Help: A440 in computer

Subject: A440 in computer
From: GUEST,GeneJ
Date: 13 Dec 00 - 11:05 AM

I often play the fiddle along with a tune in Midisoft Sheet Music. The pitch of the notes output by the computer is a bit below concert pitch (A440). This is inconvenient, because I have to retune my fiddle before and after playing with other folks who are at A440. I would much prefer to set the pitch of the output from my computer at A440. On the web,I asked a person who deals with Midisoft programs. He said he did not know how to make that adjustment in Sheet Music, or even if it could be done. He suggested I ask around to see if it could be done in Windows, or in the sound card, or otherwise. I have Windows 95, a Compaq Presario 4508, and a Sound Blaster 1.0.

Does anyone know how I can adjust the pitch up to exactly A440? or if it can be done at all?

Subject: RE: Help: A440 in computer
From: Musicman
Date: 13 Dec 00 - 11:45 AM

the tone is probably generated with the program and not the computer..... there may be an adjustment in the program for fine tuning (although one would think they would make it exact for a computer sound!) If you can't find it in the program itself, go back to the manufacturer, you may find some help there......

Subject: RE: Help: A440 in computer
From: Bill D
Date: 13 Dec 00 - 12:07 PM

but!....try a href=http://sharmusic.com/webcart/genacc/tuneup.html>this page! a bunch of A440 sounds

and also maybe here for a pay program

or here....here for a possible free one

Subject: RE: Help: A440 in computer
From: Bill D
Date: 13 Dec 00 - 12:11 PM

(In that first page, 2 of the 3 tones generated read "Right on" when I held my Korg tuner up to the speakers...so if A440 is all you need, these might just do)

Subject: RE: Help: A440 in computer
From: Bill D
Date: 13 Dec 00 - 12:14 PM

let me try that first link again...THIS page

Subject: RE: Help: A440 in computer
From: GUEST,GeneJ
Date: 13 Dec 00 - 04:04 PM

In response to Musicman, I scoured every nook and cranny of Sheet Music and found nothing. And, alas! Midisoft, the company that makes Sheet Music just went out of business (I couldn't reach them by any method). It's a shame - I have gotten a lot of mileage out of the program.

To Bill, I think you misunderstood what I'm looking for. I'm looking for a way to raise slightly the pitch of the music notes that are produced by the Sheet Music program in my computer, i.e. to raise it to A440 exactly. I'm not looking for a tuner. Thanks anyway to you both for trying.

Subject: RE: Help: A440 in computer
From: Joe Offer
Date: 13 Dec 00 - 04:38 PM

Hmmm. I believe this "pitch shifting" ability is a function of your sound card, not of your Sheet Music program. 1.0 doesn't sound like a good model number for Soundblaster. You may be able to get more information about your sound card at http://www.soundblaster.com (click). What you need to know is if your sound card has "Pitch Shifter" capability - and then you need to know how to operate it. You may also get information from the "help" file that came with your sound card - there may be a "Creative" folder under "Accessories" in the programs available under your "Start" button.
-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: Help: A440 in computer
From: John in Brisbane
Date: 13 Dec 00 - 07:15 PM

Hi GeneJ, my first suggestion is to install/use a simple MIDI player such as Microsoft's Media Player as a trial. It won't have the fancy mixing facilities of Midisoft but it should provide an indication of whether your soundcard is the problem. I tend to doubt that very much and suspect that the 'resolution' of your software is the issue. Once you resolve this point the diagnosos will be much easier to determine.

Even if your sound card is dodgy I believe that we still have a few tricks available yet.

Regards, John

Subject: RE: Help: A440 in computer
From: GUEST,GeneJ
Date: 14 Dec 00 - 03:19 PM

Thanks, Joe and John. I called the Compaq help line. They advised that I needed to get a software program that would allow configuration of the pitch of the sound produced.

Subject: RE: Help: A440 in computer
From: Joe Offer
Date: 14 Dec 00 - 04:27 PM

Hmmm. Seems to me we ought to be able to come up with a lead to a free program that does that. Gene, what is the frequency of "A" on what you have now?
I checked the "Pitch Shifter" software on my Soundblaster, and if shifts the pitch by half steps - I'm sure that's now that you want to do. I'll send a personal message to our Perfesser Alan of Oz. He's good at this MIDI stuff, and I'll betcha he can come up with a solution.
Gene, bookmark this thread and take a look at it every once in a while. I'm sure this is something we can solve, and that we can all learn from.
I can adjust "A" on my Casio keyboard - why not on my sound card?
-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: Help: A440 in computer
From: John in Brisbane
Date: 14 Dec 00 - 06:21 PM

Whoa there Joe! I take some wider meaning from Compaq's response (which I don't believe is necessarily very helpful). GeneJ, in my estimation you will find out very easily what the real problem is if you play one of your MIDI files through Microsoft Media Player and test for A440. If you need help tracking it down please let us know - I have provided a URL in the Mudcat MIDI guide. Pardon me not going into the theory here, I have to dash soon for some skin cancer surgery. Regards, John

Subject: RE: Help: A440 in computer
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 14 Dec 00 - 06:47 PM

Well, you could just pick up your phone. The dial tone is a perfect "F".

Rick

Subject: RE: Help: A440 in computer
From: NH Dave
Date: 14 Dec 00 - 06:50 PM

Those of you who still have a version of Windows with a real DOS might look for and try the QBASIC.EXE program. This program allows the PLAY command, which will produce notes from your basic computer, through your internal speaker.

