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BS: Another shooting in US
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Subject: BS: Baseball the US kind From: Donuel Date: 18 Jul 21 - 07:31 AM Only 3 were wounded. https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/17/us/washington-nationals-park-shooting-saturday/index.html |
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Subject: RE: BS: Baseball the US kind From: Steve Shaw Date: 18 Jul 21 - 08:47 AM It's called rounders here, and is played mainly by big lusty girls with slightly chapped thighs. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Baseball the US kind From: Stilly River Sage Date: 18 Jul 21 - 11:08 AM This isn't typical at baseball games, but shootings are typical in the US. I'm changing the thread title. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 18 Jul 21 - 02:22 PM Isolated incident. All the shootings here are isolated incidents because they all do not happen in the same place or time. The gallows humor of 'Baseball-the US kind' is lost with title change. If it is about another shooting, 6 adults were wounded and one 6 year old girl was killed in a different drive through shooting in DC last night/ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: SPB-Cooperator Date: 18 Jul 21 - 05:23 PM Dropping into NRA speak - if the 6 year old had an assualt weapon, she could have took out every car driver and passenger in DC - just in case. . |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: keberoxu Date: 18 Jul 21 - 06:28 PM This gallows humor isn't amusing. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Stilly River Sage Date: 24 May 22 - 07:16 PM Uvlade, Texas, is over in the Hill Country of Central Texas and is a lovely rolling hills area with interesting small towns. It's southwest of the town of Utopia, with San Antonio as the nearest large city. It's on people's radar as a town near a couple of nice state parks, and now, alas, it is on the map because of a horrible shooting. Again. Last week a grocery store in Buffalo, since then several shootings with smaller numbers of victims, and now, another elementary school shot up. 14 Students, 1 Teacher Dead in Texas School Shooting Gov. Greg Abbott, who announced the death toll, said the gunman was also dead. It was the deadliest elementary school shooting since the 2012 massacre in Newtown, Conn. Even without reading the article but seeing the name of the shooter, it fits the classic pattern - the shooter is brown or black, so he's dead. The shooting in Buffalo was white, so he's alive. The news will sort it out to see if this is true, or just a truism. Texas is bleeding guns; they're everywhere and no permits are needed. It's the fault of those people who felt that more would be better somehow. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Bonzo3legs Date: 25 May 22 - 01:30 AM USAian idiocy, will they never learn????????????? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 25 May 22 - 06:32 AM We can not learn our way out of; insanity, cowardice, body armor, guns, craven politician, thoughts and prayers, |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in USa From: SPB-Cooperator Date: 25 May 22 - 07:25 AM America- you have been asked over and over again - what is more important to you, your childrens' lives or your guns? Your excuse seems to be that the disease is so rife that it would take too much to cure - but until you start doing something the sure will never happen. It is your simple choice start doing something about it, or just admit that kids being massacred doesn't matter to you. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 25 May 22 - 07:37 AM Of course it hasn't mattered. Only 90% are for gun safety. Even Republicans have to be an elected official to be for gun proliferation. An enraged 18 year old is a well organized miitia according to the High Court. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Backwoodsman Date: 25 May 22 - 07:44 AM Three words for our US friends - ‘Hungerford’, ‘Dunblane’, and ‘Port Arthur’. Why those three? Because following each of those gun-massacres, two in the UK, the third in Australia, our governments acted with courage and strength to remove firearms from the ownership of the general public (except in very specific circumstances, and then subject to very stringent controls). Wilfully-blind gun-nut Americans refuse steadfastly to acknowledge the correlation between availability of firearms and the number of gun-deaths in our three respective countries, but it is an absolute, undeniable (except by the delusional and stupid) fact that countries with strong gun-controls suffer significantly fewer deaths by shooting than those, like the US, who allow virtually any Tom, Dick, and Harry (or Harriet, for that matter) to arm themselves to the teeth. There’s no need to quote the statistics here, they are readily available on the internet for anyone who cares sufficiently about the scourge of shootings in the US to check out The US needs to take a lead from the governments of the UK and Australia, grow a set of cojones, and take guns out of their citizens’ hands - no ordinary person living in a civilised country ‘needs’ a gun. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 25 May 22 - 08:16 AM NYT https://www.nytimes.com/live/2022/05/24/us/shooting-robb-elementary-uvalde "Its too soon to talk about this" Sen. Mitch McConnel The NRA convention with Trump in Houston this weekend is silently glad that the victims lately have been old blacks and young kids with Mexican names. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Steve Shaw Date: 25 May 22 - 08:44 AM I wish that US politicians (I give up hope apropos of the gun lobby) would hang on to every word of Joe Biden's statement. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: MaJoC the Filk Date: 25 May 22 - 09:00 AM Backwoodsman: I don't know about Australia, but I heard once that the UK started clamping down on guns after the end of WW2, mainly because Them In Power knew that there wasn't much longer they could continue with the death sentence on the statute books. The names Ruth Ellis and Timothy Evans come to mind; there's probably others. