BS: The Intelligence of Leaders

Subject: The Intelligence of Leaders
From: Amos
Date: 30 Jul 01 - 10:12 AM

From a recent e-mail:

WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THIS?
The intelligence of our presidents has never been
seriously scrutinized at any time in our history until
now. There is a widespread perception that President
G. W. Bush is not qualified for the position he holds.

That increasing awareness by the people has led to a
study of the intellectual ability of all presidents
for the past sixty years. There have been twelve
presidents in that time, from F. D. Roosevelt to G. W.
Bush. All were rated based on  scholarly achievements,
writings that they alone wrote, their ability to speak
effectively, and a number of psychological factors.

The conclusions of the study, conducted by an independent
think tank located in Scranton, Pennsylvania were
surprising. This think tank includes high caliber
historians, psychiatrists, sociologists, scientists in
human behavior, and psychologists.  Among their ranks
are Dr. Werner Levenstein, world-renowned sociologist,
and Professor Patricia A. Williams, a world-respected
psychiatrist. All members of the think tank are
experts at being able to detect a person's IQ from
the criteria stated earlier. After four months of
research, these learned men and women have determined
the IQs of each president within a range of five
percentage points. The IQs listed below are the norms
for each president.

147 Franklin D. Roosevelt (D)
132 Harry Truman (D)
122 Dwight D. Eisenhower (R)
174 John F. Kennedy (D)
126 Lyndon B. Johnson (D)
155 Richard M. Nixon (R)
121 Gerald Ford (R)
175 James E. Carter (D)
105 Ronald Reagan (R)
99 George HW Bush (R)
182 William J. Clinton (D)
91 George W. Bush (R)

The non-partisan researchers who evaluated the twelve
presidents determined that the six Republican
presidents for the past 50 years had an average IQ of
115.5, with President Nixon having the highest IQ, at
155.   President G. W. Bush was rated the lowest of
all the Republicans with an IQ of 91. The six Democrat
presidents had IQs with an average of 156, with
President Clinton having the highest IQ, at 182.
President Lyndon B. Johnson was rated the lowest of
all the Democrats with an IQ of 126. The margin of
error is plus or minus five percent. This study was
initiated on February 13, 2001 and completed on June
17, 2001.
This study validated the widespread feeling of people
about the sitting president. President Bush was rated
low because of his inability to command the English
language, his lack of any scholarly achievements, and
an absence of anything authored by him that would
reflect an intellectual effort.

Subject: RE: BS: The Intelligence of Leaders
From: Fiolar
Date: 30 Jul 01 - 10:20 AM

Wal, hush my mouf. Seriously though it seems to be a brilliant piece of research and if true, makes one just a tiny bit concerned about the future of the planet.

Subject: RE: BS: The Intelligence of Leaders
From: MMario
Date: 30 Jul 01 - 10:27 AM

I think with this little piece the primary missing word is "perceived" -

From what I understand - it is next to impossible to accurately determine IQ from speech patterns or many forms of writings.

Subject: RE: BS: The Intelligence of Leaders
From: LoopySanchez
Date: 30 Jul 01 - 10:29 AM

I was truly depressed about the choices in the last election. I hated to have to cast my vote for one of two candidates who would be stuck battling for the silver and bronze in any test of intelligence against you, me or any of the better half of Mudcatters. I think maybe I'll waste a vote on the Libertarians next time. Harry Browne vs. Ralph Nader would have made for a much more interesting and meaningful election last time.

Subject: RE: BS: The Intelligence of Leaders
From: GUEST,djh
Date: 30 Jul 01 - 11:48 AM

One Clinton practically matches the pooled IQ of 2 Bushs and we booted the only smart Republican out on his arse for being unscrupulous. What does that tell you? They should have thrown Dan Quayle into the study for laughs.

Subject: RE: BS: The Intelligence of Leaders
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 30 Jul 01 - 12:02 PM

I Think "Killer instinct Quotient" would be a better way to measure the success or failure of any leader. It's inconceivable to me that ANY ambitious creep willing to play by the rules while slashing their way up the "political success" ladder would understand anything but the intelligence of attaining power.

I'd be more interested in how the various "advisors" were rated.

Good thread idea Amos.

Rick

Subject: RE: BS: The Intelligence of Leaders
From: kendall
Date: 30 Jul 01 - 12:07 PM

Presidents Grant and Harding (R, & R) have out forth as the two worst presidents in history. I wonder what their I.Q was...

Subject: RE: BS: The Intelligence of Leaders
From: Wolfgang
Date: 31 Jul 01 - 11:37 AM

Even if we assume that the measurement problem has been dealt with, IQ is one of the worst possible predictors for ability to lead. Close to completely useless.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: BS: The Intelligence of Leaders
From: GUEST,Roger the skiffler
Date: 31 Jul 01 - 11:41 AM

I wonder....did they check who had actuallywritten the "writings"? Speechwriters and book ghost writers and editors might have a higher IQ than the pols who read them out or under whose name they are marketed!!
RtS (or am I being cynical?)

