 sj |
||
|
||
A pearl of great price.....
|
|
|
Subject: A pearl of great price..... From: Sorcha Date: 13 Dec 00 - 01:51 AM The Mudcat is one of these, and I truly hate to see it sullied as it has been in recent weeks. I made myself a promise that I would not make any more posts to any opinion/inflammatory/attack/juvenile threads. So here I am, starting one...........maybe this makes me one of the "Old Gaurd"?....so be it. If I don't speak out, just how can I change anything?
Max, thank you for this forum where all of us can express an opinion; even those whose opinions are not really worth expressing.
And you know, while I am at it, Praise/Susan never did offend me at all, even though she knows I am not a Christian/ Jesus Freak. I have never seen in her what so many of you seem to see--the Prostelyzing Jim/TammyFaye idiocy. Praise is not a prostelyzer, just an advocate, and none of you can say you are not an "advocate".....
so, advocate and be damned. I will probably be back in a week or so, hopefully more grown up/adult than I am now.......after all, I am only 49......doesn't that mean I have a few more years until my dotage, when I will be indulged? Sorcha/Scorchy/, who is just bloody tired of AnyBashing....Let's do music , friendship and humor, OK? Nite all, and I know all this has been said before.......see ya. |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: Ebbie Date: 13 Dec 00 - 02:14 AM Sorcha, I fully agree with you. I hope too that we get back soon to the actual fun and laughter and open caring. However, I think that part of our grousing these days has to do with the current national situation. It is bound to affect each of us, even though in different ways. As we get past that, I think we'll get back to 'normal', whatever that is. What disturbs me more than most things is the surrender that some people seem driven to. In my opinion, as long as we strive, acrimoniously or not,gently or not, (And the process sometimes elicits such insight, compassion and brilliance that I greatly value it.) to communicate with each other, to try to understand and to be understood, we're doing fine. When we give up, we hurt ourselves, each other and the 'Cat. So please don't give up! Ebbie |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: wysiwyg Date: 13 Dec 00 - 02:15 AM I will dig up the URL to where I wrote about my frustration about the lack of clarity people have about what is PROSELYTIZING, something I am DEAD SET AGAINST as a BAD WRONG to do to people. I sure wish people would define what they mean by it before hitting me over the head with it. You might be surprised to see how I stand alongside you, not in opposition to you. ~S~ |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: Steve Parkes Date: 13 Dec 00 - 03:51 AM A bit of thread creep coming up ... but, talking of Pearls Of Great Price: I'm not a believer, I'm agnostic. I also know that if person A can persuade me by argument that something is so, person B can persuade it ain't. Never mind that; I do know that if you're a Christian, you know the most important thing in the entire history of the whole universe, and if you don't want to tell other people about it, you are just plain selfish! OK, I'm being flippant, but I'm not making fun. People with Faith have a duty to try and spread it. Do it by example instead of by word when folks aren't inclined to listen. Steve |
|
Subject: RE: ANOTHER pearl of great price..... From: wysiwyg Date: 13 Dec 00 - 03:56 AM I think that while I was away from Mudcat, I found a sister forum for the Mudcat. That is why I titled this post as I did. Pearls go well strung together, eh? There is a structure at Beliefnet, a multi-faith forum now celebrating its first anniversary, that allows people to discuss fully and deeply on a vast range of issues that most people would say CANNOT be discussed without making a mess.
Beliefnet is a commercial board with paid staff, very different from Mudcat, but no different from Mudcat than some of us Mudcatters are from each other. *G* Just as different people have different beliefs, so do forums have different foundational values and ways of fulfilling their missions. (Different paths, man, way cool.)
http://www.beliefnet.com/boards/discussion_list.asp?boardID=3478 But in dialog groups, someone (anyone) proposes a topic, and then people sign up to the topic and once enough people have signed up, posting to that group's discussions is closed. The group is launched, and it develops its threads like we have here, among the ones who join before the deadline. Posting, then, is open only to the signups, but the posts can all be read. (If people want to join in after that, they just start a fresh group.) The dialog groups often spawn a series of threads within that dialog group. Go see how they handle diversity. There is more of it than there is here, in terms of beliefs. I have been really amused at how surprised some of you would be at how comfortable I am in that diversity. It's heavenly. It's great. People aren't fighting, they are sharing and learning and discovering. (Me too.) See, the structure lets you talk to people like yourself, in some boards, or people NOT like yourself, in other ones... and you can read them all and learn as much as you like. In one thread I rediscovered an old love for a daily prayer format that I believe saved the lives of two of our kids, and those of us in that discussion just reveled in what we share. It was a safe place to share what we had in common, that discussion, see?
