BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Snuffy
Date: 08 Oct 01 - 06:59 PM

I hear that computers can now wreck a nice beach!

WassaiL! V

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Genie
Date: 08 Oct 01 - 01:23 PM

The spellcheck poem is worth posting, since links expire.

CANDIDATE FOR A PULLET SURPRISE
by Jerrold H. Zar

I have a spelling checker,
It came with my PC.
It plane lee marks four my revue
Miss steaks aye can knot sea.

Eye ran this poem threw it,
Your sure reel glad two no.
Its vary polished in it's weigh.
My checker tolled me sew.

A checker is a bless sing,
It freeze yew lodes of thyme.
It helps me right awl stiles two reed,
And aides me when eye rime.

Each frays come posed up on my screen
Eye trussed too bee a joule.
The checker pours o'er every word
To cheque sum spelling rule.

Bee fore a veiling checker's
Hour spelling mite decline,
And if we're lacks oar have a laps,
We wood bee maid too wine.

Butt now bee cause my spelling
Is checked with such grate flare,
Their are know fault's with in my cite,
Of nun eye am a wear.

Now spelling does knot phase me,
It does knot bring a tier.
My pay purrs awl due glad den
With wrapped word's fare as hear.

To rite with care is quite a feet
Of witch won should bee proud,
And wee mussed dew the best wee can,
Sew flaw's are knot aloud.

Sow ewe can sea why aye dew prays
Such soft wear four pea seas,
And why eye brake in two averse
Buy righting want too pleas.

Jerrold H. Zar
The Graduate School
Northern Illinois University
DeKalb, IL 60115-2864

Title suggested by Pamela Brown.
Based on opening lines suggested by Mark Eckman.
By the author's count, 127 of the 225 words of the poem are incorrect (although all words are correctly spelled).

Published January/February 1994, on page 13, in
Journal of Irreproducible Results
c/o Wisdom Simulators, Inc.
P.O. Box 380853, Cambridge, MA 02238

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: katlaughing
Date: 08 Oct 01 - 12:18 PM

law: lah or lar?

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: GUEST
Date: 07 Oct 01 - 09:32 PM

waugh: woff or war?

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: katlaughing
Date: 07 Oct 01 - 12:43 PM

Here's some real fun:

G.B. Shaw's entire 26 page into to the Miraculous Birth of Language in which he puts forth his views on spelling, etc.

fun poem on pronunciations

another fun poem on spelling checkers

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 06 Oct 01 - 03:46 PM

Hmmm...maybe he'd be trolling on here then, if he was around now, & had the net.... it would certainly have a big impact on the level of spelling/grammar in some of the trolling posts!

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 06 Oct 01 - 03:33 PM

Not Wilde, another Irishman, Shaw. He was very keen on spelling reform. I have always suspected that was largely as a way of annoying people.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Nigel.Parsons
Date: 06 Oct 01 - 02:55 PM

Metchosin. The name Lynn for a man is not unknown in Wales, Lynn Davies won Gold for the U.K. in Tokyo (1964) before being eclipsed by Bob Beamon in 1968. Continuing the thought of athletics, Our runner Linford Christie is often referred to by a shortened form of his first name.

Lady Penelope. The vaguaries of English spelling are almost limitless. I think it was Wilde who explained the spelling of "Fish" as "GHOTI", GH as in enough,O as in women and TI as in nation.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: katlaughing
Date: 06 Oct 01 - 10:20 AM

How 'bout the "Boy Named Sue?" LOL

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 06 Oct 01 - 09:09 AM

Yeah, but women are always nicking men's names. Shirley, Joyce, Evelyn, Robin, Enda, Jan, Sam... We've even got a girl singer in England now called Bill Jones. (Short for Belinda I gather.)