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 25 May 22 - 09:00 AM The amnesia clock is ticking. In 10 days the awareness of the recent 'incident' will be half and in 20 days it will be all but a stastistic. Trump could turn the amnesia clock back a bit with another 'good people on both sides' speech at the NRA tnis weekend. Republicans are in general amnesia clock watchers. Biden will be accused of politisizing a tragedy for politics. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: SPB-Cooperator Date: 25 May 22 - 09:17 AM MaJoc - the death penalty is hardly an effective deterrent, is it? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 25 May 22 - 09:24 AM We got this. Candles will be lit. Moments of silence will be quiet. Memorials of flowers and stuffed animals will be piled up. Prayers will be offered. More guns will be sold. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Stilly River Sage Date: 25 May 22 - 09:44 AM The gun lobby stirs up their followers after every mass shooting: "They're coming for our guns now, so you'd better buy more!" and sales go up. It is insanity. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Big Al Whittle Date: 25 May 22 - 09:59 AM I think maybe we have to accept that America thinks different from us on this subject. Its a bit like arguing with the Taliban. Or how South Africa used to be. they just see things differently from us, and they're entitled to and we have to accept it. Its not really a case of reasoning. They've heard all the arguments and they disagree with us. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Stilly River Sage Date: 25 May 22 - 10:23 AM Not everyone accepts and agrees. And this is another case of governing by the minority - because, for starters, the Democrats can't seem to ditch the filibuster in the senate even though the GOP doesn't blink twice at dropping it to get their way when they hold that majority. So good legislation by the Democrats is blocked by a single GOP member if the 60 vote threshold can't be met. Blame Mitch McConnell. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Big Al Whittle Date: 25 May 22 - 10:50 AM Well I daresay - not everyone agrees with the Taliban. Just like not everyone agreed with Brexit. Its in the nature of things we don't all agree about everything. The thing is though - is there the collective will to try and change things? You wouldn't really have thought that South Africa would change. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 25 May 22 - 12:14 PM Change will be minimal and slow. If you think the gears of justice grind slowly; the electoral process, voter obstruction, loopholes, gerrymandering, lobbying/bribing, filibusters and Court challenges are tectonic. A dictator and liquor are quicker. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: saulgoldie Date: 25 May 22 - 01:27 PM I wrote the following letter that I am sending to a bunch of Representatives. If others also sent it or their own letters, emails, made phone calls, visited in person, we would have something. Here is my letter: * * * * * Dear (Representative So and So), As if we need another reminder that there is a screaming need for some way to combat rampant gun violence… If there were something regular citizens could do, you know we would. But you are the one who makes and implements the laws. And you have an obligation to act in the best interests of not only your literal constituents, but of your constituents at large in the rest of the country. Now, naturally, everyone will trot out their pet explanations, solutions, and meaningless “thoughts and prayers.” Mental health problems. Not enough religion. Too much religion. Drug use. Too many guns in the wrong places. Not enough guns in the right places. Not enough discipline in schools, at home, and in the courts. Too much discipline. Not enough jobs. Wealth inequity. And whatever. But it would be best if there were some reliable studies that would guide us to better solutions, rather than just knee-jerk ideas. But Congress is prevented from doing this, because: The Tiahrt Amendment, and the Dickey Amendment prevent Congress from even investigating the numbers and the causes of gun violence. As a representative of the people who cannot individually make things happen, you must repeal these two amendments and commit to honest study of the problem of gun violence. Gun violence that is vastly greater than any other first world nation, and even many second and third world nations. And once we know from reliable investigation, then we can take the appropriate steps, pass the appropriate laws, make the useful policies to implement a plan, and finally deal honestly and effectively with the horrible problem. I know this is possible. I know that you can do it! Please let me know that you will do it! Thank you. Sincerely, |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: MaJoC the Filk Date: 25 May 22 - 01:45 PM SPB> the death penalty is hardly an effective deterrent, is it? I believe it used to be at least partially effective in the UK; witness the slow rise in murders, manslaughter, gun crime etc since its abolition. Statistics to help disambiguate this point will be warmly welcomed. (Outraged headlines don't count, as by definition they don't reflect business as usual, otherwise they wouldn't sell newspapers. But that's a rant for another day.) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 25 May 22 - 02:04 PM Govenor Abbott from Texas is congratulating and celebrating the success of law enforcement. He said "What the victims families need above all else is your love". Beto O'Rourke then confronted the Govenor saying "you have done nothing to prevent this. This was totally predictable" and was told by the Lt Govenor "you are out of line, you are a sick son of a bitch by making this a political issue, you are an asshole" Beto O'Rourke was then escorted out of the news conference. The Govenor rambled on about about families and the Lt. Govenor said now is not the time...evil will always walk among us...can't we all just get along. Facebook only had 30 minutes of warning from the posts from the gunman. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: MaJoC the Filk Date: 25 May 22 - 02:20 PM Good on yer, saulgoldie, but I fear the statistics are against you ("It's only you saying this, nyet, tovarishch?"). This side of the Puddle, 43% of the popular vote was deemed to be a thumping majority for the Thatcher gvt, and 51% voting for (*akkh* *phht*) Brexit was thereafter represented as "the voice of the people". Our local |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 25 May 22 - 02:24 PM The Govenor went on to put the shooting soley on the shoulders of mental health. "For 60 years Texas has had the legal carry law for long guns, and never have we had an incident like this!" Really? He did not (would not) answer the question of canceling the Trump NRA convention. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 25 May 22 - 02:28 PM watch this |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 25 May 22 - 04:03 PM According to the Lt. Govenor of Texas everyone on this thread is an out of line sick son ofa bitch asshole. I respectfully disagree. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Steve Shaw Date: 25 May 22 - 04:11 PM "I believe it used to be at least partially effective in the UK; witness the slow rise in murders, manslaughter, gun crime etc since its abolition" Post hoc ergo propter hoc. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Big Al Whittle Date: 25 May 22 - 04:22 PM well its a modest proposal - saulgoldie. I'm not really sure examining the facts is really where its at. I didn't give up smoking in public til I was confronted and forbad from doing it by law. If the death of all those kids doesn't persuade your opponents - mere facts, how ever presented certainly wont. You will need to be even more determined to prevail through democratic process than those arraigned against you. Its not worth wasting your breath on arguing with those who will never listen. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 25 May 22 - 04:45 PM No, I would not give you false hope On this strange and mournful day But the mother and child reunion Is only a google away Oh, little darling of mine I can't for the life of me Remember a sadder day I know they say let it be But it just don't work out that way And the course of a lifetime runs Over and over again No, I would not give you false hope (no) On this strange and mournful day But the mother and child reunion Is only a scrap book away Oh, little darling of mine I just can't believe it's so Though it seems strange to say I never been laid so low In such a mysterious way And the course of a lifetime runs Over and over again But I would not give you false hope (no) On this strange and mournful day When mother and child disunion Is only a gunman away Oh, oh, the mother and child disunion Is only a motion away Oh, the mother and child sad ruin Is only a moment away (oh oh) Oh, the mother and child disunion Is only a bullet away |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Backwoodsman Date: 25 May 22 - 06:16 PM You’re dead right, Al. Here’s what I said on the ‘Buffalo Shootings’ thread about the extreme difficulty inherent in persuading Americans they don’t ‘need’ firearms… ”You’re dead right, SPB, but it ain’t gonna change.Most Americans are brainwashed from birth to believe that it’s their ‘right’ to be armed to the teeth, to shoot the guy who comes through the window to steal their laptop, and to ‘protect’ themselves against ‘the bad guys’ and the ‘mad-dog killers’.. They simply cannot conceive of a country with a population of ~65 million where hardly anybody, not even the police, is armed and where the annual number of deaths by shooting (including suicides) averages <100. In order to rid the US of its guns, you would need to reverse the psyche that dictates that no-one is ‘safe’ without a gun. Not gonna happen any time soon, certainly not in my lifetime. It’s so, so sad.” |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 25 May 22 - 07:47 PM ooo-baby baby its a wild world You're liable to be shot while a child ooo-baby baby its a wild world You never know when you end as a child girl. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 25 May 22 - 08:45 PM Saul Goldie's proposal is more practical and productive than my brand of cynical witacisms. Racanteurism is out of fashion as rhetoric 'largely shrinks' to one dimension on social media. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Backwoodsman Date: 26 May 22 - 03:31 AM Well there’s at least one American who ‘gets it’… Cheryl Wheeler - ‘If It We’re Up To Me’ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 27 May 22 - 09:15 AM Its about 90%. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Backwoodsman Date: 27 May 22 - 09:47 AM But that 90% continue to allow the 10% to call the shots (pun intended) - that’s what those of us living in civilised countries find difficult to rationalise. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: leeneia Date: 27 May 22 - 03:37 PM Guns aren't the problem. Rage is the problem. People have had guns since the 17th Century. Lots of Americans have guns they will never use or use only for target practice. In the UK, where guns are hard to get, knifings are dreadfully on the rise. An enraged man who can't get a gun uses a bomb, commits arson, or drives a car into the crowd. These are some things I believe are behind the rage: the breakdown of the family. attendant child abuse and neglect, which produces people who cannot think well and have not learned to care about other people. alcohol and illegal drugs. hours and hours of violence in TV, movies, computer games. lack of mental-health care right-wing rhetoric stirring up fear and racism. websites where manipulators groom the vulnerable to kill. The shooter in Parkland Florida was so stupid that he could not operate a microwaves or clothes dryer. Yet somehow he got hold of sophisticated weapons and ammo and knew how to load them. He was wily enough to enter the school against traffic when students were leaving at the end of the day. Somebody taught him to do that, probably somebody on the Internet. It's time to start exposing these people. