know, that statement is used by dishonest people who hope that no one knows the truth. You have joined the ranks.

I dare you to give the context.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: beardedbruce
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 01:23 PM

Since I was referring to her making fun of the questions about the emails, LET ME REPHRASE:

Hillary was a traitor, who put her preferences above
the safety of the United States while serving in a high level Federal position.
"Classified information is material that a government body deems to be sensitive information that must be protected. Access is
restricted by law or regulation to particular groups of people with the necessary security clearance and need to know, and
intentionally mishandling of the material can incur criminal penalties. A formal security clearance is required to view or handle
classified documents or to access classified data. The clearance process requires a satisfactory background investigation.
Documents and other information must be properly marked by the author with one of several (hierarchical) levels of sensitivity—e.g.
restricted, confidential, secret and top secret. The choice of level is based on an impact assessment; governments have their own
criteria, which include how to determine the classification of an information asset, and rules on how to protect information
classified at each level."

Top Secret is the highest level of classified information. Information is further compartmented so that specific access using
a code word after top secret is a legal way to hide collective and important information. Such material would cause
"exceptionally grave damage" to national security if made publicly available.

Secret material would cause "serious damage" to national security if it were publicly available.

Yet she says makes light of it, and by her joking shows she does not consider the welfare of the United States to be as important as her convenience.


Is that better?

NOW explain how someone who willfully treats classified information in violation of the rules is NOT a traitor?

Comey announced his office will not recommend that charges be brought against Clinton or her staff. But the FBI director said Clinton and her staff “were extremely careless in their handling of very sensitive, highly classified information."


That is a kick in the gut to everyone who has ever had a clearance, and protected the information held as expected .

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 01:35 PM

From a British perspective she was a poor candidate.
She looked too much of a liability,
too easy for the opposition to persuade undecided voters to reject her..

We thought, surely the Dems must have better...???

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: beardedbruce
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 01:41 PM

They did, but she bought the Dem leadership. Too bad so many Liberals feel it a requirement to support her- in spite of her proven illegal acts in getting the nomination.

The ONLY person Trump could have beaten was Hillary- so I guess that means they wanted Trump to win.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: gillymor
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 06:40 PM

Once again, she beat President Racist Dumbass Misogynist Asshole by 3 million votes so it wasn't the candidate that was lacking it was the antiquated electoral system that is a holdover from the slavery era. Not too hard to understand.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: robomatic
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 06:43 PM

BB: Comey obviously did not find Hillary's behavior criminal. He and the FBI did a thorough going over of her email, including the spill-over/ copies found on her aide's husbands computer. I think that justifies his comment that she could have handled the emails better, but it was emails not secrets.
I'm pretty sure that there were comments to the effect that other highly placed government officials such as Colin Powell, handled their email with less than official discretion.

As for Hillary getting away with something, I think that is obviously fallacious.

I've listened to folks like Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity and they are not in any manner purveyors of truth. They are similar to The Current Occupant in that they are BSers. They tell neither lie nor truth. They continually toss stuff at the wall until something sticks. They've been doing it for years. I think there is an atmosphere of contempt on their parts for anyone who either bothers to argue against such obvious crap and even a little more for those who swallow it whole.... Remember Trump's "I love the uneducated!" No lie there.

Now BB: you might just be spinning up folks your own self, so I'm not going to get into a whole 'thing' with you here. There is plenty wrong with some of the so-called Liberals out there, there is a maximizing of 'identity politics', a fresh term for an old and legitimate practice, which borders on racism. But that is relatively minor in the totality of American politics.

Besides, harping on Hillary is a loser's tactic IMHO. It's a clear diversive tactic on the part of the FOX bloviators who are constantly drawing attention from Trump using the argument: "Who are you going to believe? Me or your lying eyes?"

I think you're better than that.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 06:45 PM

Maybe a better candidate mght have won by a far more decisive and indesputable majority...???

We couldn't help thinking the Dems had let down all of us in the rest of the world...

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: beardedbruce
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 08:01 PM

I stated that

"No, one can only conclude that the people electing Trump found the Democratic candidate to be even worse than Trump."

Can ANY of you find real fault with that statement, to justify the abuse heaped on me?

YOUR opinion of Hillary is just fine- you want to elect someone who has demonstrated her disdain for the US, and her support of her husband rape of women, do so.

But the comments made here about Trump indicate many have a double standard, and chastise him for actions that the same poster permits Hillary to get away with unremarked.



"Comey obviously did not find Hillary's behavior criminal"

Or felt he could not go against the sitting President who had declared her innocence before the investigation even started.    (JUST like Trump did with his aides who lied to the FBI ( As Hillary did, according to the FBI https://www.factcheck.org/2016/07/clintons-handling-of-classified-information/   -- but it is impeachable for Trump, and acceptable for Obama, right?)

As Mueller did not find Trump's behavior to be criminal- but the Dems want to impeach him anyway.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Mossback
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 09:36 PM

I think you're better than that.

Obviously an erroneous conclusion, Robo, as 08:01 PM demonstrates, and as will succeeding fact-free bloviations.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 25 Jun 19 - 11:39 PM

I didn't know Bill Clinton had been convicted of rape, or even was suspected of it.

Over in England he's still rather respected for heping to bring peace to Northern Ireland.

As a young man he studied in England as a Rhodes scholar ( as Kris Kristoferson had), people who knew him thought he was of good character.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: meself
Date: 26 Jun 19 - 12:17 AM

So - what the Republican monsters are doing to the children at the border is okay because - Hilary, right?

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 26 Jun 19 - 10:18 AM

Dunno what happened there so I'll try again: what "rape of women," Bruce? Care to elaborate?

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Mossback
Date: 26 Jun 19 - 10:22 AM

Just one of Super-Security Bruce's "alternative facts", Steve. Points up the truthiness of the rest of his bullshit.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Charmion
Date: 26 Jun 19 - 10:55 AM

As an experienced bureaucrat and trained historian who spent her entire working life in or near the belly of the security state, I am here to tell you this very important truth:

To a very large extent, information security programs -- including COMSEC -- are excellent examples of the famous self-licking ice cream cone.

And yes, I have been a COMSEC custodian. I have also been through the NSA operations security course, and served on the OPSEC working group at a military operational headquarters.

But for many years I earned my living declassifying old military operational records. From that experience, I learned that nothing is quite so dead as an overtaken-by-events military or diplomatic secret, and the only reason most governments want to restrict such information is that it often shows that Our Fearless Leaders can be credulous goofs.

As for Hillary and her emails, yawn.

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: Mossback
Date: 26 Jun 19 - 11:21 AM

Say it ain't so, Charmion! You'll wound poor little Superpatriot Security Brucie's fragile ego & surely make him cry!

Or at least rant, which is much worse for everyone..

Subject: RE: BS: Understanding the other political side
From: beardedbruce
Date: 26 Jun 19 - 01:08 PM

Charmion,

And your thought on those people who willfully violate the rules established by the NSA? What is your opinion on that- The information that Hillary exposed was current, and in many cases ( NOT ALL) was not even classified until AFTER she had gotten it. The exposure of THAT information can even be waved away- but the information taht she received as classified, and then exposed ( at all levels, including TS) deserves to, and in the case of anyone else would have, gotten multiple 5 year terms of jail time.

Right?