Never happens the other way round that I've heard.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: MARINER
Date: 06 Oct 01 - 05:17 AM

Yea Kat, I suppose Caitlin is pronounced something like Kathleen, without the th.If you remember, Dylan Thomas' wife was Caitlin.As someone said earlier the clerks at Elis Island had a lot to do with mispelling names, but Caitlin is not a mis spelling .It's a clear mispronounciation.And here in Ireland,they're now starting to name children Kate-Lyn, as a result of the influence of day time soaps (a friend rather uncharitably refers to these Americanised names as "single mother names") Don't forget in America they've even got women called Sean (or Shawn, or Shaun or take your pick of any spelling you fancy)

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: lady penelope
Date: 06 Oct 01 - 05:04 AM

If you think Colin's bad, you'll love how you pronounce Featherstonehaugh - Fanshaw or Chomoldely - Chumley!! How do these come to pass ? Singin and Sinclare I can understand as they are just SaintJohn and SaintClaire compressed, but the other two???!!?

My first name is Michelle ( named after my Dad, Michael ) but I grew up in north London where I and several thousand other Michelles ( well that's what seemed like at the time ) were re-named Meeshewal. It's hard to write out how north London people pronounce a double L , but they manage to get a W in there some how. To add insult to injury this was often shortened to Meesh, Shell ( with the W ) or Shelly. I wish my parents had just called me Michael and had done with it!

Sharon, I sympathise!! Mind you I always liked "Shara".

TTFN M'Lady P.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: katlaughing
Date: 06 Oct 01 - 01:42 AM

It's funny though, Genie. Dick Cheney went to school right here in Casper and everyone who grew up with him and knew his family has alwayspronounced it Chay-nee. I guess it must be another case where he just went with the flow rather than fight it. Interesting that he said that but deosn't insist they get it right.:-)

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Genie
Date: 06 Oct 01 - 01:31 AM

Dicho,
You said, "Guest Genie, you would be out of step in Cheney, Washington (Chay-ny)." (because I mentioned that most people mispronounce Dick Cheney's name, too.

It was Dick Cheney himself who said (on Larry King or one of those interview shows) that HIS family name is pronounced "Cheeney." This has nothing to do with how any other town or family name "Cheney" is pronounced.

Genie

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 05 Oct 01 - 06:46 PM

But of course Captain Marvel had a more acceptable variant of it for turning himself into a superhero. Shazam!

I used to really wish it worked.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: SharonA
Date: 05 Oct 01 - 06:22 PM

Kevin: I promise I will never call you... that nickname you don't want me to call you.

(Ha! I'll bet you thought I was going to type the nickname and break my promise while I was making it, but nooooooo!)

BTW, I meant what I said about using the term "woman" loosely (I'm not sure if she is a female human or a succubus)!

Anyway, thanks for promising not to call me... that nickname I don't want to be called (and WON'T answer to).

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: katlaughing
Date: 05 Oct 01 - 06:18 PM

My brother has a quirk that way, too. He insists on calling Bette Midler, "Betty," maybe because that is our sister's name, but I think he has a block against "Bette."

My youngest's name is Jerusha, most people who skim over it wind up calling her "Joshua," and, there was one neighbour who never did get it right and always called her "Da-roo-sha."

I also had a neighbour who couldn't get my cat's name, Heyokah" right; he kept calling him "Kay-oh-kah."

I think Bill's right, people say what they want to hear or think they see.

Back up there someone said Caitlyn was pronounced incorrectly in the US. Is it correct then for it to sound close to Kathleen? I've taken to spelling it Kat'leen, in hopes that people will not automatically shorten it to Kath or Kathy, both of which I detest, for myself, at least.

justkat

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 05 Oct 01 - 06:10 PM

In England these days Kevin comes in for the same kind of stick as Sharon. I promise, I won't call you Shaz, and you don't call me Kev. (Even though I answer to it as well.)

Using the term lady loosely, that I understand. Using the term woman loosely...well, that's something else.

My brother was a terrible one for mispronouncing names. For example he would always refer to Bob Dylan as Bob Digh-lan. I used to think he was just doing it to annoy, but eventually I decided he had his brain wired up that way. He had to pronounce the words the way he thought the spelling indicated. No matter how many times he was corrected, it just didn't register.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: GUEST,petr
Date: 05 Oct 01 - 05:55 PM

Ive alway heard it rhyming with COLON which is appropriate as he is he is part of of the DICK BUSH and COLON team.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Bill D
Date: 05 Oct 01 - 05:40 PM

Mariner....most people hear what they want to hear, and they do NOT want new sounds or names or spellings to deal with....Many names in the USA are a result of the clerks on Ellis Island wriing down what they thought they heard...and re-naming whole families

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: SharonA
Date: 05 Oct 01 - 05:16 PM

McGrath: Arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrgh. The man I was with for 13 years left me for another Sharon he nicknamed "Shaz" (no, Murray, it's not just an Essex-ism; this woman [and I use the term loosely] is from Pennsylvania, too). So NOBODY had better call me "Shaz" and expect me to respond sweetly.