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Bonzo3legs Date: 27 May 22 - 04:11 PM Why the GOP is quick to enact laws banning abortion but not guns is strange????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Stilly River Sage Date: 27 May 22 - 04:28 PM The National Rifle Association (NRA) has been very generous in their campaign contributions to the GOP. That's why. And right-to-lifers have been very generous in donations to the GOP. That is also why. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Manitas_at_home Date: 27 May 22 - 04:57 PM Apparently UK knife crime still doesn't reach the levels seen in the USA. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 27 May 22 - 05:00 PM Even Mitt Romney has received 6 million from the NRA in his lifetime. TX gov Abbott brags that a Republican donor will pay all funeral costs for the kids. Insurance claims, unemployment benefits and health insurance will be expedited. After slashing 211 million from mental health programs he is doubling down on mental health. The govenor pledges the shooting will not be an inconveinience or added expense. Even if someone's glasses were broken in the shooting they will be covered. He is livid livid livid about the false reports that the police responded immediately when it really took 90 minutes. It sounds to me that he really doesn't give a fuck about the shooting but wants to sound like a person who cares. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 27 May 22 - 05:09 PM "Rest assured anyone who claims guns are the problem are wrong, misled and are not looking at the facts." Gov. Abbott well that should settle that. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Backwoodsman Date: 27 May 22 - 05:11 PM Apparently UK knife crime still doesn't reach the levels seen in the USA. 224 deaths by a sharp instrument (including knives and broken bottles) in the UK in the year ended March 2021. Source: https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn04304/ 1,739 deaths by knives or cutting instruments in the US in the year 2020. Source: https://www.statista.com/statistics/195325/murder-victims-in-the-us-by-weapon-used/ |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: keberoxu Date: 27 May 22 - 09:46 PM You know, the first time I ever heard of the NRA was in a recording of the "Bonnie and Clyde" song with lyrics supposedly by Bonnie Parker. Somebody had to explain to me what the lyrics meant by saying "We have joined the NRA." Latest thing in the news is the fact that the annual NRA national convention is just about to be held. And a bunch of musicians had been lined up to perform and sing. And a bunch of them are, in fact, pulling out. What the blankety-blank was Don McLean doing, in the first place, agreeing to sing at the NRA convention? I didn't think he would take their money to perform for them in the first place, with the sort of lyrics he publishes and performs? Well, I guess I am the last to know things, and everybody else knows that he is -- was in the NRA's pocket. Because now Don McLean has announced that, no, he has pulled out, and will not sing at the NRA Convention. And neither will Lee Greenwood, who was expected to sing "God Bless the USA"; he has gone on the Fox television network to say that he had been engaged, and he has withdrawn his participation at the NRA convention entertainment. A few other singers and entertainers whose names I do not recognize, people I don't associate, again, with Don McLean. And the fact that they refuse to sing for the NRA ... is national news. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: keberoxu Date: 27 May 22 - 10:16 PM Here is a link to coverage on CNN of the story from the preceding post on this thread. Cheri Mossberg reporting for CNN |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 27 May 22 - 11:03 PM There are a mixed bag of possible solutions. Some are better than others. Raise the age of buying mass killing guns and ammo to 21. Ban all AR's and magazines of cop killing armor piercing bullets Do what Australia and New Zealand did. Do what has worked since 1950. Mutually Assured Destruction by thermonuclear bombs. Harden schools. Arm teachers. Arm students. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Another shooting in US From: Donuel Date: 28 May 22 - 03:44 PM leenia is not saying guns don't kill people, people do. She is talking about emotions and the human brain, about thoughts and behaviors that stem from rage in our brain. First what is a thought? In is a constructed model that comes from our brains. Models are first created in the hippocampus and model processes are judged and stored in a hundred and 50 thousand or so areas in the neo cortex. Why all these models? Any life that moves has an advantage when it knows where it was and where it is. Predictions help refine our models. Now further down the rabbit hole of neurology is the emotions processed by the brain stem and thalamus. It is a problem as you see and will take a long time to figure out how a network of so many judging areas can work harmoniously. Its as though we have thousands of brains but ordered in a way you can cut a brain in half and it still functions with all its models. Anyway its a deep problem. Right now it is easier to take the sharp tip off our spears than change our brains. We learn our models in our lifetime. An individual brain can not do what collective brains can do and are prone to disruption at various stages. The wiring does not finish until 21. |