BS: Special Jug Night

Subject: Special Jug Night
From: bill\sables
Date: 23 Jul 01 - 12:33 PM

This Wednesday 25th July we will have Micca visiting us from London. There is also a very special guest banjo player. It should be a good night. I am posting here because I might not have got rid of my virus completley and don't want to send emails just in case.
Cheers Bill

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Les from Hull
Date: 23 Jul 01 - 12:46 PM

It might save a lot of time and effort if you find some way of fixing his tankard to his person this time!

Sorry we can't make it, have a good 'un.

Les

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Roger in Sheffield
Date: 23 Jul 01 - 12:54 PM

Can't be there but if Jon Freeman turns up buy him a drink or two from me

Roger

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Eric the Viking
Date: 23 Jul 01 - 01:30 PM

You rotten buggers! I will miss it, I(we) shall be sailing down the Humber and out to sea.-Cobble you can shut up! At least I won't fall out of the toilet!

Unfortunately-I shall return next month!

If it is Jon, Bill, buy him a beer and I'll pay you later.

Cheers all.

Eric

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Diva
Date: 23 Jul 01 - 03:19 PM

Make sure he sings his prize winning song...he won a cup for it you know!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Micca
Date: 23 Jul 01 - 04:08 PM

Diva, ... and the Horse...!!!! or a Meringue?

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Diva
Date: 23 Jul 01 - 04:24 PM

Naw...its definately a Horse.....

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 23 Jul 01 - 07:20 PM

I Can't make it this time (I'm working), but hope to see you all in September if not before.john

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Cobble
Date: 23 Jul 01 - 08:36 PM

To my best friend Eric the Viking. GOT RID YES YES YES.

Have a good time mate Cobble.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Skipjack K8
Date: 24 Jul 01 - 10:37 AM

Can I have the seat of the Guest box player who flounced out? I'll come as a fiddle player instead!!!

Skipjack

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,big phil
Date: 24 Jul 01 - 11:45 AM

hi bill see you on wednesday

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Fortunato
Date: 24 Jul 01 - 12:00 PM

Micca! Now there's a man who deserves a special jug. I don't know what the Jug is, but I wish I could be there as well to share a pint with you and my pal Micca. I'll be there is spirit. Cheers, Chance

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: smallpiper
Date: 24 Jul 01 - 12:05 PM

So is this a good night for a small piper to turn up?

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Noreen
Date: 24 Jul 01 - 12:12 PM

Sounds like there won't be room for a large piper, so yes...

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,Banjo-Flower
Date: 24 Jul 01 - 01:43 PM

hi Bill

is this mystery banjo player really Sam Pirt with an accordion in disguise and a different hat

Gerry

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Tig
Date: 24 Jul 01 - 02:00 PM

Is Micca coming back to see if Syd has managed to get him yet MORE cider to drink?

I'm glad you posted this thread 'cos I was thinking of giving the Jug a miss this week - but there's no chance now and I might actually go earlier than usual!!!

Is he bringing Gail as well as the Holy Grail?

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Micca
Date: 24 Jul 01 - 02:49 PM

Tig, Yes, and My, how she has grown!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Big Phil
Date: 24 Jul 01 - 04:04 PM

\

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: niknak
Date: 25 Jul 01 - 06:37 AM

Will be there. Looking forward.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: nutty
Date: 25 Jul 01 - 06:40 AM

I won't ...... boohoo
I'll be thinking of you all, though

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,mike Cahill
Date: 25 Jul 01 - 08:40 AM

Mudcaters please don't come to the jug tonight, unless you are coming to take part in the music session that has run there for about 4 years. The place is tiny, about 30 max in each of the 2 rooms, and everyone who comes to socialise, potentially squeezes out a musician. Perhaps the time has come to have a mudcat night at the jug but please, on another night.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,Mike Cahill
Date: 25 Jul 01 - 04:51 PM

Well it's 9.30 and I'm back home again, my worst fears have come true we went early, but at 8.30 the place was full of strangers, most of whom had come to talk, not to play or listen. Bill what makes you think that you have the right to invite the nation to our session?

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Skipjack K8
Date: 25 Jul 01 - 07:30 PM

You missed a fine piper, Mike, and the beautiful voice of Noreen, and a near punch-up to boot. It was a nice night off from melodia (apart from Patrish, who is above reproach), but there was a bad rash of accordionitis. Nice to hear multiple banjos, whistles and fiddles instead of bellow busting morris mania. Only for a change, like. It'll all be back to normal next week, mate.