I have been called "Sherry", though, mostly by my family. My cousin Cheryl was nicknamed "Sherry", too, which caused no end of confusion. And "Shar" is quite popular (again with either a long 'a' or short 'a', depending on the speaker's proximity to or distance from Philadelphia!).

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: MARINER
Date: 05 Oct 01 - 04:11 PM

BillD. There must be something about names beginning with Darr. My eldest boy's name is Darragh( Darra) but enevitably he's called Darren, which pees' him off no end.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Gypsy
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 09:49 PM

Pity the poor bugger! The one time i called a Collin, COLON, he stiffy reminded me that he was not a lower body part! Kinda like there is no "ear" as in "fear" in McPherson. Of course, we have our own coloquialisms here, to torture tourist with. Pronounce Cafe Beaujolais as Bow ja lais. Can always tell the outsiders, cuz they say it right. :>)

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Bill D
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 08:08 PM

*grin*...perhaps, Murray...or a couple of truck drivers from Alabama discoursing on life, love and fishin' holes.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 07:20 PM

many folks 'wear' their accents and colloquialisms like a badge,

You must be thinking of an evening spent drinking with a bunch of expatriate Scotsmen, Bill.

Murray

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Bill D
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 06:33 PM

ummm,,,I guess I got carried away there and drifted off the exact topic...but this IS The Mudcat

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Bill D
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 06:32 PM

I can understand people grasping at straws for pronunciation if they have only seen a name/word in print...but when you stare into their eyes and TELL them exactly how it should be....and they stare back with a look that says.."I am not going to made that weird noise...'we' don't talk like that"....*sigh*

My son's name is "Darriel"...(yes, from the Darkover novels, if you remember minor characters)...and we have one friend who will NOT say it...it is forever "Darryl"...it seems that the sounds we make when we speak are somehow VERY intimately connected with our persona and our ego, and many folks 'wear' their accents and colloquialisms like a badge, so that they are somehow offended by 'other' pronunciations.

(*grin*...some may know the group "The Boarding Party" who made several records of shanties....I can barely keep from giggling when I hear the name pronounced by one friend from a small town in New England...it simply comes out "The Bawding Potty"...)...yes, I know, the 'R' and 'L' are a variable couple of letters in English....still...)

.....and who remembers Senator Howell Heflin?...probably the most incomprehensible southern accent ever foisted on us! ...ahhh..the varieties of 'Colin' pale .......

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 06:18 PM

I think "Shaz" is strictly for Essex girls, Kevin.

Murray

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 06:04 PM

Or "Shaz"?

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Snuffy
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 06:03 PM

My wife's name is Marie, but in her family it's always been pronounced 'marry' down the generations. She will answer to Mah-ree, but she's definitely not M'ree.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: SharonA
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 05:43 PM

Then there's NBC's "Late Night" host Conan O'Brien... should it be "Coh-nun" or "Coh-nan (with a short 'a' as in 'nanny')"?

And what about the Americanization of the word "aunt" (pronounced "ant" by many, including myself)? (I think it would've annoyed my spinster Aunt Alice if I'd called her "ahnt"!)

As to my own name, half the people I know pronounce "Sharon" with a short 'a', the other half with a long 'a'. I'll answer to either (eether? ayther?), but I prefer the long 'a' since that's the way my family pronounces it.

Of course, since the '70s, a lot of people have called me "Sharona"....

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 05:08 PM

I can't see where people get off saying that some way people choose to pronounce their name is affected, and some other way isn't. Names change, because you get used to accepting the way that people around you insist on pronouncing your name, and Americans seem pretty keen on pronuncing names the way they look like they should be from the spelling - as in Wagner, pronounced Wagg-ner instead of Vahg-ner.

