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Help: Harmonic Notes

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GUEST 12 Apr 01 - 02:37 PM
Whistle Stop 12 Apr 01 - 03:10 PM
GUEST,Gary 12 Apr 01 - 03:45 PM
Chicken Charlie 12 Apr 01 - 04:18 PM
GUEST,Gary 12 Apr 01 - 04:49 PM
Whistle Stop 13 Apr 01 - 07:36 AM
GUEST,Gary 13 Apr 01 - 11:37 AM
Don Firth 13 Apr 01 - 12:18 PM
Whistle Stop 13 Apr 01 - 12:27 PM
Chicken Charlie 13 Apr 01 - 04:18 PM
Murray MacLeod 13 Apr 01 - 04:32 PM
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Subject: Harmonic Notes
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Apr 01 - 02:37 PM

I want to play "Amazing Grace" and/or "Danny Boy" in harmonics useing the 5th 7th and 12th frets. on the guitar. In transposing these songs. Is all I have to do is find the notes and the transpose it to Tab that I can then work with? Or is there something else I have to look for in transposing it. I would like to either play the song as a whole or incorporate a section of it into a medley?

I know uhg Danny boy. but would like some sugestions.

Gary


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Subject: RE: Help: Harmonic Notes
From: Whistle Stop
Date: 12 Apr 01 - 03:10 PM

Guest, I'm having a little trouble following your request. If you're relying solely on harmonics to play Amazing Grace (just melody), the easiest way would be to play it in the key of G. First note is 12th-fret harmonic on the fourth string, followed by 12th-fret harmonic on the third, then the second, etc. The word "how" (sweet the sound) is an A, played on the fourth string, 7th fret. Just keep going like that; it's easier to find the notes than to explain them. You won't need the 5th fret harmonic at all, unless you prefer to use it in place of some of the 7th-fret harmonics (same note).

If this isn't what you're looking for, any chance you can rephrase your question?


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Subject: RE: Help: Harmonic Notes
From: GUEST,Gary
Date: 12 Apr 01 - 03:45 PM

Thanks Whistle that is exactly what I was looking for.

Amazing Grace in G. It looks like I leave the guitar in STD tuning and work it out using the 7th and 12th fretts.

I take it there is a single note step between the 7th and 12th frett.

Any Sugestions to get Danny boy started??

Gary


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Subject: RE: Help: Harmonic Notes
From: Chicken Charlie
Date: 12 Apr 01 - 04:18 PM

Harmonics are lovely, but there's bad news, good news, and then more bad news.

Bad news is, if you limit self to the easy harmonics, you can only play the notes on the 5, 7, 12 -- but also 17 (=12+5) and 19 (=12+7). If you have as bad an ear as I do, it will take much trial and error to find a way to play the melody just on those notes, IF IT IS POSSIBLE AT ALL. A good melody may well well require some accidentals, in which case you are up the creek.

Good news is, there is a way to play harmonics anywhere your heart desires and not just on those frets. Do the same number with the left hand. "Stop" the string with the middle or ring finger on your right hand and sound the string with the right thumb or forefinger.

Further bad news: the distance between where you are fingering the string with the left and right hands MUST be very close to an octave length. Frankly, I find this harder than hell, and cannot do it at performance speed, but mayhap you are more nimble/coordinated. Since I don't do it well, I should not be trying to teach you, but I want you to know the trick is doable--I've heard it done. Make your needs known to your guitarist buddies and hopefully one will be able to show you. I think you just about have to see it in the flesh.

Mediocre news: alternate tunings will change the range of harmonics available by the "easy" 5-7-12 method.

I applaud your ambition. The Harmonically Disabled Chicken Charlie


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Subject: RE: Help: Harmonic Notes
From: GUEST,Gary
Date: 12 Apr 01 - 04:49 PM

Poor ears I missed 7 & 5 beingthe same. TY for the reminder on the 17th & 19th fretts. I'll work on grace tonight. I recall someone had worked out Grace w/ harmonics but I have never heard it. I believe they used an alternate tuning but that is all I remember. But at the moment I have a place to start and can work on plucking it out from there.

I trust the scale can be played via harmonics.

Hope it sounds nice as I work it out to keep me going then. But then have played other songs that I thought sounded terrible slow but good fast.

Gary


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Subject: RE: Help: Harmonic Notes
From: Whistle Stop
Date: 13 Apr 01 - 07:36 AM

I wasn't very clear in my last post. In standard tuning, the 7th-fret harmonic is the same note as the fifth-string harmonic on the next string down (for every string pair but the G and B strings, which are tuned to a major third). In other words, a 5th fret harmonic on your low E string will play an E (two octaves higher than the open string); the 7th fret harmonic on the adjacent A string will play the same E.

As for "artificial" harmonics (played twelve frets above a fretted note), they can be done. I learned these in my classical guitar studies as a youngster, and was taught to finger the harmonic with my index finger and pluck the string with my third (ring) finger. It's a cool trick, and you can get to the point where you can do it reasonably smoothly. Other people finger them differently that the way I was taught -- some folks who play with a flatpick finger the harmonic with either the second or third finger. And yes, this way you can play a scale. If you're just playing the "natural" harmonics (12th, 7th and 5th frets on an open string), you have to settle for the notes that are there; unless you are in an altered tuning, a scale won't be available to you.


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Subject: RE: Help: Harmonic Notes
From: GUEST,Gary
Date: 13 Apr 01 - 11:37 AM

Thanks all; I use a flat pick. Got the first half of it down last night. before I forgot the words. I remember them now. I hate that when I'm in the middle of a project and my mind looses the things I've know forever. Age and long lost historical youth activities catching up w/ me.

At any rate I think it sounds real nice. Thanks all for the start

Gary


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Subject: RE: Help: Harmonic Notes
From: Don Firth
Date: 13 Apr 01 - 12:18 PM

To get really cute, play artificial (or real) harmonics by touching the half-way point with the right index finger, pluck the string with the middle finger, and play a bass note with the thumb. This occurs from time to time in classic guitar music. Tricky, but it's a nice effect.

In classic guitar music, harmonics are usually indicated by standard notes, but with diamond-shaped heads instead of oval dots, with the word harm. written above the note or passage.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: Help: Harmonic Notes
From: Whistle Stop
Date: 13 Apr 01 - 12:27 PM

Yeah Don, that's how I was taught. Takes some practice, but it's a very nice effect.


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Subject: RE: Help: Harmonic Notes
From: Chicken Charlie
Date: 13 Apr 01 - 04:18 PM

Re last two posts. Sounds positively masochistic. I'll have to try it. CC


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Subject: RE: Help: Harmonic Notes
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 13 Apr 01 - 04:32 PM

I am breaking my vow here, but have to say, if you want to hear artificial harmonics played with superhuman skill, listen to "Hector the Hero" on Tony McManus' first album. We are talking about CONTRAPUNTAL harmonics on the guitar .................

Murray


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