Skipjack

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Cobble
Date: 25 Jul 01 - 08:24 PM

It was wonderful to see old friends, Micca with his prize winning song, Noreen and her lovely voice and Katrine who sang a pretty song. New friends too, wonderful banjo playing from Jon Freeman and pipe playing from Smallpiper. It was nice to meet Jon's Mum too. It was good to see so many visiting Mudcatters on a Wednesday night.

Cobble and Mrs. C

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Shields Folk
Date: 25 Jul 01 - 09:01 PM

What is worse an audience that doesn't listen or musicians without an audience? I wish i'd been there, but perhaps i'm the wrong sort.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Sorcha
Date: 25 Jul 01 - 09:07 PM

Mike Cahill, perhaps you need to remember that there are no strangers, only friends you haven't met yet. Are you just a tad bit crabby, here?

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Cobble
Date: 25 Jul 01 - 09:35 PM

At 9.30pm the room had Mudcatters in (maybe one or two locals, are you going to say they should'nt be there) the room was not full of strangers. As far as I could see the only strangers to the JUG where Jon Freeman is he a stranger? and his mother. And Smallpipes A new mudcatter. This is a country pub trying to make a trade, who is MIke Cahill (guest) to say who goes and who does not, I would think that this is the landlords choice not his, after all it is living.

Cobble.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 25 Jul 01 - 10:05 PM

Cobble-I agree with you entirely, Mike Cahill says "Who do you think you are, inviting people to my local" well this is a folk music site and everybody here likes folk music. If somebody were to invite a bunch of football hooligans to a folk night, I could understand if the locals complained.I also agree it is up yo the pub landlord, who can go and who can't.I would like to go to The Jug, will I still be welcome? I play tin whistle, but I'm not very good yet.john

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Cobble
Date: 25 Jul 01 - 10:07 PM

Any time you want John and welcome.

Cobble.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 01:40 AM

Well I got nothing but a warm welcome from the Jug when Manitas and I went in June, and that was with a restless bratling in tow as well!!

Mike, you have to learn that if you want your session to evolve, as all sessions must, you have to allow new people in. I have seen long standing sessions collapse almost overnight before now because one person was too vociferous in their disapproval of visitors. If all you want to do is play music then go join a band. If you want to play music with no audience then join the Ukelele Orchestra of G Britain (only 5 people turned up at Cecil Sharp's last Friday for them.... I felt so sorry for them...). And if your session doesn't evolve then it just becomes a practice night for the melodeon players. You will end up with a totally predictable session, where everyone knows what tune is coming next and in which order and people will get sick of it. This has happened so many times, where the same 8 - 10 musicians played regularly, and always the same tunes. Visitors were tollerated but new tunes weren't. In the end, visitors stopped coming to what was essentially a closed session and it died.

Remember that a pub is just that, a PUBLIC house, and only the Landlord or their staff can say who can and cannot come in. If you start laying down the law about visitors to YOUR local, then you should expect people to start avoiding you. Sooner or later, you will end up playing to yourself in an empty room.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 01:59 AM

Cobble-Thanks, I'll try to get across when I can
Mike Cahill-I'm sure that if the landlord of The Jug knew that you were asking people to keep away, he would not be impressed!

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,Mike Cahill
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 02:27 AM

One of my other interests is canals and waterways, I could go onto a couple of waterways newsgroups, and invite everyone in the country to the jug, to talk about boats, would that be fair on the on the other regulars of the place? although they wouldn't damage the pub, and would as far as syd would be concerned be more trade for him. I wouldn't because it would change the dynamics of the place. I have no problem with any of the Individuals who attended last night I do have a problem with bill for treating the place as a venue for his own personal fan club. Last night may have developed into a good session, but it wasn't a jug session, when has a jug session ever nearly ended up in a punch up?(skipjackK8). And as far as "what is worse, an audience that doesn't listen or musicians without an audience." That says it all! The jug is not about showing off to others, it is about a group of people who have known one another for years getting together to make music together. New people join the group, and leave the group in one's and two's, they are not transplanted on mass. I can guess what the near punch up was about, did someone not want to worship at the alter of Bill Sables? Jug sessions are not a performance they are my friends, and bill's friends, and Chris's friends playing music together, and once in a while it all comes together and the whole place is grinning like a Cheshire cat because everyone there knows they've just played a tune really well. that is not the issue, what is the issue is that bill is trying to make the jug "HIS" session. If you want to give performances bill hire a hall, and sell tickets. Scorcha if your social life was hijacked for someone else's ego trip you would be crabby too

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: katlaughing
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 02:40 AM

Well, Bill was inviting musicians, so presumably that would be a whole lot different from you inviting boaters, etc. And, he wasn't inviting just any, he was inviting Mudcatters, some of whom have already been at the Jug before. Last I checked you'd been a Mudcatter yourself for quite a ways back.