But actually I think that, if you propnounce Colin in the Cawlin way, (as against the English Collin way of saying it), but do it in a Jamaican accent, you get something pretty close to Kohlin.

I'm constantly having my name mispronounced, and I'll answer to either version. Swearing under my breath when I spell it out and some shop assistant says "Oh, you mean McGrath" (pronouncing it with the "th" sounded, the way I don't.)

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: MARINER
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 04:13 PM

Between them ,the Americans and the Ausies have also managed to mess up and old Gaelic name also. I refer to Caitlin (Kathleen) which they all pronounce as Kate-lyn. The sad thing is that due to various soaps from both those lands their pronounciation has slipped into use over here too.Mind you, if you take in some of the first names found in Jerry Springer land, Koalin and Kate-lyn are fairly harmless. Also in Wales, I have never heard Megan called Maygan, another popular U.S. mispronouncian seeping into common usage in the U.K.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: catspaw49
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 12:43 PM

Amazing the stuff you learn here. I always thought it was "ja-Blon-ski".....Shows what I know...........

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: katlaughing
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 10:14 AM

That's 'cause there's only one way to pronounce "troll" er...no wait, it could be "troe-ull" or even tro-ill" oh shoot, now don't you wanna know?!!**BG**

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Troll
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 10:10 AM

What I can't understand is why the H... anybody cares!

troll

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: katlaughing
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 09:41 AM

I'd never hear of Kirstie being a nickname for Christine. I found it in a name book and also in a novel I read before our Kyrsten (she changed the spelling) was born and liked it so... but it's always been Kearstun to us, but Ker-stun to other Americans, until Kirstie Alley became famous and Kirsten Dunst, then people became more knowledgeable about the way we pronounce it.

I've heard the Coal-in in some shows on BBC, but it doesn't sound the same as how COH-lin Powell is pronounced over here. To me, it sounds softer and I can still hear the Caw-lin. I can speak it that way, wiht a close approximation of the accent, but can't seem to get across in the written word. Hope that makes sense.

Thanks for all the comments on Kirstie, too!

kat

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Snuffy
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 09:12 AM

Doesn't McColl pronounce it Coalin in his song calling the clans together? (Little wot ye wha's comin'). And he also says Doh-nald and Roh-nald.

But I've never heard anyone else in Britain pronounce it like that.

Wassail! V

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 08:26 AM

and what about poor old Shawn Bawn! Or is it Seen Been..;-)

Dayve the nohm

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Gervase
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 08:20 AM

Then there's the Powell bit. In the UK we have two politicos - brothers who have gone to different ends of the political spectrum - called Powell.
Charles, a former flack to Attila the Hen, pronounces his name "Pole". His brother Jonathan, an aide to the Vicar of St Albion's, sticks with "Pow-ell".
But names is odd things, as I should know!

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Scabby Douglas
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 07:47 AM

Hmm... I think that to continue this conversation profitably we'd need to to use the linguistic symbols..

When I write "kurstee" as a pronunciation note - I mean the "u" to be like the "u" in mud, bud, dud, that is: short "u" - not "meurd" meud, mood ANd as for "kearstie" being standard scots pronunciation - I can only assure you that we don't hear it that way, altho' maybe that's what you hear when we speak.

This is fun in't it? Or not as the case may be

Cheers

Steven

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Grab
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 07:36 AM

Kat, "Kear-stie" is Scots pronunciation. "Kur-stie" is English. But in Britain you could expect to be called whichever, depending on what part of the country you're in at the time.

Now my name's fun - I've yet to find a European nationality apart from Brits that can pronounce it properly. :-) Grar-Ham, Gra-Ham, Gram, Graam - not a one that can say it Gray-am.

Graham.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Scabby Douglas
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 06:56 AM

That "Kurstee" pronunciation is due to the tendency to make an "uh" sound of short "i" - so "milk" becomes "mulk" and so on..

I'd have said that's a West Coast/Central Belt tendency though. My mother used to go mad if we said "mulk", and used to insist we said "th-ih-rty" and not "thur'y"

The linguistics of accents are interesting.

A lecturer (in linguistics) told me that "pearl" as pronounced by a Scot from Edinburgh was almost indistinguishable from "petal" as pronounced by US speaker ( I forgot where specifically he said in US, and can't be bothered making it up).