With this program running, try the command, Play "O2 T50": Play "A1", and press

This tells your computer to play an "A" whole note, in octave 2, at a tempo of 50. You can lengthen the note by decreasing the "T" number, and change octaves by changing the "O" number. This is one of getting the note but it may not be a true 440 "A".

Dave

Subject: RE: Help: A440 in computer
From: Alan of Australia
Date: 15 Dec 00 - 10:06 AM

GeneJ,
Are you able to tell us the exact frequency you get instead of 440 Hz?

In a MIDI system the controller (e.g. sequencer software) does not determine the frequency to be played. The software simply tells the MIDI device (sound card or synthesizer) which note to play and the MIDI device should play the correct frequency.

You can normally change the frequency using the pitch bend function in your software. This setting should be zero unless you're deliberately bending the pitch. Have you checked this?

If the setup software that comes with your card has a fine frequency adjustment that might be the problem. Or the solution depending on point of view. (I expect that this adjustment would change the same internal parameter on the sound card as the pitch bend function.)

As an experiment I recorded a MIDI file containing one note of A 440. I played this back on two sound cards and a MIDI file player, at the same time recording the audio outputs on another computer. One sound card appeared to have a frequency error of about 0.08%, the other two devices were less than 0.02%. The frequencies were 439.66 Hz and 439.92Hz, but there's some deliberate frequency randomness in MIDI sounds because that's what happens with real instruments, so that makes it difficult to measure the exact values. Still, I wouldn't expect to hear any of this as an error.

Cheers,
Alan

Subject: RE: Help: A440 in computer
From: GUEST,GeneJ
Date: 17 Dec 00 - 08:53 PM

I'm finally getting back after a fair bit of research, a visit to a computer store and some trouble getting on this site. I have been working on your questions and suggestions, Joe, Alan, John.

1. Yes, I am able to tell the exact frequency I get. Its 338. I do this as follows. In Sheet Music, I have created a tune ("fiddle tuner") which consists of four consecutive whole A notes, followed by four E's, then D's, then G's. These are the four strings of the violin. I play the tune on the computer, tuning the strings while the computer notes sound out. I believe one can tune within a fraction of a hertz by listening to the beats (re-enforcements) produced by the two closely-pitched notes sounding against each other. When the beats are reduced to one every 1 or 2 seconds, the two frequencies are getting close. When the beat is eliminated, the two frequencies are the same.

Next, I determine the frequency of the newly-tuned A string by using a Wittner violin tuner. It reads 338. This type of tuner has a pick-up that clips onto the bridge of the violin. (Its not the type that can be held in front of a speaker to get a reading. I am going to borrow one that can do this, like the Korg I used to have. Then, I will be able to get a direct reading of the pitch coming through the speaker.)

2. I checked out the pitch bending in Sheet Music. Under "Sequencer Preferences/MIDI OUT (or Thru)/Play only the following", there are is a column of boxes that can be checked or not checked. One box is Pitch Bend. In the same window, there are 4 more such boxes, one of which is named Thin Pitch Bend. These settings are either on or off , so I don't think they solve my problem.

3. I repeated the whole process outlined in no. 1 above by using Microsoft Media Player, rather than Sheet Music. The result was identical. The pitch was 338.

4. The computer store did not have a pitch configurating software. While at the store, the salesman checked Windows for this function. Base, treble, volume, etc. can be configured but not pitch.

5. Now, the good news! I checked my Melody Assistant, a great music software produced by the Guillion brothers of France. Lo and behold, under Digital Output Configuration there is a Master Tuning slider. One can tune to a precision of 1/10 th of a hertz. I set the slider to 4400, ran my "fiddle tuner" through Melody Assistant, tuned the A string on the fiddle and checked the string on the Wittner tuner. Dead on 440! As a further check, I moved the slider to 4150 or so, and repeated the operation. The fiddle came out very low.

I got very comfortable with Sheet Music (it's excellent for building, diddling with and printing music scores) but I imagine Melody Assistant can be every bit as good once I get to know it. Melody Ass't produces a beter sound - a much richer sound.

Thanks for your help. You are a great bunch of people. And I have to tell you Aussies how much I enjoyed your country and your people when I visited for a month in 1988. There are only two things that keep me from moving there - the Australian immigration laws and my wife.

One more thing. Joe, are you somehow connected with the operation of this forum? If so, I have a question. I been a music devotee since the early 40's (folk, pop, old time). I enjoy this site and I often see threads that I could contribute to. Should I register, or continue to sign in as "guest"? Does it make much difference? GeneJ, Canada

Subject: RE: Help: A440 in computer
From: Bill D
Date: 17 Dec 00 - 10:43 PM

you get more functions if you register...ability to send 'personal messages'...etc.....if you find you want to check in here regularly, it is a big advantage

Subject: RE: Help: A440 in computer
From: Joe Offer
Date: 18 Dec 00 - 01:00 AM

Hi, Gene - I maintain the FAQ (frequently asked questions) and help out with technical problems, but I'm a volunteer. The FAQ is the first thread on the Forum Menu - you can check there for the "benefits of membership." We don't charge for membership, and nobody gets commercial benefit from Mudcat. We do this for fun, thanks to the generosity of Max, our Webmaster.
He does use this site as a testing ground for ideas he has - and then he uses them on Websites he designs for various companies. He also pays a mean guitar.
-Joe Offer in California (Max and Mudcat are in Pennsylvania)-