In another thread I met a darling pagan man I'm corresponding with a lot now, who wanted to talk about Humor and the Divine-- holy clowning. Fedor the Mad Hungarian! (He introduced me to yet ANOTHER forum, but 'nuff said!) Also look for the Beliefnet discussion board called Town Meeting, where how-do-we-want-this-to-work-for-us-members is discussed and hashed out and where appoaches to flaming and trolling are worked out and then applied. It is also the place where new sub-forums are proposed and agreed on. ~Susan PS, 'scuse my typos! Wait till you see the site I found with embedded spell-checker, font formatting, and post previews! It's in my bookmarks somedamnwhere! |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: Mrrzy Date: 13 Dec 00 - 11:20 AM Steve Parkes, I beg to differ. The way my experience has gone (I grew up in a predominantly Christian part of a predominantly Moslem area of a mostly amimistic country in West Africa; Dad was Quaker, Mom was Jewish, and we were pretty much atheists), I find that people with CERTAIN faiths have a duty to try and spread it. Those faiths tend to be mono(andro)theistic. It depends on what the faith is - and what the (HUMAN) prophets, writers of religious texts and so on, claimed to have faith IN. Moslems have a duty not to spread their faith by converting, which I agree Christians are duty-bound to do according to their teachings, but by killing those of other (infidel) or no faith, according to THEIR teachings. I don't think Judaism requires either preaching at or elimination of competing beliefs. Pagans have no duty whatsoever to try to spread their faith, nor do animists or anyone else who doesn't have a monotheistic, priest-promoting, hierarchy to protect. Personally I think Praise is a pearl of great price; I don't know many, if any, other people for whom Christianity is such a large part of their lives but who manage NOT to preach at the likes of me! |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: wysiwyg Date: 13 Dec 00 - 11:31 AM Don't mind me, I went over to the Mudcat Arms to recruit a laundry crew to help with fire cleanup and to see if I can unload an unnecessary pedestal. ~Susan |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: wysiwyg Date: 13 Dec 00 - 11:35 AM And PS, I WILL preach from time to time, but no one sez you have to listen, and I stand among you, not above you. Here's one-- I find life works a LOT better if you assume EVERY person is a unique pearl of great price. And they are, exactly as they are. OK some of you don't WANT to be pearls, you'd rather be SAPPHIRES, OK!!!! Sue me for using the wrong words! ~S~ |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: Amergin Date: 13 Dec 00 - 11:39 AM Well, I know that I'm a pearl of a great price.... |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: Matt_R Date: 13 Dec 00 - 11:45 AM I'm just an old chunk of coal...but I'm going to be a diamond some day. |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: wysiwyg Date: 13 Dec 00 - 11:53 AM Hop in my stocking, Matt! It's that time of year! If you subscribe to any of the theories about time being eternal, you get to see yourself as coal and diamond at the same time. I sure don't mind squeezing you so hard to turn diamond though, my little carbon-based lifeform brother! ~S~ |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: Matt_R Date: 13 Dec 00 - 12:00 PM oooh oooh ooooooooh! SkaWEEEZ me! |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: wysiwyg Date: 13 Dec 00 - 12:05 PM >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *!* <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: Clifton53 Date: 13 Dec 00 - 12:15 PM We have people here who's opinions aren't worth expressing? What the hell kind of statement is that? Am I now free to judge people's worthiness? |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 13 Dec 00 - 01:19 PM "Moslems have a duty not to spread their faith by converting...but by killing those of other (infidel) or no faith, according to THEIR teachings."