Cheers (pronounced "tsheerz")

Steven

pronounced "steee-vn"

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 06:35 AM

Kat, I have always heard "Kur-stee" in Scotland. An abbreviation of "Christine", I believe ?

Murray

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: katlaughing
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 02:02 AM

Bert! LMAO, we true Coloradoans pronounce it Caw-lah-ra (as in rat)-dah (if of my dad's generation and rangeland background) or Caw-lah-ra-doe, at least on the Western Slope. They do talk funny on the Eastern Slope.:-)

Oh and we are Caw-lah-ra-duns, not doe-uns. **BG**

It reminds of a time I was bartending in a local pizza parlour up here in Wyoming and some oil field roughneck came in and asked me for a "Curs" beer. I had to ask him to repeat it before I realised he meant "Coo-ers." Growing up in Coors country, I'd never hear it pronounced like a mangy dog.

So, who can tell me which way Kirstie is pronounced in Scotland? I have heard "Kear-stee" which is what we call our oldest daughter, but we had the devil of a time getting people to say it that way, instead of "Kur-stee."

Thanks,

kat

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Liam's Brother
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 01:34 AM

His parents were Jamaican which indicates that the British pronounciation was what his family intended.

He was brought up in the Bronx, however, which indicates that everyone (every non-Jamaican everyone) in the neighborhood and at school would've called him Coe-lin.

He was a black from NYC in the U.S. military which indicates that that he would've answered to virtually anything. (I got Mile-ner most of the time I was in the Air Force.)

I think that's it. The name of Coe-lin just stuck. I'm sure Blair and Powell talked about it for 30 to 90 seconds and then moved on to more pressing matters.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Bert
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 01:34 AM

When I was in Colorado I never quite got used to people pronouncing O as U. It wasn't too bad when the radio announcers talked about 'The Culuradu Ruckies', but when they announced a program about 'Professional Sucker' I wasn't sure what to expect.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: GUEST,ponytrax
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 01:24 AM

Jeez. I was born & raised near San Jose, (San Hose Ay), california; my mom's from Los Angeles (Loss Angle Ease) and I had this neighbor in the 1950s named Colin Powell(Cull In Powl)

I've heard somebody else say that the pronunciation (Loss Angle Ease) sounds affected--to me it sounds like my Grammy and how I tell someone's not a new transplant, but probably graduated from highschool in California before 1955.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Metchosin
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 01:24 AM

Dicho, then again, my relatives from Saskatchewan, pronounce "calm" to rhyme with "helm" and somehow the word "delux" sounds like "the flukes".......and there seems to be a lot of men with the first name Lynn there as well, but maybe that's just a family aberration.

I've never heard Colin pronounced with a long O on the west coast of Canada.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: GUEST,Boab
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 12:58 AM

And hey, Sophocleese; does the name "Boab" seem affected to you? The spelling is B-o-b. Again, where I was brought up, I was absolutely invariably "Boab"!

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: GUEST,Boab
Date: 04 Oct 01 - 12:54 AM

I told a tale recently on mudcat about a party across the dtreet and our frantic improvisation in getting a barrel of beer to give up its contents. Our host's name was Colin ---aye, "Koh-lin" It seems to depend on just where in Scotland you were raised; I never once ran into a "Caw-lin".

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 03 Oct 01 - 11:03 PM

The composer Ralph Vaughn-Williams, pronounced Rafe. John in Hull, is this a Welsh idiosyncrasy? Sophocleese, well here in Canada (Alberta and Saskatchewan, the important parts) Colin is nearly always Coal-in except for new American expatriates a'workin for the oil companies.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: sophocleese
Date: 03 Oct 01 - 10:10 PM

Well here in Canada (a cultural oasis sitting now here and now there between the two cultures) anybody I've known with the name has alway pronounced it Caw-lin. Coh-lin seems affected to me, sort of like holding your pinky at an angle when drinking tea which isn't really classy but only thinks it is, but I don't know an awful lot about vowels in other dialects or regions.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 03 Oct 01 - 09:18 PM

Actually, I don't drink, John. I do make typos however :-)

Interesting to read all the input so far. It would appear that KOH-lin is not a universal American usage.