Sounds to me as if you are jealous of Bill's success and likeability. If you missed Micca, Jon Freeman, and Noreen because you were in a snit, I feel sorry for you because they are all superb musicians.

kat

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Catrin
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 02:54 AM

And I was there too. Late beacuse of a major traffic jam on the motorway, but got there in the end.

The music was beautiful, the people were welcoming and the couple of songs that were sung were delightful. (I even got a private rendition of one of Tig's stories...)

Thank you for inviting me Bill.

Cheers,

Catrin

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Sorcha
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 03:09 AM

Mike, I never get crabby about meeting new people, especially musicians or people interested in music. Bill has been in my home and is one of the most personable persons I have ever met. Not even crabby before his first cuppa.

I do not and will not ever believe that Bill himself thinks he has a "personal fan club". Your rant sounds like jealousy to me. Or like a toddler whining because he can't have ALL the candy in the store......

I did lose my "local" because the landlord decided to close a corridor of land he owned which had been used for over 100 years for moving cattle which royally pissed off the cattlemen who were regulars. That was 4 years ago and I still don't have a local.

When the pub closed for lack of business even the "bikers" were pissed off. We never excluded them even though it was a Cowboy type pub. They liked the place and kept coming back. Then,

the landlord died, and the pub was truly and seriously closed.......

Mike, get off your snit. Make some new friends called Mudcatters at the Jug.....try hard not to limit your social life to one night at one pub.......go get a life and quit bitching about one of the nicest people I have ever met.

(rant off--somebody come get the soapbox...)

Sorcha/Scorch/Orca Wail and now, apparently, Scorcha

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,Mike Cahill
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 03:21 AM

Keep 'em coming, Unfortunatly the day job calls, I'll be back but please spare me the "Little house on the prairie" crap about friends we've not met yet

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Sorcha
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 03:48 AM

My last words on this subject--Mike, I am glad I don't know you.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,Patrish
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 04:05 AM

Last night at the Jug it was great to meet Micca, Jon, Noreen, Greg, and Catrin. It was also great to see Mr and Mrs Cobble, Bill, Mike and everyone else. I am so sorry that there is this bad feeling.

I would like to clear up the "punch up" incident. Some one was playing the bandit rather loudly, a person from the other end of the room decided to throw something at them (not a good idea if you are crap at throwing, not a good idea anyway) and hit my friend on the head - he was not best pleased and told the person calmly to go away - hardly a punch up.

As for the sessions being a personal fan club for Bill - I would point out that all those that came last night were warmly greeted by all(or nearly all) and Bill got no special treatment or praise.

Most of the catching up was done before the session started so the level of talk seemed no different to any wednesday night.(perhaps a bit

I really look forward to the Jug sessions. Sometimes tunes are played that I cant join in with - no matter I listen and hopefully learn. Sometimes we have a bit of a sing, and sometimes someone plays Donkey Riding - and I can join in! What I am trying to say is that the session has always made me feel I am amongst friends and I hope that it will continue to do so. Lets not fight - please
Patrish

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,Jim McDonald
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 04:30 AM

I've not been to the Jug, and am not likely to go. This is not because of the recent spat between Bill and Mike, but because the logistics are too complicated. Everything I have heard about the place and the people and the landlord make the place sound too good to be true. So it is too good to be true.
Mike you will end up cutting off your nose to spite your face - silly man.
Patrish , live in the real world, people will not forget this bad feeling, Mike has blown it for you all by making this a public thing. I feel most sorry for the bar owner - he is the real innocent in this.
Jim McDonald

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 06:28 AM

I always thought you UK catters were a self righteous set of assholes, ha ha, now you have proved it.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Les from Hull
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 07:02 AM

I think you'll find it's arseholes!

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Skipjack K8
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 07:21 AM

Glad to confirm your inferiority complex, Infidel. This truth doesn't hurt much.

Skipjack

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 07:35 AM

Oh well, we arrived home safely. The Jug was a great pub and it was good to meet some new people and some that I hadn't seen for some time.

Mike does have (at least in part) my sympathy. The night sort of reminded me of a Friday night in the Bangor Festival where old faces meet up for the first time in a year - lots of musicians but lots of chat with everyone catching up with their hello's etc - the music rarely got going there until nearly closing time because of that but we had all Saturday and Sunday to carry on playing - the Jug jut has the Wedsnesday night.

I don't know whether it was just me and whether my problem was caused by the noise levels but when the music started, it rarely, if ever felt, like a session and there were times, I felt as if I was more in a competition with 2 accordian players than in a session.

