psychology of flamers.

Subject: psychology of flamers.
From: little john cameron
Date: 10 Feb 02 - 04:24 PM

This is a very interesting subject.For a long time i have wondered why someone would take the time to deliberately annoy others.There is quite a bit of study being done on this and others aspects of aberrant behaviour.
Obviously this is not restricted to "Guests",Supposedly genuine posts are attempts to undermine the site also.A few other sites i am on delete insulting and derogatery posts with no explanation.
However,i digress!ljcclick

Subject: RE: psychology of flamers.
From: GUEST,SlickerBill
Date: 10 Feb 02 - 04:29 PM

Flamers are assholes. Really, what you're talking about is the psychology of assholes, aren't you? SB

Subject: RE: psychology of flamers.
From: wysiwyg
Date: 10 Feb 02 - 04:30 PM

Could we please JUST MOVE ON?????

~S~

Subject: RE: psychology of flamers.
From: GUEST,THOSE people
Date: 10 Feb 02 - 04:40 PM

And can't we all just get along?

Subject: RE: psychology of flamers.
From: 53
Date: 10 Feb 02 - 04:49 PM

I won't comment.

Subject: RE: psychology of flamers.
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Feb 02 - 04:57 PM

little john cameron,

this is a very interesting and important question.

i'm not an expert, but there are a good number of reasons.

my own reasons stem from a combination of a 'superiority complex' (regarding both folk and computers), and an annoyance at how stupid some posters are here...

...not intellectually stupid, but too busy wanting to make their 'point' without having read the thread.

Messages, such as the above: Flamers are assholes don't help either

I get annoyed, and I lash out.

Subject: RE: psychology of flamers.
From: little john cameron
Date: 10 Feb 02 - 07:04 PM

No,i disagree that flamers are assholes.There is,IMO, a direct connection with psychopathic behaviour.The vast majority of psychopaths are harmless as they are fortunately not in a position of power.They are usually highly intelligent and under the right circumstances can rise to important positions.
Flamers on the other hand would seem to be,like psychopaths,lacking a conscience among other psychological aberrations.Posting annoying and divisive messages give them a feeling of power.
The advent of the internet has allowed this side of their personality to manifest itself without fear of repercussions.As i said before this is a new phenomenon,prior to the internet the only other outlet would be letters to the editor or so called poison pen letters,both of which can be traced.Internet messages also can be traced but it is not worth the bother unless they are dangerous or subversive.
O,what a tangled web we weave etc. ljc

Subject: RE: psychology of flamers.
From: harpgirl
Date: 10 Feb 02 - 07:13 PM

...well, ljc...I found your links most interesting and I have bookmarked them for complete reading. Thanks. I do disagree with your assertion that the vast majority of psychopaths are harmless. Antisocial behavior (my own or my friends, as well as that of others unknown to me) always causes harm to others. Sometimes the harm is a small amount of embarrassment. But when a person is truly and obviously all antisocial, their lives will reflect a littered path of human destruction it's just that the powerful ones get more press...

hg

Subject: RE: psychology of flamers.
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Feb 02 - 07:14 PM

the "feeling of power" certainly may have something to do with it.

boredom combined with drunkeness are the main reason for my flames.

Subject: RE: psychology of flamers.
From: little john cameron
Date: 10 Feb 02 - 07:29 PM

Harpgirl,i think you are getting confused between a psychopath and a sociopath.
Here is an except from an acricle by Robert Canup

Most people have heard of Ted Bundy; the serial killer who was executed in Florida several years ago. Not many people are aware of the fact that Bundy was studying to become a prosecutor, and that eventually he hoped to become a judge. Those that do know that fact see it as some strangely ironic twist - an inexplicable quirk in Bundy's bizarre makeup. It never seems to occur to most people that the perfect place for a psychopathic serial killer to hide in society is as a prosecutor or a judge; but I assure you that it occurs to the Psychopaths of the world. I would estimate that about 10% of the prosecutors and judges in the United States are in fact, S.A.Ps. The ONLY difference between them and Ted Bundy is that they were able to control outward signs of their Psychopathy until they achieved their goal of being in a position of authority.

Now,regarding our guest.Chances are if this thread continues and he/she is ignored then he/she will become more and more frustrated as the ball is in our park. ljc

Subject: RE: psychology of flamers.
From: Bill D
Date: 10 Feb 02 - 07:57 PM

"the "feeling of power" certainly may have something to do with it.

boredom combined with drunkeness are the main reason for my flames."

well, at last SOME explanation...sad, but no reason Mudcat should suffer for the amusement of a bored drunk.

Subject: RE: psychology of flamers.
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Feb 02 - 08:02 PM

Bill,

Agreed it is sad, and there's no excuse.

Why should Mudcat suffer? It shouldn't but it's a damn easy target, and given the above, easy targets are the ones most likely to be shot at...