Subject: RE: BS: The Intelligence of Leaders
From: Bill D
Date: 31 Jul 01 - 12:34 PM

hmmmm....I don't trust this kind of 'study' very much in general, but strangely, the scores are very close to what I'd have guessed..within 5-8 points. I agree that IQ is no absolute determiner of ability to lead, but it can be an indicator of a person's overall ability to comprehend complex perspectives and relationships.......and, an important point: language skills are crucial in certain situations, as much of our culture and it's nuances are embedded and reflected in language.
Being able to coherently process and express trains of thought mean a great deal to a world leader who must represent his country at international conferences, etc.

I know that many of our UK members are disillusioned with Tony Blair, but I have watched him speak in that televised 'debate' in Parliment, and he certainly holds his own, no matter what you think of his opinions! I shudder at the image of G.W. Bush taking on our Congress in such an exchange!

Subject: RE: BS: The Intelligence of Leaders
From: Ringer
Date: 31 Jul 01 - 02:00 PM

I think that anyone who lends the slightest credence to nonsense of this nature is terminally idiotic.

Subject: RE: BS: The Intelligence of Leaders
From: Bill D
Date: 31 Jul 01 - 06:05 PM

gee, whiz, Bald Eagle...if you have an opinion, don't be bashful...let it out!..*grin*

Subject: RE: BS: The Intelligence of Leaders
From: Peter T.
Date: 31 Jul 01 - 06:23 PM

Aristotle and Machiavelli would agree that IQ is not very important. What is important is political sense, which is something very different; and something even Aristotle and Machiavelli missed, which is the occasional need to stand on principle for larger historical reasons. Churchill had zero political sense, as far as I can tell, but he had a sense of larger historical forces, which was what mattered in the end. Franklin Roosevelt seems to have had both, but it took him awhile to get the knack of it. He had a brilliant wife too.
I think the smartest politician of the 20th century, bar none, was Mahatma Gandhi. Most people think he is great for religious reasons, but in fact he was a consummate political artist.

yours, Peter T.

Subject: RE: BS: The Intelligence of Leaders
From:
Date: 31 Jul 01 - 07:14 PM

I think its interesting, but probably not indicative of anything, that the Republican and Democrat with the highest IQs are also the ones that most people would say had the lowest moral quotient.

Subject: RE: BS: The Intelligence of Leaders
From: kendall
Date: 31 Jul 01 - 07:27 PM

We have all had a taste of Dubbyas language skills.

Subject: RE: BS: The Intelligence of Leaders
From: GUEST,Joe the Realist
Date: 31 Jul 01 - 09:35 PM

Well, there's really no need for a serious discussion of this "study." It is of course a classic internet hoax.

This story was so fishy I could smell it before I booted my computer. There is no such thing as the Lovenstein Institute. The researchers mentioned are fictitious.

The story started as an article in a satirical webzine, linkydinky.com.

After printing the text of the "study," the article gave some biographical information on the supposed researchers: Cristina L. Borenstein and Lana Tamaar "served as receptionists for Gore for President, Inc." "They publish the Pennsylvania Court Observer, which has a circulation of 5."
Dr Lovenstein "lives in a mobile home in Scranton PA with his longtime companion Patricia F. Dilliams. When they are not publishing reports for the Institute, they run an internet business www.collegedegreesforsale.com." You get the idea.

Geez, doesn't Bush have enough deficiencies without people having to invent more for him?

JtR

Subject: RE: BS: The Intelligence of Leaders
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 01 Aug 01 - 05:49 PM

OK, you guys over there have Freedom of information or something. So what is Wubwya's IQ?

I'm sure I've seen the IQ's of Tony Blair and William Hague printed as if they were fact, and it is well known that Hague scared the pants of Blair at PM's question time.

Subject: RE: BS: The Intelligence of Leaders
From: Bert
Date: 02 Aug 01 - 12:40 AM

Didn't need a study we all KNOW he's a Bozo.

What IS needed is a study of the IQ's of the effing idiots who voted for him. Of course that is supposing that ANYONE really DID. If you can fiddle one state, you can fiddle one vote, and if you can fiddle one vote you can fiddle 'em all.

Subject: RE: BS: The Intelligence of Leaders
From: Amos
Date: 02 Aug 01 - 08:21 AM

Gee, Bert, that's a great hypothesis -- since we don't know HOW many votes he screwed with, it is perfectly possible he screwed with ALL of them? I think the probabilities get out of reach on the curve, though.

My apologies to all for forwarding a hoax. At least it wasn't a chain letter soliciting funds for a gender reversal operation desperately needed by a seven year old Wiemeraner!!

A