Print MIDI Files!

Subject: Print MIDI Files!
From: Sorcha
Date: 22 Feb 00 - 11:32 AM

All you old hands probably know this already, but I just found a FREE download that allows you to save and print MIDI files! It's called MidiNotate, and is available HERE. I knew this software existed, but just now found it. If I can understand the instructions, ANY body can! Got it to work the first time, with a little help from HELP. WOW--printed out Mbo's Israel Reel!

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: Bill D
Date: 22 Feb 00 - 03:23 PM

wowee...zowee!..I had NOT seen this, or even mention of it...looks like a winner!..downloading it now

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: Bill D
Date: 22 Feb 00 - 04:12 PM

YES!...as in YES!!!!!!..neat program...bells & whistles..downlead a MIDI..even one with lots of lines and clefs...play it and watch the score...turns the pages...

and you can print it..and,,,even without the fancy version they hope to sell you later(for editing, etc..)..those who have NoteWorth can re-enter it from the printed version and edit it...

one more tool..Thanks, Sorcha

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: Sorcha
Date: 22 Feb 00 - 04:53 PM

Idnit COOL! I am so excited!

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: MMario
Date: 22 Feb 00 - 05:00 PM

Does it pull in from midi better then noteworthy?

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: Sorcha
Date: 22 Feb 00 - 05:25 PM

"I" don't know, I never had noteworthy.

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: Bill D
Date: 22 Feb 00 - 05:26 PM

I think Noteworthy can only export midi...this IMPORTS it...(am I right? going to check)

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: Bill D
Date: 22 Feb 00 - 05:29 PM

sorry...typed before I looked..NoteWorthy sure does!.and it edits...this new one is free, though, and does a few tricks I don;t think NWC does

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: Bill D
Date: 22 Feb 00 - 05:36 PM

a major diff...NWC displays score as one long string to the right...MidiNotate can be zoomed and looks like pages.( a little note tells you how many pages there will be, and as the cursor gets to the end of a page, it turns the page for you...)..I like it..(I like NWC, too...but for quick display and playing, this is fast!)

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: Bill D
Date: 22 Feb 00 - 05:41 PM

Noteworthy will let you select one staff and just play IT, while MidiNotate will actually allow you to raise & lower the volume for one staff in relation to the others...ok..I'll stop now and explore and see what others think...*grin*

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: MMario
Date: 22 Feb 00 - 05:45 PM

I'll have to take a look at it.

interesting......

and it even told me what key I wrote it in...(which I didn't know)

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: MMario
Date: 22 Feb 00 - 05:49 PM

but - you can't edit.....and that's a BIG problem..... on the other hand, it's free....

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 22 Feb 00 - 06:05 PM

One problem with using MIDI notation software is that the note lengths used to get the sound right to the ear are differnt to how you would actually notate the tune. As an example try The Golden Eagle on both the software packages mentioned and you will find that they both notate my sequencing differently. At least using Cakewalk, I can set things up so that it plays correctly and displays the staff for this one in the dotted type rythym sometimes used to notate hornpipes. I have yet to manage that with any of the cheap/ free programs I have tried.

Incidentally, I have yet to come across any ABC conversion software that has worked correctly on this file.

Jon

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: Bill D
Date: 22 Feb 00 - 06:37 PM

wow...CakeWalk is a whole array of products..and not real cheap..seems like a real need for professionals, but a bit of overkill for those who just want to learn tunes and see scores....I wouldn't have any idea where to start in that list!.....Cakewaly stuff

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: John in Brisbane
Date: 22 Feb 00 - 06:55 PM

Jon, a few comments re the above. NoteWorthy Composer is as the name implies a composition and notation tool and therein lie its real strengths. The PLAY facility is designed to validate the notation with the human ear, with sufficient accuracy to pick up notation problems. It does allow you to vary the mix from each instrument, but not in a simulated audio mixer style which some specialist MIDI players have.

I mentioned the availability of Midi Notate in a thread a couple of weeks ago. My recommendation at that time was based on the need for many people at this forum to PRINT sheet music from MIDI files. It seems to do this job quite well.