My recollection, as I said in the first post is that Powell was referred to as "Collin" by the media in the early nineties, I am sure I would have noticed otherwise.

But, my memory MAY be playing tricks.

Murray

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 03 Oct 01 - 09:08 PM

You been at the whisky Murray? It's JOHN. :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: katlaughing
Date: 03 Oct 01 - 09:07 PM

My son, Colin, born in the USA, is called Cawl-lin, as that is the way I'd heard it always pronounced, as though it was spelled "Collin." I named him that for our Scottish and Irish ancestry.

I despise that Powell has his pronounded the way he does. It is asinine, IMO.

kat

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 03 Oct 01 - 08:58 PM

Johm, necause he's a rover, and seldom sober. (Joke which might not be understood by anybody outside of Kirkcaldy)

Actually, I think he pronounces his name "Raif" ....

Murray

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 03 Oct 01 - 08:48 PM

Reminds me of the actor Ralph Fiennes, his name gets pronounced Raith. I am not sure why.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 03 Oct 01 - 08:44 PM

Guest Genie, you would be out of step in Cheney, Washington (Chay-ny). I once had a coll-ie dog, but in Dog Heaven it probably is Coal-ie.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: GUEST,Genie
Date: 03 Oct 01 - 08:31 PM

From the interview I heard, I got the impression that he was given the short-A pronunciation at birth and would actually prefer it, but he is resigned to its having been transformed into the long-A version.

It's kind of like our Veep, Dick "Cheeney," who has gotten used to being called "Chayney," because the mispronunciation is so widespread.

Genie

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: CarolC
Date: 03 Oct 01 - 08:17 PM

Powell's parents were immigrants to the US from an island nation. I'm not sure which one, but I think it had a British cultural tendency. My understanding is that his parents were more British, culturally, than they were American. And they gave him the British pronounciation when he was born.

I don't know what the origins of the other fellow's pronounciation, the one that Powell now uses, were.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Bert
Date: 03 Oct 01 - 08:14 PM

McGrath, I think it's just American, having heard the name Ian pronounced Ion.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 03 Oct 01 - 08:12 PM

I'ver heard it being said as Colon Bowel, which at least is consistent.

What I'm not clear is whether this an individual family idiosyncracy, or is that the normal way Americans pronounce the name? I imagine they might start doing so now, but up till now have they?

I don't think anybody this side of the Atlantic has ever pronounced it that way, except in relation to the General.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: CarolC
Date: 03 Oct 01 - 08:03 PM

...or maybe it was MSNBC. And if I remember correctly, the last name of the other guy was the same as the name of the street that the Powell family lived on. That seemed to have something to do with it along with the fact that young Colin seemed to be fascinated with all things military.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: CarolC
Date: 03 Oct 01 - 07:55 PM

He was given the "Collin" pronounciation at birth, but because of some events during his childhood, the pronounciaton of "COL-in" that was used by someone who had become notable during WWII got applied to him by the people in his neighborhood, and it stuck. I can't remember the last name of the other guy.

Anyway, that's what I heard in a biography about him on CNN recently.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Bert
Date: 03 Oct 01 - 07:47 PM

Yeah the American pronunciation is quite amusing. In England it was 'o' as in dog and 'i' as in tin. In America the poor guy goes by the name of Colon.

Subject: RE: BS: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: harpgirl
Date: 03 Oct 01 - 07:42 PM

...hi murray...my grandad's name was Colin and we called him "Coal Lin". I thought that was an English pronounciation. But he was so self-deprecating, he could have wanted it another way but never said anything. hg

Subject: Pronunciation of 'Colin'
From: Murray MacLeod
Date: 03 Oct 01 - 07:35 PM

The thing that puzzles me most about this current crisis is how Colin Powell has morphed into "KOH-lin" Powell. I have seen him on TV on and off ever since the Gulf War and I could swear that years ago his first name used to be "COLLIN", just like half the boys I grew up with in Scotland. (The other half were all called Angus)

So can somebody shed some light on the matter? Is this the current hip American pronunciation? I used to think it was affectation on the part of the American media, but even Tony Blair calls him "KOH-lin". What do YOU call the Colin in your life ?

Murray