Now that is a dangerous misreading of Islamic teachings. I'm sure you could find Moslems who think or act that way, as you could find Christians or Hindus or even some Buddhists. But in all these cases people thinking that way would be way out of line, and in conflict with the central tenets of the religion.
|
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: Mrrzy Date: 13 Dec 00 - 01:35 PM Sorry, I *did* say I was talking of my opinions formed from my experiences {emphasis admittedly added}... Have you lived in moslem countries, McGofH? Or lost a loved one to anti-Infidel islamic terrorism? What I meant was Sure, if you read the fundemental bases for the religions, you are charged in various ways - including the Duty to Preach to which Steve refers in general but (the basis for my argument) which I find only among Christians - but that most right-thinking people who adhere to the (rest of) the faith tend to live right too. None of my moslem friends have ever tried to kill anyone. None of my Christian friends preach at -or around- me, either, or at least if they do, they don't tend to stay my friend for very long! And I think you'd be hard pressed to find any Buddhist who thinks that killing non-Buddhists is the way to reach Nirvana... |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: Mrrzy Date: 13 Dec 00 - 01:39 PM Besides, Praise, you've been WAY too good for that lump of coal - I, on the other hand... Matt, jump THIS way! No, but seriously, folks... |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: mousethief Date: 13 Dec 00 - 01:47 PM The problem with being a pearl is that after a while you stop irritating the oyster. I'll be obsidian. I like the way that word rolls off the tongue. Obsidian. Obsidian. Isn't that fun? Alex |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: Mrrzy Date: 13 Dec 00 - 01:59 PM Obsidian is one of my faves... right up there with ubiquitous... |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: Matt_R Date: 13 Dec 00 - 02:02 PM Obsidian Order...watch out for them... |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: mousethief Date: 13 Dec 00 - 02:04 PM Ooooh, that's a nice one too! Let's start a new thread. Alex |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: Mrrzy Date: 13 Dec 00 - 02:11 PM IF someone from the Obsidian Order retreats, do they yell Black! Black! ...? |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: Bert Date: 13 Dec 00 - 02:11 PM I don't know much about their teaching, but when I lived in Bahrain I observed that Moslems were very tolerant. |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 13 Dec 00 - 02:13 PM Thee are horrible things done in the names of all religions (including atheism). Human beings are like that. We use whatever we have to hand to hurt other people, when that is what we want to do. People seeking advantage or vengeance, mobs, rulers seeking scapegoats...
But it just is not true that "Moslems have a duty not to spread their faith by converting...but by killing those of other (infidel) or no faith". That's what Jews call a "blood libel." It feeds into hatred and fear. It's thye kind of think that was said by murderous "ethnic cleansers" in Bosnia and Kosovo. And it is not true.
|
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: wysiwyg Date: 13 Dec 00 - 08:44 PM Friends, this discussion has become academic as far as my part in it is concerned. Alex, I think I won't be irritating this particular oyster any more. I've always said that if Max wanted me to leave Mudcat I'd be outta here. From what I understand of what Joe Offer tells me, that's pretty much what Max said last night on the radio. I wish he'd just TOLD me, himself. Most of you know my present computer does not do radio... so I hadn't heard it myself or I would not have posted to this thread. When this discussion starts to get flamey.... I hope you'll think about discussing it at Beliefnet. ~S~ |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: alison Date: 13 Dec 00 - 09:10 PM what Max said was that yourself and Brendy should keep your disputes out of mudcat.. I didn't hear him ask anyone to leave.......... but then I did lose sound after that bit...... slainte alison |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 13 Dec 00 - 09:28 PM I'd have thought he'd have been meanig that where possible interpersonal friction should be via Personal Messages, and thta's in line with the kind of things Praise has advised. But two have to play at that for it to work.
Anyway, it's less heated over on the music threads, most of the time, so come on back sometimes, Praise, and at least gossip about songs and tunes. |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: Steve Parkes Date: 14 Dec 00 - 03:31 AM Oh dear, I really ought to keep quiet, oughtn't I? What I meant by a duty to try and spread it was NOT preaching! If you discover a good restaurant, or a good band, or a good shop, do you tell your friends, or do you keep it to yourself? (The answer should be "tell your friends", if you're not a selfish swine.) So, if you discover the secret of Life and the Universe and Everything, how can you be so mean as to keep that to yourself? I will keep quiet now! It's just occurred to me that if Pearl is a virtuous woman, her price is above Ruby's. OK, OK, I'll shut up! Steve |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: Micca Date: 14 Dec 00 - 01:14 PM Steve , I didnt know Ruby has gone "cut price"***bg*** |
|
Subject: RE: A pearl of great price..... From: mousethief Date: 14 Dec 00 - 01:33 PM When you know a pretty story, you don't let it go unsaid You tell it to your children when you tuck them into bed And when you know a wonderful secret You tell it to your friends Tell them that a lifetime filled with happiness Is like a street that never ends ---Larry Norman |
| Share Thread: |