Not proud, but at least I'm honest

Subject: RE: psychology of flamers.
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 10 Feb 02 - 08:11 PM

Getting drunk and sitting down in front of a computer to write anonymous insults... That is a indeed a sad way of being drunk.

I can envisage getting drunk and picking a quarrel with someone via the net, and writing things I'd regret later. But a quarrel has to be you-and-someone-else. An anonymous quarrel? That just doesn't make sense to me. It is analogous to poison pen letters, pathology rather than communication.

Subject: RE: psychology of flamers.
From: Bill D
Date: 10 Feb 02 - 08:14 PM

them terrorists were 'honest' about their hate for America, too....some how my sympathies are not aroused...

Subject: RE: psychology of flamers.
From: Mickey191
Date: 10 Feb 02 - 08:43 PM

I think they are dispicable people who have no social life, who because of their demeanor, turn people away. They are the same faceless people who seek to torment others with hang-up phone calls. I don't think they will stop their shenanigans here, just as my hang-up caller has continued for 8 yrs. What would they replace it with? It's too late for them to get a life.

Subject: RE: psychology of flamers.
From: little john cameron
Date: 10 Feb 02 - 09:51 PM

Diane Wilson speaks from her soapbox:

As someone in another newsgroup said, it's troll season.

For what it's worth......

We have two people here (at the moment, anyway) who have certain basic troll characteristics:

They are unable or unwilling to take responsibility for their words or behavior.

They are unable or unwilling to consider the possibility that they have brought a great deal of dislike upon themselves.

I don't know for certain, but my feeling is that each of them is filled with self-hate, and is unable to face that issue.

OK.
I've dealt with self-haters before, and this is what you can expect:

The only thing they can do with their venom is to flush it out on other people. As a result, everything they say about you is a reflection of their feelings about themselves.

Because of their self-hate, there is nothing that you can say that is as bad as what they see in themselves. You can't hurt them, no matter how hard you try.

The only thing that relieves their self-hate is to see other people in pain. If you let them get to you, that only encourages them. That's why they're here in the first place.

The point is that flaming them hurts you more than it hurts them.

What makes it worse--been here, seen this before, too--is that these trolls are insiders. Yes, they hurt, they're depressed, they are at least as far down as any of us. What that means is that they know all the right buttons to push to make us angry. They have no conscience that prevents them from pushing those buttons.

That is the difference between them and us. They have turned abusive. Yes, that does make a difference. I've encountered some recovering abusers on the net, and I learned a few things from that experience. The one thing that sustains an abuser is denial; an abuser cannot allow hirself to be open to the slightest possibility that sie is harming another human being. They blame anyone and anything else in sight, but virtually all of that blame is directed at the victim, in one way or another. Abusers REFUSE to take responsibility for their behavior.

In dealing with an abuser, particularly from a treatment perspective, the first and most important step is to break that denial. It is not only breaking the denial about hurting other people. It is essential to break the denial that they are not responsible for their behavior. They must learn that they have to take responsibility for everything that they do, and it is a hard lesson to teach.

Until an abuser's denial is broken, it is dangerous to give them any sympathy. Sympathy gives them a way out, a way to avoid taking responsibility. Someone else made them the way they are; they're not responsible. This is utter garbage, and to give them this opening is truly a disservice.

So.

They are here to feed on our pain. We don't have to give them that satisfaction.
They stay only as long as we feed them well. If we want them to go, all we have to do is to stop feeding them.
The solution for trolls is in two parts. First, recognize and understand that they are here to hurt us. They way that they hurt us is to beat on us with their own rage. Recognize that everything they say about us is a reflection of their own self-hate. Even when they hit our triggers, it is their rage, their self-hatred that they are giving us. We don't have to let ourselves be hurt by the fact that they hate themselves. We don't have to accept that. We can let them drown in their self-hate, simply by ignoring them.

And that is the second part. If you want a troll to go away, ignore hir. When no one responds to them, they are left with their own venom. That is the last thing that a troll wants to have to deal with.

Let us build an ASD zoo. Let us build cages, and put the appropriate names on those cages. Then let us put a sign in front of those cages:

DO NOT FEED THE ANIMALS.

Then, most importantly, let us not feed the animals. Killfile or ignore them, but do not respond to them, and do not accept their pain as your own.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Subject: RE: psychology of flamers.
From: harpgirl
Date: 10 Feb 02 - 10:16 PM

ljc, you sound thoroughly confused about psychopathy and sociopathy. How can that be? Read your statements again.

Subject: RE: psychology of flamers.
From: little john cameron
Date: 10 Feb 02 - 10:45 PM

Harpgirl,ye're richt ah got a bit mixed up.That's whit happens when ah write in mah second language.Sorry aboot that,bit the rest is kosher.<.br>Ah think,therefore,ah am,ah think.ljc

Subject: RE: psychology of flamers.
From: mack/misophist
Date: 11 Feb 02 - 05:55 PM

Some little boys used to ring door bells and run away. When they grew up they stopped doing that...until computers were invented.