Anyway, sorry to sound miserable. I take the night for what it was - mostly a meeting of friends and very enjoyable for that reason. For me though, if I get up that way again (distance being the problem), I will hope to be sneaking in on a good session.

Jon

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,Mike Cahill
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 08:09 AM

I take comfort from the fact that the attacks on me come from people who don't know me (thank you for the virus whoever, my anti- virus caught it). Patricia is the only person I actually know who has commented, although I might be wrong that is the problem with nicknames. None of the regular Musicians from the jug (bar Patricia) have commented about the place being taken over. The man wanting to use the bandit, who had stuff thrown at him might have something to say isn't he one of the syd's customers? When winter comes, the new school term starts, or it just seems a bit far to travel on a cold dark night some of the new faces from far away who were there last night might not feel like coming to the Jug. If the locals have all been driven away 'cos there isn't space for them what will happen to Syd's takings then, what will happen to the session? Who will care? I will! Will you? I apologise to the person known as Scorcha; the wisecrack I made was un- called for.

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 08:50 AM

Mike, I've just re-read the thread. Why don't you take a deep breath and have a chat with Bill in private?

As for me, I wasn't up there for a meeting of people, I was up there because Bill had Sircam virus, problems with a scanner and printer and a couple of other computer problems. He emailed me asking if there was anyway I could help and I agreed, naturally choosing Wednesday because I love sessions.

The night didn't turn out anything like I had expected it to (nor did the night before when Bill was in the Norwich session - it was the worst Tuesday night I've been to with key people missing, some new people there...) - but I managed to make something of the night and came home happy.

I guess its harder when you are there every week but really and honestly, I can't help feeling that you are blowing something that, at least from my side, was caused entirely by other circumstances out of all proportion.

Jon

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: GUEST,Patrish
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 09:18 AM

Hi Mike, Yes I am Patricia
I do care about what happens at the Jug, as I said before - I really look forward to Wednesdays. I love the sessions the songs and the people. If it was overcrowded every week then it would be a real problem. Last night was crowded and a bit noisy at times.
The chap who threw money at the people on the bandit missed them and hit my mate Alan on the head. He was also starting to play tunes while someone else was playing. I feel a bit ashamed that I did not do something about it at the time.
But my overall feelings about last night are that I had a good night - I was so pleased to see everyone.
Mike, I don't think there will be many, if any repeats of last night.
I echo what Jon says - please talk to Bill
Patrish

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: bill\sables
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 09:22 AM

When Jon Freeman and I arrived at the Jug last night at approx 8-45 we found seats straight away, Mike I did notice you were sitting outside at the time. However most of the people were regular patrons of the Jug with the exception of Micca and an Accordion player who has been there a few times. This accordion player is not a member or guest on mudcat and my posting regarding the "Invitation to the World" which Mike refers to could not have attracted him as he does not even own a computer. He did, though, bring his wife and another couple of adults and two kids with him so taking up 5 non musical seats. It was also him who caused the very slight problem regarding the fruit machine, this was so slight I would think only about 4 or 5 people even noticed it. Later in the evening a new musician arrived (Smallpiper) who contributed very well to the nights music with his border pipes. Even later Noreen and Catrin, who have been to the Jug a few times before, arrived and also found seats I am sorry thet you felt you needed to leave early Mike, if you had stayed I am sure you would have had and contributed to a fine night of music and song.
Bill

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 10:39 AM

Total side track and totaly selfish incedentals:

For me, I saw real friendships last night - people genuinely pleased to meet others - probably done me a lot of good in terms of my feelings towards Mudcat lately.

I got to have a short go on a Docherty madola - all I can say is try one if you get the chance - they really are top class instruments!

Even with my comments about the music, there were highspots, Catrin singing with Noreen in harmony (doubt many would have heard Noreen's harmony - she sang it very quietly), Smallpiper, what I managed to hear of nikak on the fiddle sounded great... could continue for a while and mention others...

Jon

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: smallpiper
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 11:39 AM

Do I detect some bad feeling? Knock it on the head before it becomes so silly that it really does kill the session, which, apart from the accordian player not having a volume control and throwing things at people, I enjoyed. I found the people to be wonderfully friendly and welcoming and would love to come back again - possibly making it a regular thing, who knows?

Next session at the Hase in Hessle is on Tuesday all and I mean all are welcome - (its a bigger pub).

Nice to have met you all

John

Subject: RE: BS: Special Jug Night
From: bill\sables
Date: 26 Jul 01 - 12:04 PM

John, Smallpiper, It was good to meet you last night, I enjoyed your piping very much. Next time you come why not put your Highland war pipes in the car in case there are any more loud agressive accordion players there, most of us can't compete volume wise with him.
Bill