Re MIDI to ABC converters James Allwright is a very active ABC programmer. His ABC to MIDI shell (with a front end Windows style - written by someone else)does a very good job. I know that Bruce O endorses it. James has the corollary program to convert MIDI to ABC, but without the Windows front end. I will wrestle with this prog and associated compilers over the next few weeks. If I get into strife I'm sure that I can get some help from James at the ABC Users List. I'll let you know if I have any success. (I'm currently experimenting with some alternative notation methods; It's problematical whether they ever bear fruit).

Regards, John

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 22 Feb 00 - 06:57 PM

Sure Bill, we are not talking like for like bringing CakeWalk into the equation... I am not a proffessional but I wouldn't be without it even though mine is a very old version of the program.

For anybody that is interested, I have transcribed the Golden Eagle in the dotted notation I mentioned and placed it at geagle1.mid. The timing interpretation of this version should be the same on the other software and is more in line with one method of notating a hornpipe but listen to the difference.... I think this is one of the diffiiculties with folk music what is written and what is played can be different...

Jon

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 22 Feb 00 - 07:02 PM

Thanks for the comments John, I will check this ABC software out for myself as well.

Jon

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: John in Brisbane
Date: 22 Feb 00 - 08:04 PM

Jon, I'm going to throw this one into the ring and walk away! I've read recently that MIDI players don't handle triplets correctly and (rough explanation) actually play 1/4. 1/2, 1/4 instead of 1/3, 1/3, 1/3. Assuming it is correct I must admit that either way doesn't worry me too much. I use MIDIs to get a feel for the tune rather than exact transcription. Some of the ABC players allow you to cater for the subtle timing differences between hornpipes/strathspeys/schottishhe etc (ABCMUS?) but I've never experimented too much. I used to play with a very talented guy who could differentiate in his Celtic box playing with the various ways that a waltz is played in different regions - all with exactly the same dots. Music notation is only a guide to playing the notes, just work with a good conductor to find out how different the results can be. Regards, John

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: Alan of Australia
Date: 23 Feb 00 - 03:45 AM

John,
Just your point about triplets, any good MIDI player should be able to do much better than 1/4, 1/2, 1/4, assuming the MIDI file has better timing resolution. This should be the case because any MIDI recorder should also be able to do much better than that. The MIDI spec provides for MUCH greater timing resolution than that.

heers,
Alan

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 23 Feb 00 - 11:41 AM

I have just been looking at Cakewalk and resolutions. I use the default setting of 120 ticks per quarter note. Based on that, a 16th note triplet would have a duration of 20 ticks so it can be caculated accurately by the software and it supports resolutions of up to 480 ticks per quarter note.

At 120 ticks per quarter note with a tempo of 100, each tick would be 5 milliseconds. I have messed around with the timing settings and my P133 seems to cope perfectly well with the time period and resolution both set to 1 millisecond. I also tried long timer periods and I must be honest and say that I didn't notice any difference on any file up to 30 miliseconds and in some cases they still sounded OK at 50.

Coming back to the original post, I am not knocking any software or any reccomendations, I was trying to point out that midi's that have been sequenced to sound right can sometimes produce very wierd looking notation.

I have yet to find an ideal solution and have tended to use ABC for some purposes because it can do things that MIDI can't in terms of music.

BTW, I can't sight read - I just see how things are normally notated in books and have found that sometimes it takes quite bit of messing around to translate that to how I think it should sound. A lot depends on what you want to do i.e. produce a file to be a "peformance" or to learn and possibly print music. I dabble with both and still have a lot to learn.

Jon

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: MMario
Date: 23 Feb 00 - 12:05 PM

I was once told, in reference to musical notation - "if they sound the same when played, they are both correct, the only difference would be convention."

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: John in Brisbane
Date: 24 Feb 00 - 07:08 AM

Alan, the quote came from an ABC guru. I've never heard any problems with the MIDI players I use - as I said I just threw it into the ring for what it's worth. Regards, John

Subject: RE: Print MIDI Files!
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 25 Feb 00 - 12:20 AM

Thanks for the tip, Sorcha; it should be quite a time-saver.

Malcolm